Yesterday channel at 21.00

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

At 21.00 tonight there is a the start of a new series called smoke & Steam.

The listing in my tv mag says it will examine engineering marvels across the world.

Freeview 27. Freesat 159. Sky155. Virgin 129.

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

New program

[Mike HurleyParticipant @mikehurley60381]

Am recording it – interesting to see how it goes. Even if it's just a re-hash of numerous things i've seen before it's got to be miles better than most of the 'reality / celebrity / quiz show' twaddle that's on most of the time.

I'm currently enjoying a few odd episodes of good old Fred Dibnah on BBC4 and the Drama channel – I've seen them several times before, but still find them enjoyable.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I miss the Mark Williams ones and I hope they return on FV at some point

I've caught a couple of quite interesting ones around midnight on bbc4 concerning medieval wrought iron work etc which were worth a watch

We're currently clinging to Downton Abbey when things are bad…

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

watched last night,not impressed,with the content or the presenters.

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Watched on UKTV play, sound quality awful, content not bad

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

Watched it last night, not overly impressed so hope it improves next week.

 

Edited By V8Eng on 15/02/2022 10:59:36

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Mike Hurley on 15/02/2022 09:58:51:

…

I'm currently enjoying a few odd episodes of good old Fred Dibnah on BBC4 and the Drama channel – I've seen them several times before, but still find them enjoyable.

Fred is great value, but he is a bit of a bodger!

• Mending a traction engine assembly mistake by boring out a steam port
• Demolishing a large brick water tower by removing a corner and supporting it temporarily on wooden props, which are later burnt out causing a collapse. OK with that, but Fred:
  • Uses old tyres to reinforce the fire, resulting in an unplanned visit from the Fire Brigade
  • Allows boys to ride around the tower on bikes, and bystanders to wander the site. (the single policeman present isn't bothered either!)
  • Concerned the collapse isn't going fast enough, climbs rubble to inspect the far corner for cracks, and then has to run away when tower disintegrates.

I wonder who provided Fred's Motor Insurance?

Despite appearances, I'm not aware Fred ever had or caused an industrial accident?

Dave

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

I seem to remember Fred's personal health and safety protocol consisted of running away very quickly whilst sounding a klaxon and shouting "It's goin', it's goin'."

The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there.

[A SmithParticipant @asmith78105]

When a part of the old Plymouth power station was demolished, about 30 years ago, a very large exclusion are was established. When the explosives were detonated, the local Postmaster, well beyond the barrier, was hit in the back of the head with a clod of earth and stone. Killed the poor chap outright. Would he have been killed if Fred had had the job?

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

With no TV I cannot judge what's being broadcast now but I recall watching the original Dibnah series on my parents' TV. Looking back, I do wonder if some of it was him playing, unwittingly or willfully, to the camera!

The problem I did see coming in was a tendency to use presenters far more than the experts in the programmes' topics. This crept into Horizon, which seemed steadily taken over media-studies graduate producers frightened to show what they didn't understand- the science they were paid to report at a far better level than the plastic-hatted whizz-bangery of Tomorrow's World.

The typical gimmick, apart from merely talking heads to save filming what they were talking about, was the over-used cliche of fingers flashing around a computer keyboard.

One of the worst I recall was an edition of some magazine programme in which were narrated a painting, a stately home and Swiss predecessor of our Tornado project. The painting and house were described excellently by professional enthusiasts – academics in such art and architecture. The locomotive though, was obviously only "metal bashing" in the media world, so let's send some slip of a journalist clearly out of her church-fete depth, who tried valiantly to tell us of the construction of a new, and (to her, never-done-before), oil-fired, steam-train.

Have things improved, or am I better off staying a TV refusenik?

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

Posted by Bill Phinn on 15/02/2022 11:45:16:

I seem to remember Fred's personal health and safety protocol consisted of running away very quickly whilst sounding a klaxon and shouting "It's goin', it's goin'."

The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there.

I notice frequently warnings are shown on screen about the language and attitudes prevalent in older programmes, perhaps Fred will become a victim of that soon.

I found most of his series entertaining and amusing.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Fred Dibnah, was a unique man, he may have been labelled a bodger but he was successful at it, love watching his documentaries when they appear on tv. Dave W

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

Posted by Nigel Graham 2 on 15/02/2022 12:06:24:

With no TV I cannot judge what's being broadcast now but I recall watching the original Dibnah series on my parents' TV. Looking back, I do wonder if some of it was him playing, unwittingly or willfully, to the camera!

Anyone who's prepared to do what Fred is doing here at 4 minutes in can play to the camera as much as he likes, as far as I'm concerned.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Nigel Graham 2 on 15/02/2022 12:06:24:…

Have things improved, or am I better off staying a TV refusenik?

Refusing to watch TV risks missing lots of good stuff and losing touch with the real world unless counterbalanced by careful reading.

Unfortunately, finding good stuff on telly isn't easy.

