uPVC door in closed position with broken lock

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

My double glazed uPVC door lock mechanism has broken with the door in the closed position. The keys still enters from either side and turn as normal but the handles are locked in a horizontal position.

Went on Google and the only advice I could find was to remove the outer cover plates to expose the eurolock and, using a tight fitting shifter on one side, apply enough force to cause the lock to break in the middle where the fixing screw is located. Tried a 12" shifter. No joy. Then drilled and filed a tight fitting slot at the end of a 2 foot length of 11/2" x 1/4 BDMS, offered it up and pulled until the slot started to bell out. Closed the slot up, placed it in position and this time used a mole grip to stop it belling, which it promptly did again.

Any advice as the cheapest quote was £110 or more. Would drilling the lock out work? If so what type of drill should I use? I was thinking of making a claim on the home insurance but my excess is £200.

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

Forgive me if I'm stating/asking the obvious, but do you just need to lift the handle above horizontal and turn the key a bit more to unlock and make the mechanism work?

Ed.

[paul raynerParticipant @paulrayner36054]

Do the handles move at all?

If they do then it's probably the barrel that has rounded off. All you need to do is remove the handles and jam in an oversize square bar turn it a bit then the key will unlock it. to repair it you will need the whole end bit from top to bottom .undo all the screws and take it to your local pvc door manufacturer you must take it as there are a couple of different ones most universal ones will fit though

regards

paul

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

Thanks Ed and Paul. Handles are locked solid in the 'relaxed' position ie horizontal.

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

Ooops, should have said the handles will move upwards to the 2 o'clock position with no resistance but when moved downwards it is impossible to encourage or even force then past the horizontal. In both positions the key turns sweetly as if it was a new lock but nothing happens.

[Robert NewmanParticipant @robertnewman73767]

I've done a few of these in the past the easiest way if you knock the pins out of the hinges and open the door from that side,as long as you haven't got anti jemmy hinges fitted. The other way is to wedge the door and use a disc cutter to cut off hook bolts and latch,it can make a mess on the door just be careful. There's other ways but it means drilling the lock until you can access the rack it will move with screwdriver once you can get at it. Best of luck

Edited By Robert Newman on 24/07/2017 21:01:08

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Euro cylinders can be drilled with normal jobber drills just be prepared to blunt a couple as you hit the vertical pins that are moved by the key. I usually drill until I reach the cross screw and open up the hole then put a bar in the hole and hit it which breaks the cylinder in half.

If you do want to carry on with your lever method then get someone on the other side of the door to bend with you, doing it on one side just twists the cylinder in the door.

[Bob RodgersonParticipant @bobrodgerson97362]

Just Make a 999 cal to the policel and tell them you suspect someone has been murdered at your address. Hide in the bathroom before they come.

[Sam Longley 1Participant @samlongley1]

Never done this but presumably if you could get the cylinder out you may be able to work something inside to operate the lock mechanism. So why not get a felt pen & mark around the handle on the inside (not outside) of the door. remove the handle & then drill into the door just in line with the centre of the cylinder ( keeping within the felt lines so any damage is later hidden) Then you may be able to expose the screw that holds the cylinder. If you can then grind it off with a dremel you may just slide the cylinder out. Then you can check that it was not the tab on the cylinder that was at fault.

Then you may be able to see inside the lock & with a bent screwdriver operate it manually

Is that a possibility?

[john carruthersParticipant @johncarruthers46255]

A thin stiff blade can cut the single screw holding the euro cylinder in position. Slip it down between the cylinder flat and the lock box.
Once (if) you get the door open it's easy enough to get the tumbler rotated flush with the cylinder and withdraw it.
With the key slot vertical the tumbler is about 45 degrees, 2 o'clock – ish.
The bars that carry the motion round the edge of the door latch in a flat toothed recess. They can be adjusted by latching in to fewer or more teeth. Very often they wear and jump out of mesh.
If it has all round locking, not just the jamb side, then the action is carried round the corners by flexible flat spring strips in a curved track. These can buckle and prevent the rest of the bolts shooting.

If it has no anti lift blocks you may jus be able to jimmy the door up and out of the shoes.

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

My friend down the road has the same problem, tried most things but looks like it's going to be the full surgery ,cut of hinges etc. It's his conservatory door and he is in the trade ! Sorry not much help.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

From a similar experience, it may be easier to direct your attention to the door frame than the door itself.

