What would you ban and why? (Definitely tearoom!)

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 23/08/2016 18:43:56:

People who complain about 'Americanisms' that are actually long-standing English expressions we have replaced with neologisms and lazy shorthand.

That said, I would also ban 'I could care less'.

Neil

It takes two to tango as they say!.The system works both ways. I'm sure we didn't start saying "issues". I would put that down to "corporate culture" rather than a genuine americanism in the purest sense. 

Michael W

Edited By Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 19:02:40

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 13:38:22:

And problems being described as "issues" They arent magazines!

Michael W

.

Michael,

Issues are a sub-set of "problems" …

Just put 'issues meaning in english' into a Google search to find some definitions in the reputable dictionaries.

MichaelG.

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2016 19:31:29:

Posted by Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 13:38:22:

And problems being described as "issues" They arent magazines!

Michael W

.

Michael,

Issues are a sub-set of "problems" …

Just put 'issues meaning in english' into a Google search to find some definitions in the reputable dictionaries.

MichaelG.

I don't believe that's what it originally meant, to issue is to go or to send out or exit something.

Michael W

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 19:01:36:

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 23/08/2016 18:43:56:

…

Neil

I'm sure we didn't start saying "issues". I would put that down to "corporate culture" rather than a genuine americanism in the purest sense.

Michael W

Edited By Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 19:02:40

In my line of work "problem" and "issue" weren't synonyms. An issue is a particular type of problem, that is one that you have to do something about. The need for some sort of action promotes a problem to an issue, as opposed to the sort of problems that can be tolerated.

I strongly suspect that this is yet another example of a technical expression finding it's way into ordinary language, perhaps because "issue" is useful shorthand for "important problem". In the same way "strategic issue" means a " problem that's more important than an important problem".

Back in the 70's we had to be careful running a monkey up the flag-pole in case it turned into a somebody saluted situation.

You'll have to forgive me – I've had a long hot day in my workshop…

Dave

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Michael Walters on 23/08/2016 19:46:53:

I don't believe that's what it originally meant

.

As you wish … That's your perogrative

MichaelG.

.

Edit: the etymology is interesting

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=issue

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2016 20:22:57

[Sam Longley 1Participant @samlongley1]

Posted by Mike on 23/08/2016 16:19:08:

Sam, I was taught by my former employer's IT chief that writing e-mails in upper case was rude. Mind you, as a deaf old git myself, 72 point lower case might be handy…

I always thought it was meant to indicate shouting!!

But clearly the joke has fallen on deaf ears

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

The term issue rather than a problem came into use especially at work because of some people thinking that calling problems problems was an instance of negative thought. An issue is far more positive – at least according to some people management pundits. So it' supposed to benefit from the power of positive thought and people will go away with a positive frame of mind. Tell them it's a problem and they might worry about it = negative frame of mind.

I have been accused of giving some problem negative aspects by calling it a problem. My reply usually is that a problem to me is a bit like a mathematical puzzle / problem. It's there to be solved. However I gained the impression that if I was talking to more senior management and I used the term issue, even serious issue they for some reason or the other looked to be more happy about it. Probably 'cause they were the people instructing others to use the word issue rather than problem. They were probably told to use the term issue from way way up the management tree.

Afraid this is fact and the use of the word issue rather than problem has become really widespread.

John

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

I would ban people who go on a riff about something I wasn't talking about! Where did I mention 'issues'?

Hang on a minute! I CAN ban people…

Neil

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 23/08/2016 20:56:06:

But clearly the joke has fallen on deaf ears

.

Unfortunately true

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 23/08/2016 21:10:50:

I would ban people who go on a riff about something I wasn't talking about! Where did I mention 'issues'?

Hang on a minute! I CAN ban people…

Neil

Pfft. moderators!

[Mark CParticipant @markc]

Neil mentioned issues; is there a problem with an opportunity to improve delivery of the next one?

