speed control needed

[Ian L2Participant @ianl2]

Ok i have a 600w Bosch palm router but its fixed speed, I would like to add something to get variable speed from it, have heard in past that light dimmer switch do job but will it cope with 600W. any other ideas to get variable speed welcome. also soft start would be useful.

[Ian L2Participant @ianl2]

[Malcolm Parker-LisbergParticipant @malcolmparker-lisberg38138]

The low cost dimmers from Hong Kong can hadle 2KW, cost about £1.18, I have a simple modification which adds a little piggy back board to give feedback. It senses the back EMF generated and uses that to compensate for the speed drop under load.

.R5, R6, R7 D1, D2 and C3 are the components that are added to the module. The module connections are changed and what was the input becomes the output and vise versa.

I will be adding a Youtube video of the process later this week.

[Ian L2Participant @ianl2]

Thanks Malcom

If you have some component details & values ect. Did you make your on p.c to mount the components to if you did is the layout something that you could send.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

By the dots it looks like a Vero Board job.

Ian S C

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Malcolm Parker-Lisberg on 21/02/2016 02:02:17:

The low cost dimmers from Hong Kong can hadle 2KW, cost about £1.18, I have a simple modification which adds a little piggy back board to give feedback. It senses the back EMF generated and uses that to compensate for the speed drop under load.

.R5, R6, R7 D1, D2 and C3 are the components that are added to the module. The module connections are changed and what was the input becomes the output and vise versa.

I will be adding a Youtube video of the process later this week.

.

Thanks Malcolm

That would be a very useful upgrade !!

MichaelG.

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

 

 

Posted by Ian S C on 21/02/2016 09:12:44:

By the dots it looks like a Vero Board job.

Ian S C

It could just be a schematic capture program……

In my opinion, Vero board would be inappropriate for a Mains Powered project…..especially not knowing the op' capabilities….

Ian,

I'd recommend you look at this as a kit…..

https://www.esr.co.uk/products/frame_motor-control.htm

It takes all the guess work out of designing/building/modifying, especially if you are a beginner…

Just my 2c worth….

Edited By John Rudd on 21/02/2016 09:53:26

[john fletcher 1Participant @johnfletcher1]

Hello Malcolm, what the resistor and capacitor values. I'll look out for your YouTube video. John

[Malcolm Parker-LisbergParticipant @malcolmparker-lisberg38138]

Give me chance to do the Youtube video, all will be revealed.

ICircuit was a screen grab, dots are the layout grid.

R5 & R6 100K, R7 15K, C3 10nF to 47nF dependent on motor characteristics. D1 & D2 1N4007. All other components as supplied on the dimmer.

A toner transfer PCB holds the components for the piggy back board with four leads between the boards.

I will post a image here of the PCB layout, see below

The ESR board is no better than the Hong Kong dimmers, as it does not have load compensating feedback.

Your are playing with leathal voltages, so be safe. Best to do test work with one of those Garden mower type ELCB modules that are designed to shut off the power when you mow the power lead.

[SteambuffParticipant @steambuff]

<Quote> The low cost dimmers from Hong Kong can handle 2KW, cost about £1.18, I have a simple modification which adds a little piggy back board to give feedback. <Quote>

Can you post a link to the 'Hong Kong' Dimmer that you based your design on?

Dave

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

My Alba 1A shaper when manufactured was fitted with a 950 rpm motor. Sometime in its life someone has fitted a replacement that runs faster – 1500rpm if I remember correctly. This means that the shaper runs a mite to fast even with the two speed gear change set on "slow".

I have been told several times on here in the past that slowing this 230v AC single phase motor was not possible yet John Rudd posts on this thread and links to this:

https://www.esr.co.uk/products/frame_motor-control.htm

Is it possible that the model R-10 will do the trick for me and slow my shaper?

Have I finally discovered the holy grail?

 

Rik

Edited By Rik Shaw on 21/02/2016 12:49:02

[Les Jones 1Participant @lesjones1]

Hi Rik,
This type of controller is only suitable for series (Also called universal.) motors. Your motor is more likely to be an induction motor so what you have been told before still stands.

Les.

[Malcolm Parker-LisbergParticipant @malcolmparker-lisberg38138]

John

Forn the module I am using, search for item number 221904245698 on ebay. It says 4KW, but the heat sink is not big enough for that power. The traic is though, so for larger powers you could change the heatsink.

Malcolm

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

Posted by Malcolm Parker-Lisberg on 21/02/2016 12:28:34:

The ESR board is no better than the Hong Kong dimmers, as it does not have load compensating feedback.

Maybe so, but I made no claim that it was better…..merely pointing out that for a beginner, it may be more suitable to build rather than modifying an existing design….

[Malcolm Parker-LisbergParticipant @malcolmparker-lisberg38138]

Why pay over £10 when you can get the same functionality for £1.18

Malcolm

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

Thanks Les – I never believed in the holy grail anyway

[Ian L2Participant @ianl2]

Thanks Malcolm. Controller ordered (in fact ordered 2).

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

Posted by Rik Shaw on 21/02/2016 12:48:42:

I have been told several times on here in the past that slowing this 230v AC single phase motor was not possible yet John Rudd posts on this thread and links to this:

https://www.esr.co.uk/products/frame_motor-control.htm

Is it possible that the model R-10 will do the trick for me and slow my shaper?

Have I finally discovered the holy grail?

Rik

Edited By Rik Shaw on 21/02/2016 12:49:02

The item I linked to was in response to Ian's request for a method of speed control for his router whch I believed to be of the universal motor powered type….

In no way did I indicate that it may be suitable for Rik's use..

[oldveloParticipant @oldvelo]

Hi

IF this is a Universal Motor I.E Brushes and Commutator the it will run on a AC to DC speed Controller.

Expensive yes and needs to setup to match the motor.

Eric

[Rik ShawParticipant @rikshaw]

John – Not to worry, if confusion has arisen it is due to my lack of knowledge in matters electrical – not your fault at all. Your ongoing advice on here re: electricals is much appreciated by me and others I am sure.

Rik

[Michael Cox 1Participant @michaelcox1]

Posted by Malcolm Parker-Lisberg on 21/02/2016 02:02:17:

The low cost dimmers from Hong Kong can hadle 2KW, cost about £1.18, I have a simple modification which adds a little piggy back board to give feedback. It senses the back EMF generated and uses that to compensate for the speed drop under load.

.R5, R6, R7 D1, D2 and C3 are the components that are added to the module. The module connections are changed and what was the input becomes the output and vise versa.

I will be adding a Youtube video of the process later this week.

Hi Malcolm,

Has there been any progress with the video. I keep watching your youtube channel but nothing seems to have been added.

Mike

[Malcolm Parker-LisbergParticipant @malcolmparker-lisberg38138]

I built the first of three and it works fine, About to do the video and started having eye troubles so everything was put on hold. I visited the hospital today and an operation is needed, but should not stop me from doing the video shortly, hopefully next week. The first unit controls a food mixer motor driving my wood lahe to be used for casting pattern making. The wood lathe dates back 50 years and is a Stanley Bridges wood lathe that was driven by a power drill. The second unit has an external electrically isolated heat sink to cater for the full 20 amp rating of the triac.

Photo of first unit showing the attachment of piggy back board to the first unit below.

Malcolm

[Michael Cox 1Participant @michaelcox1]

Hi Malcolm,

Thanks for the update. I am sorry to hear about the eye problem. I hope you can get it resolved quickly.

Mike

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Malcolm,

Thanks for taking the time to confirm success … and best wishes for the eye-op.

MichaelG.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Very neat Malcolm, hope the op goes well.

Neil

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