WHERE ARE THE SHAPER USERS ?

[PlasmaParticipant @plasma]

Latest shaper user in my workshop is a family of Robin's, rather the shaper in my garden.

Hopefully the most secure place to build a nest.

[Steve King 5Participant @steveking5]

Making some tee nuts on the shaper. This is my 1st shaper project.

[Jeff DaymanParticipant @jeffdayman43397]

Looks like a good fit Steve! well done.

Regarding your earlier post about finish changing as stroke gets longer – check also that the knee / table gibs are snug as well. Play in the knee / table will contribute to the finish during the stroke issue.

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

This advice may not be applicable to all types of machines…but on my three the vertical height gibbs get locked once the height has been adjusted. However, if the machine is getting a little worn, it might pay to adopt the following procedure.

First adjust the height to what you want. Next, adjust the table support at the front to bear on the slide. Now wind the table height adjustment down to put a little bit of load onto the table support. Then tighten up the gibb screws on the height adjustment to lock it in place. This ensures that the outer end of the table is positively supported rather than maybe having a bit of room to move up and down as the loads come on.

Many shapers do not have much provision for adjusting the Gibbs on the cross slide, so any wear here can be a bit of a problem to deal with. Not that I have ever needed to, mine all seem to be quite good, and since all of them would be well over fifty years old that is not too bad.

John

[Steve King 5Participant @steveking5]

Thanks lads some good advice for me as a beginner to follow. I'll keep you all updated on my progress and as I take on more challenging projects. Once iv become I little more confident and my skills improve I'll be making tool holder for my QCTP. Iv got a big old lump of cast iron to practice on. Oh I need to grind up a shear tool for finishing cuts. If any one can post some pictures of the shear tools you are using that would be great.

Thanks

Steve

Edited By Steve King 5 on 05/05/2019 11:33:36

[thaiguzziParticipant @thaiguzzi]

Posted by Steve King 5 on 05/05/2019 11:32:15:

Thanks lads some good advice for me as a beginner to follow. I'll keep you all updated on my progress and as I take on more challenging projects. Once iv become I little more confident and my skills improve I'll be making tool holder for my QCTP. Iv got a big old lump of cast iron to practice on. Oh I need to grind up a shear tool for finishing cuts. If any one can post some pictures of the shear tools you are using that would be great.

Thanks

Steve

Edited By Steve King 5 on 05/05/2019 11:33:36

Bit late to the playroom,

my shear tools are as shown in the American books and google images, with a curved face. Will try and get a pic up.

[Steve King 5Participant @steveking5]

Thanks that would be much appreciated.

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

Steve K5,

I assume that you have read Ian Bradley's book "The shaping machine"? I don't know whether it is still in copyright, so I'll only reproduce a snip of a drawing which appears in it, showing the general form of a finishng tool.

It's not very clear because it's from a larger file but you get the general idea. (Those figures are 20° and 5°. ) The full book is available in sections for download on the NEMES web site in the 'States:

Nemes book resources

http://neme-s.org/Shaper%20Books/The%20Shaping%20Machine/

It's up to you whether you download it or not, of course. Far be it for me to advocate piracy! I did and combined the sections into Word and pdf files.

It is a pretty comprehensive, if a little dated, book but it contains a lot of information that I found useful as a shaper novice.

John

[PlasmaParticipant @plasma]

I made a finishing tool and it gives a near perfect finish, bit hard to replicate from drawings but after a bit of trial and error I got the shape right.

Will take some snaps and post later.

Regards Mick

[BufferParticipant @buffer]

Here are a few photos of my shear tool. It is just cut diagonal across the end and then the tip is rounded on the bench grinder. It gives a superb finish. The little nick on the end is just a left over from its previous use. In the first picture the top face is the face that faces the forwards in the machine.

Regards

Rich

[PlasmaParticipant @plasma]

Five healthy chicks in my garden shaper.

[Steve King 5Participant @steveking5]

Managed to finish the tee nuts this morning. Used cold blue for the 1st time and was pleasantly surprised with the results.

[RICHARD GREEN 2Participant @richardgreen2]

BUMP

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by RICHARD GREEN 2 on 28/04/2020 17:42:47:

BUMP

What a splendid post1

I used my handraulic Drummond shaper to cut a ~50mm long 1/8” keyway but the results were less than ideal. I’m now trying to make a broaching tool, which is proving to be equally frustrating! I suspect my shaper cutter profile was not sufficiently precise and finding the true centre line was an equally evasive task. Shaft diameter is only 3/4”. Any helpful pointers would be appreciated.

Probably back to the shaper for another attempt. It is definitely a learning curve. Trouble is the key needs to run on a power feed shaft and sit within the apron to drive the power feeds, so needs to be very much spot on. The original item had the ‘key’ as an integral part of the gear but I don’t fancy making a new item like that.

[Tony RayParticipant @tonyray65007]

I'm not a shaper user yet but hope to be whe I get my Elliot 10M running. I got it in bits and the following parts were missing.

clutch and flywheel assembly

Motor, motor plate and pulley cover

clutch actuating pin.

ram gib

lower cabinet door

The copy of the manual aimhave ex NEMES website is a bit poor, does anyone have a better ODF they could share as I'm having trouble determining some of the parts on the various shafts.