From the inside I was able to remove a pocket of 'wall' outside the aluminium frame and use a bar to push frame and door apart enough to get it open.

Neil

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Don't think you can get enough leverage to break a euro lock in half with a "shifter". We used a hammer slid down the protected face of the door, top to bottom after removing the handle plates. Lock bolt inside lock then drawn backwards using a cranked ended bar.

Regards Ian

[HowiParticipant @howi]

A standard euro lock can be broken with a pair of molegrips, thieves do it all the time, takes a matter of seconds.

If anti twist, then you cannot do this.

Take the door handle plates off and grip the square section bar that joins the handles together with something substantial and twist clockwise if handle on left or anti clockwise if on right. Try banging/ kicking the door while twisting.

If the key is going fully into the lock and the cylinder is turning, then it looks as though the lock is ok. In this case it is the locking mechanism within the door that operates the latch bolts etc that appears to be jammed.

Unless you can get the door opened by previous methods, then it looks like a new door.

[Glyn DaviesParticipant @glyndavies49417]

When this happened to me, I took off the handles and gripped the square shaft with a large adjustable spanner and forced the lock. You'll need a new locking mechanism, but you do anyway.

[Andy CarruthersParticipant @andycarruthers33275]

I'm a part-time locksmith and from a brief perusal it sounds like the gearbox has failed – PM with location – typically a gearbox costs £99 to £175 fitted on a callout basis depending upon type, there are over 150 different gearbox types

We use a variety of techniques to take out Euro cylinders, snapping is one, drilling, pulling are others

The strip along the side of the door is called the mechanism, these have hooks or bolts and often button catches, sometimes these can be moved with some force or sometimes doors pop open using a spreader

Do ping me, I'd be delighted to help

[fishy-steveParticipant @fishy-steve]

Pay the £110 and save yourself the bother. I paid £100 for my door with exactly the same symptoms as yours. The locksmith took an hour to do it and was cursing the whole time.

Good luck.

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

Hi again and many thanks to all the kind folk who have provided guidance. Have finally got the cylinder broken and removed as suggested by operating from both sides of the door. Moved the slide which the cylinder cam bears on to the rear position. And the handles still won't move!

[Andy CarruthersParticipant @andycarruthers33275]

The gearbox has failed

Remove door handles, spindle and Euro securing screw

Remove the mechanism by unscrewing ~12 screws – warning, these are the ones which go into the door itself, should be ~25 – 30mm long and look like wood screws. If the threads are metric like then put them back as they will be either securing the gearbox to the mechanism OR various parts of the mechanism to itself

Pull the mechanism from the door, you may need to gently lever this out taking careful note of how the mechanism is constructed particularly if you have top and bottom bolts, may be helpful to mark where they dovetail into the mechanism with nail varnish – pink looks lovely

Examine the gearbox for obvious mechanical failure particularly the spindle follower (square section where the spindle goes through) and rear of the gearbox as bits sometimes poke out

Gearboxes can be jack-in-the boxes so I don't open them, we do not replace broken parts but if you are on this forum, what do you have to lose, it's b0rked anyway

If you need a replacement, send me a photo – I'll be cheaper than any locksmith

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

Andy

Thanks for the input and offer. Sadly the door is still shut ie in the closed position and no matter what I do it ain't for opening. Even putting a long shifter on the handle spindle does nothing. I have looked through the cylinder hole and there are no slots, pegs, cams or other bits to be seen other than the mechanism the lock cam operates on.

I was told many years ago that when you get old a good day is one without bad news. This is one terrible day!

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

It's not all bad news! At least you know now that you have taken the lock barrel out, the door is still secure from intruders

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

With the grandchildren in the house it's me escape route what's been blocked!

[David Standing 1Participant @davidstanding1]

Ah, good point! Hope you get it fixed soon………

[JimmieSParticipant @jimmies]

Man cometh tomorrow, probably with big bill. It was interesting, when phoning round, how few were interested in the job when I could not provide the lock manufacturer's name and it's model number. Have we really come to the era of limited ability in what used to be known (and respected for their skills) as 'tradesmen.' I fear so.

Many thanks again to those who offered their knowledge and support – much appreciated.

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