Sodium Nitrite

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

I need a small quantity of Sodium Nitrite, for an entirely innocent purpose

… not Potassium, and not Nitrate

This stuff is used in food processing: **LINK**

https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Sodium-nitrite

but I was astonished to see the PhilipHarris web page: **LINK**

https://www.philipharris.co.uk/product/chemicals/chemicals-q-t/sodium-nitrite-250g/b8a71535

Can anyone advise or assist, please ?

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Probably an expensive way to source it, but HERE maybe??

https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/222604811/sodium-nitrite-4-ounces-fine-powder-996

Failing that, do you know any local butchers who cure their own bacon?

Bill

[Ron LadenParticipant @ronladen17547]

Hi Michael

Hope Education list 250gms for £4.20 which seems a good price.

https://www.hope-education.co.uk/product/science/chemistry/chemicals/sodium-nitrite-250g/b8a71535

Ron

Sorry Michael, just read they will only deliver to a School address. 

Edited By Ron Laden on 25/05/2020 05:50:37

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks, both

@Bill … for no particularly good reason, I was hoping to avoid Etsy

Edit: and I now find this: ‘Sorry, this item doesn’t deliver to United Kingdom.‘

@Ron … yes that’s the same as the Philip Harris offering

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 08:00:15

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 24/05/2020 23:58:49:

I need a small quantity of Sodium Nitrite, for an entirely innocent purpose

Hi,

Camlab is a UK chemical supplier who will happly sell chemicals to private individuals (as long as they are not restricted). They eventake PayPal. They list Sodium Nitrite at reasonable cost.

https://www.camlab.co.uk/sodium-nitrite-pure

Unfortunatly it's on back order at the moment.

Robert G8RPI.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Robert Atkinson 2 on 25/05/2020 08:35:50:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 24/05/2020 23:58:49:

I need a small quantity of Sodium Nitrite, for an entirely innocent purpose

Hi,

Camlab is a UK chemical supplier who will happly sell chemicals to private individuals (as long as they are not restricted). They eventake PayPal. They list Sodium Nitrite at reasonable cost.

https://www.camlab.co.uk/sodium-nitrite-pure

Unfortunatly it's on back order at the moment.

Robert G8RPI.

.

Many thanks, Robert

… I will enquire

MichaelG.

.

Edit: A pattern seems to be emerging here

Sodium Nitrite Pure for laboratory use only. Not suitable for food use. We can only supply this to companies. You should only purchase this with an account and not through the guest checkout these orders will be cancelled and refunded.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 09:22:34

[Andrew EvansParticipant @andrewevans67134]

Try asking at a butcher

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

It’s neither the sodium or potassium salt that is ‘naughty’ but they both can be used to produce a chemical that is unstable.

I remember, back in 1965/66, that the school lab technician spilt a solution of chemicals on a rough paved surface and for weeks afterwards we could generate tiny explosions underfoot. Afterwards, I wondered if he did it on purpose as he was a mischievous individual.

Later, at work, we regularly made another unstable chemical (similar but not the same) which detonated easily. It was OK until someone blew the drying cabinet door open by preparing too much at a time and it spontaneously decomposed – either too hot or local vibration!

Our supervisor used to get cross when there was a carpet of rubber bits on the floor – due to smashed rubber bungs – he was no fun

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Michael, try these , no experience with Nexchem also look up Walsall chemicals they manufacture metal treatment salts which do contain said compound, I have used these folk for supplies. There is another one in Brum that supplied the gun trade— name escapes me right now but if the memory bank opens I’ll PM you

John

**LINK**

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks for that, John … much appreciated

MichaelG.

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Not clear whether you want lab grade or food grade???

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 10:35:24:

Not clear whether you want lab grade or food grade???

.

Probably not important … but on principle, I would go for lab grade if available

the 250g that Philip Harris sells would probably be more than I will ever need.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 10:40:48

[Martin ConnellyParticipant @martinconnelly55370]

Before we went to all stainless pipework at work we used to have treatment baths for mild steel pipe fabrications. The first tank was deoxidine which was a phosphoric acid based chemical. The second tank was plain water to rinse off the deoxidine. The third tank was a heated tank containing sodium nitrite to neutralise any remaining acid and after the water flashed off left an anti-corrosion layer that was good for a week or so giving enough time to get the pipes painted then the bores were sprayed with preserving oil before the ends were capped off.

