William Spence Loco for 7 1/4?

[Alain FooteParticipant @alainfoote90915]

[Alain FooteParticipant @alainfoote90915]

Two questions:-

Are there any more articles published in ME after 14th November 2014? If so, please advise years and dates.

Has anyone started building one to this series and what progress have they made?

Many thanks,

Alain Foote

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

I recall Mr Almond who started the series found he did not have room between the frames for parts needed, as he was building his. (or it may be someone else pointed out a major issue). I don't think there was anything further said about the locomotive in ME after that.

[WearyParticipant @weary]

Hello Mr Foote:

The last article on constructing this locomotive was published in ME as you state above, 14th November 2014. Here is a searchable index so that you can ensure that you have all the relevant parts available. You should note that there is a typo in the 'year of publication' given in the index, it should read 2014, not as 2004. The volume issues and page numbers are however correct – so far as I can see.

 

I think that you will find that there is plenty of room between the frames for the crank-shaft bearings, cylinders, valve-gear etc., after-all you have 270mm (10 1/2" approx.) width to play with! Depending on your exact valve-gear layout you may have to either marginally resize the boiler or drop it slightly. But, as the boiler in 4" to the foot scale (7 1/4" gauge) is going to be around 10" diameter you have some leeway In this too. The reason for publication ceasing was not as given in the response above.

 

If you intend to tackle this model it may be useful for you to know that I have had a set of frames cut by Model Engineers Laser for 3 1/2" gauge, 2" to the foot. I am sure that if you contacted Malcolm he could use my drawings which he has on file (somewhere!) to cut you another set 'doubled-up' in 5mm thick material. There are two drawings, left and right frame, the sole difference being that the right-hand frame has holes pierced for the reversing stand and lever. You should note however, that my frames do not follow Cliff Almonds drawing exactly. I redrew the frames completely, in so far as I could, 'to scale', however the relationship of the crankshaft bearing cut-out and cylinder location points remains as Cliff Almonds drawing, tho' I suggest that you check that – you will have to design your own valve-gear & 'works' etc., anyway. In any event, from memory, there is not enough information on Cliff Almonds drawings to actually draw or indeed cut the frames 'exactly'. As you know, the outside profile has some quite complex merging curves and my recollection in that amongst other things the radii of many of these are missing from Mr Almond's drawings. You should also note that I have all the rivet-holes cut out as per 'works drawings'. Different batches of locomotives had slightly different lay-outs and underwent further modifications, especially as regards the side-tanks.

I dare-say that Malcolm at Model Engineers Laser could possibly send you the dxf file or similar for you to look-at if you are serious, then you could see if it would serve your needs and/or adapt it to your specific requirements perhaps??

 

Regards,

Phil

 

 

Edited By Weary on 30/05/2019 21:57:39

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

Hi Phil,

Sorry if my comment about reason for ceasing publication was not correct. I was going from memory and a lot of data has trickled through the old brain since then.

Do you know the actual reason that publication ceased? I was interested in this locomotive and was rather frustrated when the articles stopped. Thanks for the link to the excellent index pages.

[WearyParticipant @weary]

Hello Mr Dayman,

I apologise if I came across as 'snippy' in my comment about the reason for publication ceasing part-way through the series. That was certainly not my intention, sometimes though brevity can sound like terseness, and, of course, the written word lacks the subtleties inherent in the spoken word.

I do know the reason that the series stopped, I was in contact with Cliff Almond at the time of publication. Whilst there is no 'big secret' it would not be helpful to anyone to relive the past. My understanding is that unfortunately Mr Almond never progressed significantly beyond the point where publication ceased so there is never likely to be a continuation …… unless a volunteer steps forward.

As you know there is enough basic information in the articles to set up the side-frames and the principal spacers, but beyond that 'you are on your own'. The 'separately sprung' chassis that carries the wheels is a bit of a 'puzzler' too, but a more conventional 'fixed' chassis could be fitted as so very little of it is visible under the side-skirts. I should have added to my posting above that 'my' drawings of the side-frames include holes for the prototypical 'separately sprung chassis' fixing/slides. There are a number of the locomotives still extant for reference, but as when running even the valve-gear and boiler-top drive are under covers one could adapt whatever one thought suitable if 'sheer grunt' rather than 'scale accuracy' was the preference. It would make a real brute of a loco in 7 1/4" gauge being a 'box' 1050mm long x 477mm wide x (approx.) 600mm high at that scale/gauge combination.

Perhaps you should 'bite the bullet' and have a go? Especially if you could perhaps work with Mr Foote, or of course anyone else interested, and thus share ideas. The whole thing can be built without castings and the boiler is a relatively simple marine type, though you could probably fit a round-top locomotive boiler albeit with a relatively shallow grate depth if that was your preference.  A bit of playing around with a very simple card-board mock-up might indicate possibilities more quickly than using a CAD package.   I only play with building my version 'on and off' (too many other projects!), and whilst I shall be getting some more parts laser-cut shortly these will not be directly scalable to 4" to the foot as 'my' distance between frames is rounded-up (1mm overall) to make arithmetic simpler in 'half-scale 2" to the foot'. Directly rescaling the 'between the frames parts' may (will!) affect the chassis dimensions and locations and furthermore the implications of this tiny difference are more significant than might appear superficially due to all the intersecting curves in these locomotives.

 

Regards,

Phil

Edited By Weary on 30/05/2019 22:56:36

Edited By Weary on 30/05/2019 23:07:08

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

Hi Phil,

No need to apologise at all. I stand corrected.

Well, one day I may well have a go at one of these locomotives, but there are many other projects ahead of it at the moment, so it will be years in the future if it does happen. Good luck to you and Mr Foote on your versions of this unique engine.

The experience with the articles stopping reinforces a personal rule of mine – never start a project from a series in a magazine until the series is complete! It has happened a few times.

[Alain FooteParticipant @alainfoote90915]

Thanks gents for the replies. Just to clarify I am not building the loco at present, but am considering it for my next project. I do have a friend who is building one in 7 1/4" to his own design. P.M. me if you require further info.

Alain

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