WHICH LATHE AS AN ALTERNATIVE TO A MYFORD PLEASE.

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

Having achieved reasonable results with my Unimat 3, I would like a larger lathe of a size similar to a Myford.

However. in view of the comments about the wisdom of buying a new one at £8000 I would appreciate some advice on the matter.

Happy to buy new or good used.

Manufacturer and model number would be helpful.

Thank you.

BB

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Boxfords are nice, Harrison, Colchester Bantam, Emco?

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

What do you want to do with it and do you have a separate mill?

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

This topic is likely to garner umpteen different suggestions reccomendations and quantities of different advice, as usual for a "What Lathe?" thread

So for what it is worth here's my input:
Buying 2nd hand is a bit fraught with danger: you need to see the lathe and know what you are looking at (or have someone with you who knows what they are looking at) You need probably to see it work. You need either all the spares or know that you can still get them. You might need to put in some work to get it running well. Another drawback with 2nd hand is they are often ex-industry so are 3phase motor which means either a new motor or a VFD or both. You could of course strike lucky and get a top-notch machine.

My preferred option would be a new Chinese machine. Something like my Warco WM 250. The latest version has VFD drive and power cross-feed. There are a lot of these about and most people seem happy with them. Just a little bigger than the Myford and comes with plenty of accessories. As your budget would run to it you could even have DRO's fitted. Wouldn't necessarily go with the stand a purpose made solid bench affords more storage and is likely to be more solid.

This model lathe is supplied by various vendors in the UK worthwhile finding something near you and visit a showroom or the next large ME exhibition, Doncaster is the next. Others will be along shortly with an alternative view…

John

[BazParticipant @baz89810]

If I had £8000 to spend I would happily buy a Myford.

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Instead of a new one at £8000 I bought a refurbished one for £3500 in part exchange for my old one.

regards Martin

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Billy

And how big is your space to put it in/how big a lathe do you need for your needs?

If you want new, I would look at the Arc Euro Sieg lathes, or Warco, particularly if you want bigger than the Arc offerings. The Warco gearhead (GH****) lathes are particularly versatile.

Secondhand, it is a matter of following all the usual sources, and wait for a bargain, they do come along.

Always buy a secondhand lathe on condition rather than price.

Two lathes sit in my workshop. I'm not suggesting this is what you may want, merely an example of what comes along if you are patient, and keep your eyes peeled.

The Myford 254S immediately below I paid just £1,450 for a few months back.

The Boxford 330 (330mm swing, 1000mm between centres) I paid just £2,200 for last year, it came out of a school that had not really used it, it just sat in the corner, and was pretty much as new.

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

Posted by JasonB on 20/02/2018 13:06:17:

What do you want to do with it and do you have a separate mill

Jason – Minnie size traction engine, portable, water cart etc is as much as I can physically manage so that is the model size.

I have my unimat mill /drill and lathe which I bought to see if I could get the hang of lathework etc .

So I had been thinking of the Myford lathe with the part you can do for milling.

Best put as simple projects using castings as opposed to buying blocks of metal and carving a cylinder out of it – more of a hobby type engineer as opposed to the Cherry Hinds type if that makes sense.

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Billy

If budget and space allows, I would always go for a separate milling machine rather than a milling attachment for a lathe – these frequently are a compromise.

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

David

Thanks reply and pictures and your advice.

Fortunately we have space.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Posted by David Standing 1 on 20/02/2018 13:39:17:

Billy

If budget and space allows, I would always go for a separate milling machine rather than a milling attachment for a lathe – these frequently are a compromise.

Would definitely second that. Combo machines or add-on vertical slides are not widely held in great esteem. If you have the space get the two machines the WM16B is a good contender for the Mll.

John

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Billy Bean on 20/02/2018 13:40:47:

David

Thanks reply and pictures and your advice.

Fortunately we have space.

Well new then, Myford size with a bit more capacity, I would put my money here:

**LINK**

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by Journeyman on 20/02/2018 13:22:36:

This topic is likely to garner umpteen different suggestions reccomendations and quantities of different advice, as usual for a "What Lathe?" thread

….

