Tom senior light vertical milling machinr

[ianjParticipant @ians]

I have the chance to buy a 1973 ex school Tom senior light vertical milling machine for approx £750. It's a metric 3 phase machine. with the S type head, I would have preferred imperial but I could fit a DRO to it. It appears to be in excellent condition with no damage to the table or back lash to the feed screws.

What is the general opinion on the £750 price?

Does any one know what the foot print is?

Thank You.

Ian

[ianjParticipant @ians]

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

Ian, I have a Senior light vertical, metric, 3 phase ex-school machine from about 1976. It's an excellent machine. Condition is everything, I fully restored mine to as-new condition. If it's in decent condition, £750 seems very fair.

If you fit a DRO it won't matter that it's a metric machine. Curiously, while the X and Y feeds are metric, the Z feed is imperial on mine. Having a 3 phase motor is an advantage if it's dual 230/400 volt as it means you can fit a variable speed drive without having to buy a new motor if your supply is single phase.

The footprint of mine is 28" deep x 21" wide. The drip tray overhang increases that to 38" deep x 28" wide.

Andrew M

Edited By Andrew Moyes 1 on 01/10/2013 23:01:36

[ronan walshParticipant @ronanwalsh98054]

I think the tom seniors are very well made machines and a nice size for home workshop use. Just one point i wanted to make about the footprint of these machines, the suds tray is often quite a bit larger than the area of the base, i was able to cut the back off the tray on mine and tig weld a piece of flat steel on the back. This allowed me to push the machine back a bit further against the wall to save space.

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Thanks for the replies. I will have a closer inspection of the machine & if all appears o/k I will but it.

Andrew. You say you completely restored yours, is it fairly straight forward to dismantle? The reason I ask is because I only have 28" between the outside corner of the house & outside corner of the workshop so will have to partially dismantle the mill.

Ronan. After you reduced the size of the tray what is the front to rear dimension approx.

Thank you

Ian

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

Taking it apart was straight forward with standard tools except for the quill, for which I had to make a few special tools. Once you have disconnected the electrics and coolant pipes, the head slides out on its shaft as a complete unit. The table, saddle and knee come off. The column is very heavy and I needed a hand with that. Four screws release the drip tray to reveal the sump. Be prepared for a disgusting sight if it's like mine. I have tried to post some photos but for some reason they won't upload into an album.

Andrew

[David Clark 13Participant @davidclark13]

Hi There

I would snap their hand off at £750.

I paid £1350 for mine.

Brilliant machine but you will probably need 3 of you to lift the column.

It is solid.

I have a complete set of photographs of how I fitted a DRO to mine.

The 3 phase is not a problem, the inverter is easy to fit and makes the motor virtually silent in use.

Easy to strip down and reasemble, just very heavy.

regards David

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

I agree with David that the price is good.

The original Brook Crompton Parkinson motor on my 1976 machine was 415v only. Standard inverters for a 230v single phase input give a 230v three phase output. You can get 230v single phase to 415v three phase inverters but they are not so common and are expensive. So I fitted a new TEC, flange mounted, 0.55kW dual voltage motor.

Andrew

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Go for it quick before someone else snaps it up. Beats any Chinese machine for the same price.

Russell.

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

I have posted some photos into an album showing the machine disassembled.

Andrew

[dcostaParticipant @dcosta]

Hello Andrew. Good afternoon.

See your pictures of the Tom Senior.
Beautiful work on a very nice milling machine. I envy you…

Best regards
Dias Costa

[Boiler BriParticipant @boilerbri]

Hello ian. If you need an invertor I have some slightly used ones. Cheep.

Brian

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Hi all.

Thank you for your replies & advice.

I've had a proper look at the machine this morning & bought it, Spent the rest of the day partially dismantling it & transporting it home ( only 5 miles from where it was located) on my mates pick up. Yes it is heavy even when reduced to big lumps. I don't think I will be going for a total repaint just a good clean & then reassemble it. I'm sure I will be back with more questions.

First question !

