T pylons

[Bill DawesParticipant @billdawes]

Having had time now to consider these design as they stride across the levels near to where we live in Somerset, I have decided I don't like them.

When we were first told about these new designs they sounded better than the gargantuan lattice ones, however now changed my mind, true they are neater and smaller but it is because of that they seem more in your face probably because there are more of them, I assume this is because they are lower and need to spaced closertogether to keep the cable droop to a safe level. Too late now of course.

Bill D.

[Bill DawesParticipant @billdawes]

[Bill DawesParticipant @billdawes]

closertogether was not intentional!!!!!!!

Bill D.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Ticks "all the right boxes" …but yes, they are weird : **LINK**

https://www.powerpylons.com/

MichaelG.

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Posted by Bill Dawes on 08/03/2022 20:04:33:

closertogether was not intentional!!!!!!!

Bill D.

??? Surely they didn't make such a basic mistake, closer means more expensive as there are more of them, unless the new ones are cheaper and so the total cost including more foundations s less.

Also, each side has its own earth (lightning conductor?) at the top whereas old ones only had one, more expense?

The big advantage with air insulation is that it self heals. If you get an arc with solid insulation it gets damaged and isn't an insulator any more 

Edited By duncan webster on 08/03/2022 20:55:09

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by duncan webster on 08/03/2022 20:52:19:

Posted by Bill Dawes on 08/03/2022 20:04:33:

closertogether was not intentional!!!!!!!

Bill D.

??? Surely they didn't make such a basic mistake, closer means more expensive as there are more of them, unless the new ones are cheaper and so the total cost including more foundations s less.

…

They are cheaper. That's why they use them. "Cost efficient" is the term they use.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

The individual metal elements of the old ones were thin so if not on the skyline but seen with a backgouund of trees they blend in better. The driving force behind them is probably lifecycle costs. The metal ones have to be painted regularly which is a very manual and expensive process.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Duncan,

This is just one page on from the link I provided earlier: **LINK**

https://www.powerpylons.com/design-engineering

That’s a lot of ‘right boxes’ ticked.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 08/03/2022 23:28:37

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 08/03/2022 23:23:37:

Duncan,

This is just one page on from the link I provided earlier: **LINK**

https://www.powerpylons.com/design-engineering

That’s a lot of ‘right boxes’ ticked.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 08/03/2022 23:28:37

What language are they speaking?

"…compact power pylons that are respectable to the landscape and environment…"

and "… optimized throughout the value chain".

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Bill,

You have a PM.

Edited By not done it yet on 09/03/2022 05:34:26

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Hopper on 09/03/2022 04:39:25:

.

What language are they speaking?

.

”Box-ticking”

MichaelG.

[Sam Longley 1Participant @samlongley1]

What are they constructed from? One would assume the old metal ones would be recyclable. But if the new ones are in GRP, then I would question that they can be recycled so easily. Lifetime is possibly more. The old style does last quite a while, I have seen them being replaced. More often re strung, or insulators changed.

Edited By Sam Longley 1 on 09/03/2022 08:39:41

[Sam Longley 1Participant @samlongley1]

Posted by Bazyle on 08/03/2022 23:08:03:

The metal ones have to be painted regularly which is a very manual and expensive process.

Have you actually seen them being re painted. I saw some old ones being taken down & the galvanising was still fairly good. I thought that painting previously galvanised surfaces is not quite so straight forward, as it is to bare, or pre painted steel.

Edited By Sam Longley 1 on 09/03/2022 08:45:14

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by Sam Longley 1 on 09/03/2022 08:38:43:

What are they constructed from? One would assume the old metal ones would be recyclable. But if the new ones are in GRP, then I would question that they can be recycled so easily. Lifetime is possibly more. The old style does last quite a while, I have seen them being replaced. More often re strung, or insulators changed.