• Freeview gives me about 80 different channels, but they are packed with repeats and cheap to make programmes. The general cheapening of broadcast TV is because too many channels are chasing too little advertising revenue. The number of 2nd rate programmes on the air tends to camouflage better programmes. The young folk in my family do better than me because they exchange finds on social media: I'm left searching the schedules in hopeful ignorance. Removing the BBC Licence fee will destroy a major source of new quality programming. Coupled with falling advertising, I think Freeview is doomed in the long run. The traditional way of delivering television is breaking down.
• Alternative is TV downloaded from the internet. The concentration of 'good stuff' is much higher because programmes are funded by subscription. There is a lot of 'free' stuff available too. The way streaming services are bought and accessed is completely different from Broadcast TV and I find it somewhat complicated. Choosing providers and searching for programmes requires a certain level of computer literacy. It's not like buying the Radio Times in 1995 and discovering a new fifth UK channel has arrived: streaming services are international. I enjoyed 'Squid Game' from Korea and Spain's 'Money Heist'. Although you don't have to search schedules it's still not easy to find things! Or at least I've not cracked it yet!

Technical programmes are a problem because Engineers are a tiny audience. Even 12 year old media graduates know programmes have to have mass appeal, and what we consider important is nerdy nonsense to most viewers! When grown men ride tiny steam trains round a track, I find massive interest in the engineering, skill, historic verisimilitude and artistic qualities. Others see a toy train and suspect the adenoidal driver still lives with his mother.

Anyone else think 'Repair Shop' has improved? When I first watched it, it concentrated on the back-story, emotion, and good looking results, with chopped up incomplete shots of the actual work being done. Too often, they'd cut the bit I wanted to learn. Recent shows seem to have upped the technical content considerably, and I have picked up a few worthwhile techniques. Also, that some repairs are done for looks rather than strength and are unlikely to last.

Dave

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

I watched the program on catch-up and confess that I wasn't impressed, either by content or presentors. If the next one is no better then it will be the last.

[Mike HurleyParticipant @mikehurley60381]

Posted by Bill Phinn on 15/02/2022 13:11:55:

Posted by Nigel Graham 2 on 15/02/2022 12:06:24:

With no TV I cannot judge what's being broadcast now but I recall watching the original Dibnah series on my parents' TV. Looking back, I do wonder if some of it was him playing, unwittingly or willfully, to the camera!

Anyone who's prepared to do what Fred is doing here at 4 minutes in can play to the camera as much as he likes, as far as I'm concerned.

I had forgotten about that when I saw it again recently – it just beggars belief how anyone could have worked like that, even more terrifying when you realise these are just wooden ladders lashed together. For one not good with heights or ladders it genuinely made me feel ill! What a character!

[BazParticipant @baz89810]

For a programme entitled Smoke and Steam I didn’t see any of either, not impressed with it at all.

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Problem is with many 'Technical' programmes is the audience that watches them is far more savvy than the presenters on the subject they're spouting about. Alternative is to put Joe public on to talk about his specialist subject but unfortunately many come across as legends in their own lunchboxes. Many cringe worthy examples on "Secrets of the transport museum". Echoes of 'My daughter bough me a Shakletons high chair'.

Only one that seemed to get away with it as a non ingineer from memory was James Burke and his qualifications were in English.

Regards Ian.

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

Haven't watched it 'cos I couldn't find it. My Sky Q box only shows a programme called "Smoke and STEEL".

I assume that's the one referred to?

John

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Posted by Mike Hurley on 16/02/2022 10:05:53:

Posted by Bill Phinn on 15/02/2022 13:11:55:

Posted by Nigel Graham 2 on 15/02/2022 12:06:24:

With no TV I cannot judge what's being broadcast now but I recall watching the original Dibnah series on my parents' TV. Looking back, I do wonder if some of it was him playing, unwittingly or willfully, to the camera!

Anyone who's prepared to do what Fred is doing here at 4 minutes in can play to the camera as much as he likes, as far as I'm concerned.

I had forgotten about that when I saw it again recently – it just beggars belief how anyone could have worked like that, even more terrifying when you realise these are just wooden ladders lashed together. For one not good with heights or ladders it genuinely made me feel ill! What a character!

Hi Mike, that one with the over hang, is one of Fred's I've always remembered. God only knows how he had the nerve to clime those ladders at the top to get over the over hangs, but I've often wondered how he got the ladders fixed to the over hangs. The long vertical clime up would have been bad enough for me and where I did work many years ago, there were a couple of vertical ladders going up about 20 Ft. or so, which was as much as I ever wanted to clime, especially when I would have to carry a few tools and a new bearing at the same time.

They had this silver smoke stack which was about 70Ft. high, that had to be inspected each year and the contractors that came to do it only had wooden ladders like Fred's, apparently they were preferred as you are less likely to have your feet slip or loose hand grip on them.

Regards Nick.

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

It's like wooden pit props. if the are going to fail you can hear them creak

Roy

[Roger BestParticipant @rogerbest89007]

SOD – I agree that repair shop has improved.

I think they have realised that the restorers are the stars; possibly because they are nice people with a mature outlook and a passion for perfection.

Not sure about the repairs that won't last – you must have something in mind. Some of jobs may have been questionable in the early days when they didn't have an expert but I have seen a good few specialists come in and they seem to use the traditionally best technique.

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