It's fitted with a Clarkson collet chuck held in with a draw bar, To release the chuck do you unscrew the draw bar a few threads & tap/hit/belt it with a hammer. I've put some penetrating oil down & will leave it over night.

Off now for a hot bath to ease my back !!

Thanks again.

Ian

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

Ian – I'm pleased to hear you got it. My Clarkson Autolock collet chuck has a 'damping ring' that is backed up against the spindle in use to increase rigidity. You should be able to use it to extract the chuck using a tommy bar on the chuck and spanner on the spindle nose. Mine was well and truly stuck when I got the machine so I had to use some additional persuasion with a lead hammer as you describe. Not ideal but I planned to replace the bearings anyway. Eventually it came off. Make sure the down feed worm is disengaged first so you don't damage it.

Dias – thanks for your generous comments.

Andrew M

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Andrew.

just had a look & yes my chuck has the "damping ring" will give it a try tomorrow ( to tired now!!) thanks for the advice about disengaging the down feed.

I will post some photos's when reassembled.

Ian

[DuncParticipant @dunc]

I think our Editor posted a how to use the Clarkson Autocollet chuck in a past issue of MEW. Worth a look at an index?

And a very nice find. I recall many articles on Tom Senior equipment and the high praise for the build quality.

[ronan walshParticipant @ronanwalsh98054]

Ian here is a link to the Tom Senior manual on the Denford website. Don't know if you found it yourself.

**LINK**

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Good morning.

Prepared for a battle to remove the chuck, a selection of various sized hammers at the ready !! but one sharp hit with average sized hammer did the job. It can only go down hill now for the rest of the day.

Andrew, where did you get your levelling feet from ?

Ian

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

Ian – I didn’t keep a note of the exact supplier but these would do: –

http://www.antivibrationcomponents.co.uk/en/catalog/mounts/machine-mounts/steel-machine-mounts/p2150

Mine were M12 studs x 90mm diameter. It’s worth the expense while the machine’s apart and the base is not too heavy to lift. As well as giving a solid base, it means you can easily set the table truly level in both planes to a precision spirit level. You can quickly set a workpiece level in the same way in the knowledge that it will be parallel to the table. A lot easier than clocking with a DTI in my opinion.

Andrew M

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Brian.

I may take you up on cheep inverters. I've sent you a PM.

Ian

[ianjParticipant @ians]

David C.

You say you have photo's of how you fitted a DRO to your mill, is it possible for you to put them in your album or should I PM you with my email address? Which scales did you use? I have a Sino SDS6-2V console which I bought at Chester's machine tools open day earlier in the year, It was labelled " X axis faulty Y axis working" when I opened it up it's all surface mount components so I thought no chance of me getting it working. When I was checking the continuity of the ribbon cables from the D type connector on the rear to the Molex PCB header I noticed that the 0 volts pin was displaced. when I refitted it into the Molex header the continuity was o/k. I Took it round to my mates to try it using his reading scales and it worked!!

I will be going to the Midland show next week so maybe I can get a good deal on some scales there.

Regards Ian

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Hi All.

I have finally reassembled my "new" tom senior mill. I decided to give it a paint job after all while it was in big lumps. I fitted the inverter in the left hand cabinet in the column ( thanks Brian ) Still waiting for the magnetic scales ( which I ordered at the Midland show, reading heads out of stock ) for the DRO.

I have created a photo album showing the mill in various stages.

Andrew. The Z axis is imperial on mine as well !

Ian

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Nice job, Ian

It looks very tidy indeed.

MichaelG.

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

Well done Ian. A good investment – I hope it gives you many years of pleasure.

Andrew M

[ianjParticipant @ians]

Hi All.

Finally finished fitting the DRO, I decided on the magnetic scales as they are of a lower profile. By fitting the X axis scale at the rear of the table I lose less than 8mm of travel in the Y direction & the scale is out of the way & the T slot on the front of the table is still accessible.

Has other owners noticed that if you try to tilt the milling head it hits the bolts securing the horizontal bar?

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