My preferred option would be a new Chinese machine. Something like my Warco WM 250. The latest version has VFD drive and power cross-feed. There are a lot of these about and most people seem happy with them. Just a little bigger than the Myford and comes with plenty of accessories. As your budget would run to it you could even have DRO's fitted. Wouldn't necessarily go with the stand a purpose made solid bench affords more storage and is likely to be more solid.

This model lathe is supplied by various vendors in the UK worthwhile finding something near you and visit a showroom or the next large ME exhibition, Doncaster is the next. Others will be along shortly with an alternative view…

John

 

+1 for the WM250V. Very happy with mine. With a vertical slide I also do a lot of milling and jig boring on smallish components for engine models. The stand I bought with it is also useful and has (IMO) very good storage.

Very much more capable than the Myford Speed 10 it replaced.

Edited By Mick B1 on 20/02/2018 14:05:15

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

I would've said either one of the warco or sieg machines on the medium range of scale. However, I don't think you're likely to find a machine with the same amount of character as a myford that inspired the loyalty following that It got.

I say this although I own a far eastern copy of what was originally designed in Germany, apparently. (Clarke cl430m).

Michael W

Edited By Michael-w on 20/02/2018 14:13:31

[Martin 100Participant @martin100]

You appear to want something bigger than your unimat but there a constraint at the 'size of a Myford' Is this because you don't have the space, or don't ever envisage needing the capacity or something else?

Buying 'new' at that scale of machine going on for nearly half a century after most of the UK machine tool sector abandoned this market means either the Myford or any one of a multitude of far eastern produced machines from £1000 upwards. Buying secondhand opens up hundreds of opportunities across dozens of brands including a secondhand Myford with lots of extras.

Would allocating some of those funds towards a larger workshop be money better spent? How about spending part of those funds on a milling machine, or a brazing hearth, or a TIG welder or a workbench or more tooling, or a DRO or better storage or all of them.

I think your best bet is to totally forget that budget, and really examine your requirements, what you really need now and might like to have in say 5 or 10 years time. The two may coincide.

Go to the suppliers be it Myford / Warco / Arc Euro etc or get to one of the model engineering shows and look at the machines. Even look on Ebay or the small ads here or or elsewhere online. Maybe go to one of the many secondhand machine tool suppliers. You might find spending a small fraction of that £8000 is all you need. £2000 spent with one of the usual suspects might give you everything and more.

But what someone here recommends might not be right for you.

Can £8000 of 'new' Myford produce a better result than £2000 of lathe X and £2000 of milling machine and £2000 of new workshop and £2000 of tooling?

This is an £11000 brand new far eastern manufacted lathe Big enough for many industrial scale jobs

This is an £8000 brand new EU manufactured lathe Small enough to hide in the corner of a very tiny shed

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Martin 100 on 20/02/2018 14:25:54:

You appear to want something bigger than your unimat but there a constraint at the 'size of a Myford' Is this because you don't have the space, or don't ever envisage needing the capacity or something else?

Buying 'new' at that scale of machine going on for nearly half a century after most of the UK machine tool sector abandoned this market means either the Myford or any one of a multitude of far eastern produced machines from £1000 upwards. Buying secondhand opens up hundreds of opportunities across dozens of brands including a secondhand Myford with lots of extras.

Would allocating some of those funds towards a larger workshop be money better spent? How about spending part of those funds on a milling machine, or a brazing hearth, or a TIG welder or a workbench or more tooling, or a DRO or better storage or all of them.

I think your best bet is to totally forget that budget, and really examine your requirements, what you really need now and might like to have in say 5 or 10 years time. The two may coincide.

Go to the suppliers be it Myford / Warco / Arc Euro etc or get to one of the model engineering shows and look at the machines. Even look on Ebay or the small ads here or or elsewhere online. Maybe go to one of the many secondhand machine tool suppliers. You might find spending a small fraction of that £8000 is all you need. £2000 spent with one of the usual suspects might give you everything and more.

But what someone here recommends might not be right for you.

Can £8000 of 'new' Myford produce a better result than £2000 of lathe X and £2000 of milling machine and £2000 of new workshop and £2000 of tooling?

