What are the best quality needle files?

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

I got a cheap set of needle files and they have already dulled and blunted having used them for less than 20 minutes on wood. The ones I haven’t used yet have rust on them despite being kept in a dry centrally heated house. They were ok when I bought them.

What are the best quality sets of needle files that won’t wear away and won’t corrode? I use them most often for filing windows and doors in plastic models but also want to use them on metal too.

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

I've been buying the Tome ones from Arc for the last few years. Vallorbe are also good

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

How about Vallorbe?

This set on Amazon, yours for only £138.30! Beware of asking for 'best quality' unless stinking rich.

Arc Euro manage to find and sell mid-range tools at reasonable prices; I've done ok with the other UK model engineering suppliers as well.

Dave

[CalumParticipant @calumgalleitch87969]

Also worth asking: what kind of wood? There are certain species that have mineral inclusions that make them more akin to biological grinding wheels than free-cutting lignin.

[Bill PhinnParticipant @billphinn90025]

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 26/05/2022 20:23:34:

How about Vallorbe?

This set on Amazon, yours for only £138.30! Beware of asking for 'best quality' unless stinking rich.

Vallorbe, yes, Dave, but not that set if what you're after is general-purpose needle files; those are buffing files.

I've got the set myself. I paid £60 when I bought them almost ten years ago. They fill a sometimes useful niche between filing with an ultra-smooth toothed file (i.e. a no. 6) and polishing.

 

Edited By Bill Phinn on 26/05/2022 21:19:19

[noel shelleyParticipant @noelshelley55608]

In the context of files remember that a scrap of copper pipe will work wonders when a file is clogged. Noel

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

Some species of wood are not only abrasive as Calum says. (I am not a biochemist but I assume the tree absorbs minerals that then precipitate as extremely fine crystals; and that might include silica, second in hardness only to diamond.)

They may also contain tannic acid – oak is particularly known for that – or other corrosive chemicals.

[Thor 🇳🇴Participant @thor]

I too have found Vallorbe the best quality needle files. The oldest one I have is several decades old and still cut well.

Thor

[Jon LawesParticipant @jonlawes51698]

I've still yet to find a file that gives as nice a finish as the one on my old leatherman! I think it is an industrial diamond coating of some kind. It doesn't seem to dull, gives a mirror finish and can be unclogged easily.

I'll give those Arc files a try too; I'm sick of poor quality needle files from allegedly good names. Of course, in my case this could be the workman blaming his tools….

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

You might find this old thread of interest, Jon :

https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=137658&p=1

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 27/05/2022 07:37:41

[CalumParticipant @calumgalleitch87969]

While we're on the subject, can I ask about filing HSS? I'm interested in making form tools – I know I can heat treat O1 or the like but I'd like to avoid the extra faff. I imagine diamond needle files are the way to go here but I'd like to get one decent set that will last.

[Jon LawesParticipant @jonlawes51698]

Thank you Michael.

[Dave SParticipant @daves59043]

I use a couple of sets of smaller diamond files from Arc for HSS (and carbide as it happens)

Dave

[Laurie WParticipant @lauriew39626]

I have found that needle and precision files by Vallorbe, Grobet or Baiter from Switzerland and those made in Germany by Dick (identified by a stylised arrow symbol) have all proved excellent over many years of frequent use. However when it comes to diamond files my experience has been a bit different. Whilst beautifully made my Vallorbe diamond files have proved disappointing in use as they lose their coating rather quickly. I no longer buy them and instead use those supplied by Arc Euro Trade which don't look as nice but perform far better and are far cheaper. Eternal Tools also sell diamond files which may be worth a try – their other tools have proved themselves to be good.

Edited By Laurie W on 27/05/2022 11:13:53

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Calum Galleitch on 27/05/2022 09:26:21:

While we're on the subject, can I ask about filing HSS? …

HSS is a notch or two harder than an ordinary steel file and O1/Silver Steel so, in theory, you can machine files with HSS. Not recommended in practice, because a file is hard enough to quickly blunt an HSS cutter.

General advice in one of my books is to avoid machining anything harder than HRC 45. A file is about HRC 54.

Carbide inserts can cut HSS, but it's not often done for the same reason: HSS fights back, and is likely to damage the carbide in short order. Like two closely matched boxers knocking seven bells out of each other until the stronger one eventually wins and they're both taken away in an ambulance.

The usual way to shape HSS is by grinding. Big bench grinders are relatively quick and accurate in skilled hands. As a clumsy oaf, I've used a Dremel for tidying up HSS – cuts OK but very slow. Never tried to file an HSS tool by hand. Diamond is hard enough do it, but I suspect it will be a long exhausting job.

Dave

Dave

[David AmbroseParticipant @davidambrose86182]

Squires also do Tome needle files, and the larger ones.

[jaCK HobsonParticipant @jackhobson50760]

You might not need a full set? If just one, I'd go half-round.

I guess all good files will be prone to rust as the requirement is for very fine grain in the metal and stainless isn't great for that.

Cheaper Vallorbe are excellent. You pay more for a finer cut. Cut 2 should be a good starting point.

Heat treating 01 is really simple – the metal is designed to be easy to heat treat.

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

Vallorbe as mentioned are about the best but also probably the most expensive. They do a set they call "midget" which are supposedly their budget range. In reality there isn't much difference.

If you aren't bothered about a whole set then good quality new old stock can usually be had cheap on ebay. Brands like Stubs, Oberg, Sandvik, Grobet, and pferd.

[Martin King 2Participant @martinking2]

Hi All,

we get literally dozens of various needle files in with our tool lots and by far and away the best sellers and most asked for are:

Oberg, Vallorbe, Tome, and older Uk makes Stubs, Bedford etc

these sell very wel and command good prices.

Cheers, Martin

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

My best ones are Vallorbe Swiss, and also I was able to get hold of a quantity of NOS Stubbs from a firm which had bought out the remaining stocks when Stubbs ceased manufacturing.

[Author]

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