TOOLING SURVEY

[Graham TitmanParticipant @grahamtitman81812]

The ones i don't use are carbon and hss inserts on the lathe, on the mill and pillar drill hss and carbide and on the shaper mostly hand ground hss.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

We use 'survey Monkey' a lot at work but it may charge for commercial use. The big problem with surveys is always that the questions always seem to be the wrong ones half an hour after you set the thing up.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

NDIY – there's always one, isn't there?

All will become clear in a week or two

Neil

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

I did note the ‘winner’ would be announced after you put up the previos effort. If prizes were awarded, I figured I might get the wooden spoon for my contribution.

As I wrote, there is no ‘preference’ – I use an appropriate cutter for the purpose in hand, or hopefully use one that will do the job. They all have pros and cons.

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Yes, there is no simple answer to this question and everyone will differ in their own preferences.

I mainly prefer to grind my own HSS tools – but do use inserts for specific purposes (parting and screw-cutting mostly). Carbon steel is very useful for tooling that needs special or specific 'shaping' which can be done before hardening – small boring tools, D bits, taps, dies, some form and/or fly-cutting tools etc.

Hard to capture that in a survey though I suspect….

Regards,

IanT

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

No cobalt HSS?

That stuff has changed my lathe and shaper life kinda thing, it has the toughness of carbide and the ease of HSS

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Ady1 on 08/02/2018 14:39:38:

No cobalt HSS?

 

Does not matter what options were on the poll, could just have well been armchair, sofa, bean bag etc.

The reason for posting was for Neil to see how the forum software could or could not be used for his purpose. As the results are public that does not suit his needs. Pity there is no option to keep the poll results hidden a sit works well apart from that .

Would have thought someone would have worked out what it is all in aid of by now, i got it straight away.

Edited By JasonB on 08/02/2018 15:08:05

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

Gathering data on what we have in the shed, sell to some lowlife ? Just joking.

[mickParticipant @mick65121]

At the moment its carbide inserts ahead by 1% at 39% followed by own HSS at 38% This is as exciting as the referendum!

[MWParticipant @mw27036]

I prefer good quality softwood inserts

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

I would like to help but seem to be allowed to make only one choice of lathe tooling, I use 3 types in practice.

Brian

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Brian Wood on 08/02/2018 17:51:45:

I would like to help but seem to be allowed to make only one choice of lathe tooling, I use 3 types in practice.

Brian

It asks you what your prefer, not what you use – choose your favourite!

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

I prefer the ones that some one else pays for .

[brickyParticipant @bricky]

I prefer carbide inserts for most of my tooling.

Frank

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Well, HSS leads by a short nose.

I'm sure that 10 or 15 years ago carbide would have been way behind.

Interesting how few folks use pre-ground HSS tools – I use them in various sizes for boring in particular, although they almost always need grinding away under the cutting edge for small holes.

Neil

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Posted by mick on 08/02/2018 16:49:16:

At the moment its carbide inserts ahead by 1% at 39% followed by own HSS at 38% This is as exciting as the referendum!

Will there be a design for a 'swingometer' in MEW?

[MikeParticipant @mike89748]

I'm not surprised that pre-ground HSS gets such a low score. Maybe I have been unlucky, but all of those I have bought have at least needed sharpening before use, and some have had to be completely re-ground. The penalty for buying cheap items, I guess.

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 08/02/2018 18:00:43:

Posted by Brian Wood on 08/02/2018 17:51:45:

I would like to help but seem to be allowed to make only one choice of lathe tooling, I use 3 types in practice.

Brian

It asks you what your prefer, not what you use – choose your favourite!

Thank you Neil, I may have changed the statistics now

Brian

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 09/02/2018 09:23:57:

Interesting how few folks use pre-ground HSS tools

…

Neil

I know this is just a test of forum capability but Neil's comment shows how careful you have to be designing questionnaires and interpreting results. The question wasn't 'who uses', it was 'what do you prefer?' That's a big difference.

'Prefer' is also dodgy : I 'prefer' HSS for some jobs and 'prefer' Carbide for others. Once in a Blue Moon I 'prefer' to use pre-ground HSS. Should the question have been "Which form of lathe tooling do you use most often"? (Depends on the purpose of the questionnaire. I bet my suggestion's wrong too!)

Extracting information from the results is fraught with danger as well. I have a theory that experienced chaps with older lathes prefer HSS because they have grinding skills and slow lathes. Newcomers with new lathes prefer carbide inserts because they don't have grinding skills but do have fast lathes. It's quite hard to think of a series of questions to prove or disprove my theory, and all too easy to go astray.

During the 1950s it was discovered that there was a strong correlation between rising violent crime and the number of television sets sold. Obviously TV causes violent crime. Or not – the same correlation existed between crime rates and the sale of Washing Machines. Obviously violent crime is caused by clean underwear. Yet another correlation between Lead in the environment from Petrol and violent crime.  Hard to work out which conclusion is genuine, in this example probably they are all false.

I was involved in a questionnaire where 65% of computer users said they were 'Fully Satisfied' with a new feature. Which was surprising because it failed acceptance testing and wasn't switched on. Goodness knows what customers were actually 'Fully Satisfied' with!

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 09/02/2018 10:27:17

[jimmy bParticipant @jimmyb]

I made the switch 5 or 6 years ago when I got a bigger lathe. I'd say 90% of the time I now use carbide insert or solid carbide. HSS really only gets used for parting off and form tools.

I think its down to convenience and the very cheap cost of insert tools and tips.

Jim

[steamdaveParticipant @steamdave]

Carrying on from SOD Dave:

Some years ago, statistics showed that 10% of all road accidents occurred at speeds greater than 70 mph. That would mean it is safer to drive at speeds of more than 70 mph, because only 10% of accidents happen then.

Statistics can prove anything you want.

Dave
The Emerald Isle

[MonomanParticipant @monoman]

Statistics also tell you that most people die in bed.

Jerry

[RobinParticipant @robin]

What is tangential HSS? Am I missing out on something good? Twelve percent of users, who expressed a preference, said their machine centres preferred it. Is this the new, must have accessory for 2018 or am I, as usual, the last one to know?

[Tim StevensParticipant @timstevens64731]

Tangential tools use conventional bars of HSS (high speed steel) in a clamp, but where the 'standard' tooling has the HSS bar horizontal, with the tangential type the bar is held almost vertically. This simplifies grinding tools as the near-vertical face provides one of the important clearance angles. The angle in this case is set by the design of the clamp – a vertical tool would have no clearance on this face, so the out-of-vertical provides the clearance.

On the right of the column where you are reading this there is an advert from 'Eccentric Engineering' – a look at their web-site will show clearly how their clever system works.

I don't know how old the idea is – my guess is that it has been around for years.

Hope this helps

Tim

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by steamdave on 09/02/2018 11:06:32:

Carrying on from SOD Dave:

Some years ago, statistics showed that 10% of all road accidents occurred at speeds greater than 70 mph. That would mean it is safer to drive at speeds of more than 70 mph, because only 10% of accidents happen then.

Statistics can prove anything you want.

Dave
The Emerald Isle

Well given that much less than 10% of journeys happen at speeds greater than 70 mph you'd be wrong. Drawing glib conclusions isn't "using statistics" to "prove" anything. Other than perhaps something about the commentator….

Murray

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