This is an £11000 brand new far eastern manufacted lathe Big enough for many industrial scale jobs

This is an £8000 brand new EU manufactured lathe Small enough to hide in the corner of a very tiny shed

Martin

Size constraints?

Billy already stated 'Fortunately we have space'.

He also stated in another reply that his needs are dictated by physical size of what he will be engineering, not by his workshop space.

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

Thanks replies one and all

Minnie size wheel rims would be the largest turning job as anything bigger is a problem for me to lift.

My Unimat has been a good friend and got me started. so will be kept for small bits.

Warco seem to come across as good machines so at the moment I have the WM250V and the WM16B as the best solution.

BB

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Billy

Are you intending to carry out screw cutting?

If so, do a comparison between the WM250V and the GH550.

The GH550 gives you a similar footprint, includes a stand, 80mm more swing, bored 12mm greater through the spindle (38mm vs 26mm); plus a gearhead machine will always make screwcuttting easier, due to less faffing around changing changewheels.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Posted by David Standing 1 on 20/02/2018 15:44:27:

Billy

Are you intending to carry out screw cutting?

If so, do a comparison between the WM250V and the GH550.

The GH550 gives you a similar footprint, includes a stand, 80mm more swing, bored 12mm greater through the spindle (38mm vs 26mm); plus a gearhead machine will always make screwcuttting easier, due to less faffing around changing changewheels.

David, I'm not convinced that the GH550 has a screw-cutting (norton) gearbox. I think you still need to faff about with changewheels. The gears just give you fixed speed ranges (2 levers at the top) and reverse leadscrew (1 lever at the bottom) The next one up the range does have the screw-cuting function, the GH1236 but it is getting to be quite large.

John

Edit: add link

Edited By Journeyman on 20/02/2018 16:34:45

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Well I built my Minnie on a 200mm swing Emco and did most of the milling on that too with the aid of a Myford vertical slide so you could get away with a 210 Warco but I would suggest the 250 a sit has cross feed and inverter.

If you have your heart set on a Myford then Home & Workshop have a couple of nice looking late models around the £6k mark which would still leave you change for a mill and tooling for both.

Was it the whole model you will have a problem lifting or some of the parts? If it is the parts then going any larger than the Myford/250 means that you will be getting big chucks etc with the machine which can take a bit of lifting

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

Posted by David Standing 1 on 20/02/2018 15:44:27:

gearhead machine will always make screwcuttting easier, due to less faffing around changing changewheels.

I think, generally, a gearhead machine uses gears, rather than pulleys, to change the spindle speed. A Norton style gearbox replaces the changewheels.

Rod

[Billy BeanParticipant @billybean67480]

David – not screwcutting thanks, just plain turning.

Have taken what you said about having the lathe and the mill as two items.

That is basically what I have with my unimat set up – lathe at front and just turn 180 for mill / drill.

BB

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Journeyman on 20/02/2018 16:24:13:

Posted by David Standing 1 on 20/02/2018 15:44:27:

Billy

Are you intending to carry out screw cutting?

If so, do a comparison between the WM250V and the GH550.

The GH550 gives you a similar footprint, includes a stand, 80mm more swing, bored 12mm greater through the spindle (38mm vs 26mm); plus a gearhead machine will always make screwcuttting easier, due to less faffing around changing changewheels.

David, I'm not convinced that the GH550 has a screw-cutting (norton) gearbox. I think you still need to faff about with changewheels. The gears just give you fixed speed ranges (2 levers at the top) and reverse leadscrew (1 lever at the bottom) The next one up the range does have the screw-cuting function, the GH1236 but it is getting to be quite large.

John

Edit: add link

Edited By Journeyman on 20/02/2018 16:34:45

John

I think you are absolutely right, I didn't spot that. I don't normally do assumptions, but I did then, and assumed all the gearhead Warco's had full screwcutting gearboxes.

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Posted by Billy Bean on 20/02/2018 16:36:04:

David – not screwcutting thanks, just plain turning.

Have taken what you said about having the lathe and the mill as two items.

That is basically what I have with my unimat set up – lathe at front and just turn 180 for mill / drill.

BB

Billy

Noting the relevant size of the double wall socket to your Unimat, it is going to be a revelation to you, even if you only go up to a 7×19 sized lathe!

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