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 23/08/2016 21:10:50:

Where did I mention 'issues'?

.

You didn't … Michael W did

I don't think anyone has implicated you in this nonsense.

MichaelG.

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2016 21:22:19:

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 23/08/2016 21:10:50:

Where did I mention 'issues'?

.

You didn't … Michael W did

I don't think anyone has implicated you in this nonsense.

MichaelG.

It's a classic case of the "stanford" complex, reaching for the trigger too quickly in a position of authority. From a different angle its rather silly.

Michael W

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Mark C on 23/08/2016 21:20:53:

Neil mentioned issues;

.

Where?

MichaelG.

[Mark CParticipant @markc]

Three posts earlier than my last post, you got a problem with that or wot?

Off to make a drink now….. grinning as I go

[charadamParticipant @charadam]

People, generally of the male persuasion, who, in "solidarity" with prisoners in the USA have decided to let us all share the view of their underwear.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Mark C on 23/08/2016 21:58:23:

Three posts earlier than my last post, you got a problem with that or wot?

Off to make a drink now….. grinning as I go

No don't use the word problem – MichaelG might get a complex from worrying about it. Please use the term issue instead.

John

–

 

Edited By Ajohnw on 23/08/2016 22:06:16

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Mark C on 23/08/2016 21:58:23:

Three posts earlier than my last post, you got a problem with that or wot?

Off to make a drink now….. grinning as I go

.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Ajohnw on 23/08/2016 22:04:28:

No don't use the word problem – MichaelG might get a complex. Please use the term issue instead.

.

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

I see no reason to engage in a pointless squabble. I don't attempt to control it either, whether or not it's what the big i am wants to hear. I certainly wouldn't ban anyone or suggest to over a disagreement. I invite you to do so, if that's how low you want to go.

Michael W

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

I take issue with the problem of ugly use of language.

;0)

Martin

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

I would ban forums that are incapable of giving each posting a # number. Makes life difficult to give a reasoned reply.

Regards Ian.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

I'd ban all management speak, not just "issues". Worst of all is the need to be "across this issue", meaning to know about the problem or topic of discussion. Then the need to "move forward from this point".

"Major paradigm shift" would be another one. "Productivity" to mean make everyone who is left after the redundancies work harder, or "pedal faster".

And don't slow down on the climb up the career ladder lest you "run out of tarmac".

And any quotes from Sun Tzu's The Art of War in a business context should be banned outright. No, polishing the bum of your pants in an office chair is not just like being at war. Nobody is shooting at you. A bomb is not likely to blow you into a million pieces at any moment. You are not a great warrior because you just clinched a deal to "move more product". Or a great general because you "incentivized" anyone, engaged in "blue-sky thinking", outside the box or otherwise..

[Clive IndiaParticipant @cliveindia]

Posted by Hopper on 24/08/2016 10:13:05:

I'd ban all management speak, not just "issues". Worst of all is the need to be "across this issue", meaning to know about the problem or topic of discussion. Then the need to "move forward from this point".

"Major paradigm shift" would be another one. "Productivity" to mean make everyone who is left after the redundancies work harder, or "pedal faster".

And don't slow down on the climb up the career ladder lest you "run out of tarmac".

And any quotes from Sun Tzu's The Art of War in a business context should be banned outright. No, polishing the bum of your pants in an office chair is not just like being at war. Nobody is shooting at you. A bomb is not likely to blow you into a million pieces at any moment. You are not a great warrior because you just clinched a deal to "move more product". Or a great general because you "incentivized" anyone, engaged in "blue-sky thinking", outside the box or otherwise..

Nice one. Like it, but you forgot the low-hanging fruit

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Hopper on 24/08/2016 10:13:05:

I'd ban all management speak …

.

Be gentle, Hopper

It's only jargon ['shorthand' which is used to avoid re-stating commonly understood concepts] … Rather like that ugly expression "management speak".

MichaelG.

[Author]

Posts