Edited By Sam Longley 1 on 09/03/2022 08:39:41

Says on MG"s link they are galvanised steel. Some sort of pressed or rolled and welded monocoque by the looks. Glorified lamp posts.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Can’t imagine why anyone would need to paint the old style pylons as they are galvanised, ever tried to get paint to adhere to galvanise, it won’t. Dave W

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Posted by Samsaranda on 09/03/2022 10:13:35:

Can’t imagine why anyone would need to paint the old style pylons as they are galvanised, ever tried to get paint to adhere to galvanise, it won’t. Dave W

Rub it down with vinegar first to etch the surface. But heck of a lot of vinegar per pylon I reckon.

[Nick WheelerParticipant @nickwheeler]

Posted by Hopper on 09/03/2022 04:39:25:

What language are they speaking?

"…compact power pylons that are respectable to the landscape and environment…"

and "… optimized throughout the value chain".

Job justification which is the native tongue of all middle managers. This one seems to be American from the 'z' in optimised

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

Posted by Samsaranda on 09/03/2022 10:13:35:

Can’t imagine why anyone would need to paint the old style pylons as they are galvanised, ever tried to get paint to adhere to galvanise, it won’t. Dave W

Mordant Solution or T-Wash is used to etch galvanised items to allow a paint to be applied. It is water based and very effective.

regards

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Nicholas Wheeler 1 on 09/03/2022 10:17:56:

Posted by Hopper on 09/03/2022 04:39:25:

What language are they speaking?

"…compact power pylons that are respectable to the landscape and environment…"

and "… optimized throughout the value chain".

Job justification which is the native tongue of all middle managers. This one seems to be American from the 'z' in optimised

"…compact power pylons that are respectable to the landscape and environment…" is bad English wherever she is spoke!

""… optimized throughout the value chain" is less criminal because it has a particular business management and accounting meaning. It's the language one might see in the Management Summary introducing a hefty business case full of spreadsheets and risk assessments justifying spending big money.

Laziness is a likely cause – someone created the web page by cannibalising a Management Summary rather than engaging brain and re-writing it for a general audience.

In the right context 'optimized throughout the value chain' is pithy jargon. Quite hard to explain what it means in plain English because 'Value Chain Management' is a chunky manufacturing discipline, the goal being to 'maximise value at the lowest total cost'. Whereas a production engineer might reduce costs by simplifying and adjusting the design to suit manufacture, VCM considers all possible economies, including sacking the workforce, turning the factory into a housing estate and moving production abroad! Production Engineers are nice cuddly chaps: Value Chain Analysts are spawn of Darth Vader…

Dave

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

Why do we have to buy from Denmark? Why can't we make them ourselves?

Roy

[Tony Pratt 1Participant @tonypratt1]

Posted by roy entwistle on 09/03/2022 11:34:16:

Why do we have to buy from Denmark? Why can't we make them ourselves?

Roy

It seems like we have to buy / import everything, look where that has led us.

Tony

[Nick WheelerParticipant @nickwheeler]

Dave,

'optimised throughout the value chain' is just jargon. It's not even particularly bad jargon, as its meaning is clear and concise.

'respectable to the landscape' reads like I suspect my attempts at German did 35 years ago.

One of my teachers was known for crossing out whole sections of work with a red felt-tip, with the comment 'write English!' nearby.

[Ex contributorParticipant @mgnbuk]

Can’t imagine why anyone would need to paint the old style pylons as they are galvanised, ever tried to get paint to adhere to galvanise, it won’t.

The old style pylons did used to be painted – a former colleague did a stint painting them until he was "barred" as a contractor for not applying enough paint.

No idea what sort of paint was used but coverage was specified and, apparently, checked.

Nigel B.

[Stuart BridgerParticipant @stuartbridger82290]

Most of the paint used for pylons is micaceous haematite based.
I learned this from a visit to the excellent Kelly Mine in Devon LINK

Edited By Stuart Bridger on 09/03/2022 14:48:46

[Bill DawesParticipant @billdawes]

I had hoped that the pandemic would show us the folly of being so reliant on so much being made overseas to say nothing of the latest debacle going on in Europe. I realise that even in our pinnacle of serving the world we needed raw materials from abroad. I had hoped………. but not optimistic that we will just return to the old ways where finnancial services is king.

The T pylons are substantially more noticeable than the old pylons, more of them, closer together, much thicker sections.

Bill D.

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