I have sourced a ram gib and cliutch off an Alba 1A. The pulley was much larger due to a different motor speed arrangement. I have machined it down and intend to go poly Vee.

Does anyone have an Elliot in pieces that they would take some measurements of parts so I can fabricate what Is missing ?

I do have various Alba 1 A parts message me if you need anything.

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

Just recently put my Drummond manual shaper to good use, making the T-section horn-plates for the travelling beam for a workshop overhead hoist. The beam is essentially a 6-foot gauge bogie!

Horns for limited, rubber-bush suspension because I envisaged setting the steel-angle rails true and parallel in two planes in a concrete shed 16 feet long by nearly 6 wide, would be asking a bit much.

Yes it would have been quicker on the mill but this proved so problematical and frustrating that I did it the slow but much surer way. The shaper has no dials or stops, so I improvised:

– Step width by clamping a plate to the bed and working the feed by hand the last little bit;

– Down-feed by securing a simple sheet-brass pointer to the top slide cover by one of the cover's own screws, to indicate meeting a weeny pop-mark on the flank of the vertical slide, with the knee screw left at one setting.

Ground an old lathe tool back to bring the edge closer to the clapper-box fulcrum (many shaper users seem to miss that the edge should be vertically below the pin), and set the cross-feed gab to just one or two clicks on the ratchet – whatever that equals in thous or one-hundred-and-twenty-eighths. *

Bevelled the approach face of the work so the tool didn't slam into a vertical wall each time, judged down-feed increments by eye along the hand-wheel spokes, and used 'Trefolex' to help the cutting.

I don't claim my work was as accurate as the shaper ought allow, but I obtained reasonable repeatability to rule, scribing-block and test fit, for parts that will be bolted to a hot-rolled angle-iron frame, not a 5-inch g. 'Britannia' . However, the finish was very pleasing, much neater than the 'Artex' finish from milling.

In fact for some model- rather than tool- engineering purposes, a shaped / planed finish might be truer to prototype than milling would give, where an "as-machined" surface would be correct. (Interesting point: is that lovely satin sheen on preserved machinery, factory-finish or from years of being wiped over with oily rags?)

It kept me quiet for a few physically active but relaxing locked-down hours, and I could hear the radio above the gentle sounds of the machine (unlike the racket the milling-machine makes).

'

* Awkward fractions… I have, or had, a rule with a 1/128 divided inch on it! At least that's a binary fraction, 1/8 of 1/16 (= 0.0078 inch).

In my workshop-equipping queue is a Denbigh H0 horizontal mill, a small but useful machine. There was a superbly restored and equipped example but badged "Patrick" rather than "Denbigh", at the Sandown exhibition a few years ago. The only fly in the cutting-oil is that two of the screws on mine, including I think the long feed, are of 6TPI! The third, I forget which, is the more conventional 8TPI, but 6? 0.16666r lead? Why?

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

Strange leadscrews does seem to be a feature with some shapers. My AMMCO came with a 13 tpi downfeed, with a V thread form, which looked to be original. (Half inch Sellers thread.) Someone had fitted a calibrated dial with 62.5 divisions, which might have been helpful if the screw had been 16 tpi. I found a nice 10 tpi one from an old lathe cross slide and fitted that.

John

[David Harris 8Participant @davidharris8]

I’ll give the thread a little lift.

I've a small Boxford at home in the workshop, needing a little reconditioning to the rams ways, but it’s a nice wee machine and could be useful for someone, a bit small for me.

im on the lookout for a bigger beast, there’s a couple on eBay, one with no pictures and the seller hasn’t replied to my message about it yet, and a nice looking Elliot, but a bit too much money.

if anyone knows of one going let me know.

[RICHARD GREEN 2Participant @richardgreen2]

BUMP………………………….

[brian roberts 2Participant @brianroberts2]

Hello Steve,

If you want to see a shaper enthusiast at work have a look at 'Rustinox' on You Tube.

I believe he is called Michel and lives in Belgium – very interesting to watch.

Regards,

Brian

[RICHARD GREEN 2Participant @richardgreen2]

I've got a Klopp 34" shaper made in Germany, I would like to swap it for an open crank oil engine possibly 5 horse power or larger, what have you got ? anything consisered , e-mail me on, robertg.green@virgin.net

[Tony RayParticipant @tonyray65007]

I’m not shaping yet but here’s a pic of my Alba 1A to Elliot 10M poly vee conversion. sorry it’s inverted.

[Ian McVickersParticipant @ianmcvickers56553]

Hopefully I should be the owner of a Boxford MK2 8" shaper next week. I see, from the photos, that it has holes through the base which i presume are for lifting it. Can anyone tell me what diameter they are so that I can get some bars set up for it?

Ian

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

Ian –

Well, we'll keep our fingers crossed!

Do you have the manual for it?

It might not give the diameters of the presumed-lifting holes, but it may give other advice on lifting the machine, including its weight.

[noel shelleyParticipant @noelshelley55608]

Elliot 10M is very clear on lifting ! set the ram at mid stroke and use a rope strop. lifting on the ram. If the machine is on a stand, the 10M is top heavy and doesn't need much to cause it to topple over. Be careful. Noel.

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