We went all stainless when the labour costs of removing lacquer, descaling (imagine the work involved with raised face spiral grooved ANSI flanges), treating and painting required for mild steel pipes outweighed the material cost of stainless pipes.

Martin C

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Ive used this place several times fast delivery etc… but no sodium nitrite

**LINK**

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 10:38:24:

Posted by mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 10:35:24:

Not clear whether you want lab grade or food grade???

.

Probably not important … but on principle, I would go for lab grade if available

the 250g that Philip Harris sells would probably be more than I will ever need.

MichaelG.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 10:40:48

Important if you were going to pickle or preserve food

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Posted by Martin Connelly on 25/05/2020 10:40:05:

Before we went to all stainless pipework at work we used to have treatment baths for mild steel pipe fabrications. The first tank was deoxidine which was a phosphoric acid based chemical. The second tank was plain water to rinse off the deoxidine. The third tank was a heated tank containing sodium nitrite to neutralise any remaining acid and after the water flashed off left an anti-corrosion layer that was good for a week or so giving enough time to get the pipes painted then the bores were sprayed with preserving oil before the ends were capped off.

We went all stainless when the labour costs of removing lacquer, descaling (imagine the work involved with raised face spiral grooved ANSI flanges), treating and painting required for mild steel pipes outweighed the material cost of stainless pipes.

Martin C

Sorry if i misunderstood but sodium nitrite in your process will be used as an anodic inhibitor to reduce corrosion on the surface .

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 07:52:31:

Thanks, both

@Bill … for no particularly good reason, I was hoping to avoid Etsy

Edit: and I now find this: ‘Sorry, this item doesn’t deliver to United Kingdom.‘

…………….

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 08:00:15

Sorry, typing too late, missed that bit.

Looks like it comes under Section 1.2 of This Document as a poison

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/supplying-explosives-precursors/supplying-explosives-precursors-and-poison

See also This Document and the downloadable pdf.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/record-of-suspicious-transactions

Bill

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Michael how much do you need ?

 

Edited By mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 12:29:32

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

So it looks like suppliers are taking the easy way out on EPP reporting and only selling to companies even for reportable substances.
In theory they should sell to the public and only report it if the transaction is suspicious. By only selling to companies they remove the need to judge if a transaction is suspicious. Basically they are applying the EPP prohibition to every chemical on the list They don't even say you can buy them if you have an EPP licence (you can't get an EPP licence for Sodium Nitrite becuse it not restricted DOH). The easy way out is to set up a business to use it.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 12:26:07:

Michael how much do you need ?

.

About 50g would be plenty for the foreseeable future, so the Philip Harris or similar offering would have been ample and cost-effective.

… My entirely innocent purpose has no connection with food processing or improvised pyrotechnic devices.

I will post a link shortly

MichaelG.

.

Edit: ___ I will be working with much finer needles than he demonstrates here,

but the principle is the same: https://youtu.be/0rhRJpepesM

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 25/05/2020 14:48:01

[Roger HartParticipant @rogerhart88496]

If no luck elsewhere (and in no hurry) you might try adapting the time honoured 'saltpeter from urine' approach. Involves a pit. straw, chicken poo and urine and time. I seem to remember the result was boiled up and stewed with wood ash (potassium carbonate). Easy to substitute sodium carbonate (washing soda). The result is usually a mix of nitrate and nitrites. Best to wait till SWMBO is out….

Recall reading in some medieval gun history revival of some Dutch folk trying this out, the results a bit disappointing though. Perhaps some good English pee will do the trick. Other recipes are available.

[mark smith 20Participant @marksmith20]

Michael i can let you have some for the price of 1st class postage or first class signed for. Dont know how much there is probably around 20-40 gms (i`ll check now).Send me a pm if you`re interested.

update i can spare 50 gms, 10 gms lasts me ages ,i use it for darkening raw violin wood before varnishing.The bag at the top of the photo weighs 53 gms.

Edited By mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 15:31:25

Edited By mark smith 20 on 25/05/2020 15:35:03

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

P.M. sent, Mark

… Much appreciated !!

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

With enormous thanks to Mark … I tried my first experiment today

It was, predictably enough, a failure :

The wire that I currently have to hand is only about 50 microns diameter.

This is much too fine to make a probe/needle because I cannot straighten it; and it is not sufficiently stiff to perform the ‘chemical sharpening’ process.

I will update this when I have some thicker wire.

MichaelG.

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