Small-Medium Lathe

[Richard AnthonyParticipant @richardanthony90937]

Hi all looking for a small / med lathe ie db7 or warco180 quality wise which would you consider better are all they all just the same

thank you in advance

[Richard AnthonyParticipant @richardanthony90937]

WHICH

[Richard AnthonyParticipant @richardanthony90937]

and now just found ST-180X300V SWISSTEC LATHE

is this any better looks the same ! Swisstec ?

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by ANTHONY BARRY on 23/12/2016 19:52:12:

and now just found ST-180X300V SWISSTEC LATHE

is this any better looks the same ! Swisstec ?

.

Anthony,

May I suggest that you read this thread: **LINK**

http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=122544

MichaelG.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Hi Anthony,

Chinese lathes are similar, not identical. I don't think you can rely much on type numbers or Badge Names to identify the 'best buy'. Sometimes they come with more tooling, hardened beds, bigger motors, or better electronics. It's worth reading the small print, and looking out for offers. Warco supply a calibration certificate.

From personal experience and comment on the forum, it seems that some vendors are better at squeezing somewhat better quality out of the makers. In my experience ArcEuroTrade and Warco have both scored brownie points. But I've not had a positively bad experience from any of the UK suppliers either. Other forum members will say what they think!

Whoever you buy from, it's likely that you will be able to improve a Chinese lathe by tweaking it.

I wouldn't over-think your purchase. Once you've made the big decision (new vs secondhand), you might as well get on with it.

Cheers,

Dave

[Frances IoMParticipant @francesiom58905]

choice depends quite a bit on what you want to do with it

I have a Warco WM180 – fine, the belt drive has saved me a few times during the still protracted learning when dig ins has struck – it will screwcut RH threads fine but not easy to get it to do LH – there is no mounting mechanism (eg T-slots)on the cross slide thus using a boring bar between centres for aligning bores in mounts is not easy
– the leadscrew is not easily disengaged so you can’t use a handle to do fine movement – the chuck is held by 3 x 8mm screws so can happily reverse but the single banjo restricts altering the fixed relationship between the chuck and leadscrew – however plain turning is fine – Warco generally include 3 + 4 jaw chucks + a few other tools

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Can't comment on Chester's equipment; I have a Warco WM250-F & WM 16 mill, bought 2012 … so far so good with a few tweaks here & there, both have done what I've asked of them so….

George.

[nigel jones 5Participant @nigeljones5]

Have a look also at Amadeal, good products with brilliant after sales service.

[HowiParticipant @howi]

I can second Amadeal and Arc, good machines, good service from personal experience.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

1) Buy from a 'proper' dealer; most of the companies that offer good after sales service, stocks of accessories and spares, warranties and understand the needs of hobbyists advertise here and in ME and MEW (I'm not just saying that to please our advertisers, it's true). These bigger companies also demand the better quality machines – you can guess where ones that fail QC at the factory end up.

2) Compare the specs and accessories, these usually account for most of the price differences. Not all differences are obvious, they can be things like better quality electronics (but these days reports suggest the Chinese-made boards are no less reliable than USA made ones).

3) Talk to the 2 or 3 companies whose machine/price seems the best fit for your needs and see what advice they have to offer. They may have New Year deals coming up

Above all, enjoy the process of deciding, it's all part of the fun!

Neil

[MalcBParticipant @malcb52554]

 

Yet another Ebay scam.

Be careful out there folks.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/252696157655

 

Edited By MalcB on 26/12/2016 10:23:34

Edited By MalcB on 26/12/2016 10:23:58

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Frances IoM on 23/12/2016 21:44:28:
choice depends quite a bit on what you want to do with it

I have a Warco WM180 – fine, the belt drive has saved me a few times during the still protracted learning when dig ins has struck – it will screwcut RH threads fine but not easy to get it to do LH – there is no mounting mechanism (eg T-slots)on the cross slide thus using a boring bar between centres for aligning bores in mounts is not easy
– the leadscrew is not easily disengaged so you can't use a handle to do fine movement – the chuck is held by 3 x 8mm screws so can happily reverse but the single banjo restricts altering the fixed relationship between the chuck and leadscrew – however plain turning is fine – Warco generally include 3 + 4 jaw chucks + a few other tools

Sounds like a Chines lathe to me – in several respects.

Some models do have a sort of T slot arrangement but none as far as I am aware have a traditional one. Just 2 on the outer edges of the cross slide. Use them and the cross slide may distort and seize up or go loose unless parts are rather flat. Once upon a time Neil made one for his mini lathe – on it I believe. There can't be much call for them otherwise some one would be selling them. The traditional ones will reduce the max dia over the cross slide – bad for the numbers game.

The lack of a handle on the end of my none chinese lathe leadscrew has never caused me a problem. There is no scale on the rack feed, i don't generally use the screw cutting indicator to do a similar thing but it does have a micrometer bed stop. I usually just measure and then finalise the size one way or the other depending on how accurate it needs to be. A 6" rule is usually adequate. Sometimes it needs to be longer. Sometimes the scale on the end of the rule is more appropriate.

I have had lathes with a handle on the leadscrew including a Myford. Can't say that I miss them.

The absence of any sort of screw cutting gearbox even ones that can only cover a very limited range and need change wheels is as I see things a serious disadvantage because it's such a pain to change feed rates.

The alternative is a used traditional lathe but for many there is no saying what it will need doing to it if it needs to be in very good condition.

John

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[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Conversly I find the two tee slots down the sides of my cross slide fine, would need to be very ham fisted to distort the cross slide to get it to seize and the larger working area than a Myford's Tee slotted cross slide is very useful to me as I often bore large items that can't be swung or fitted on the mill.

A handwheel on the end of the leadscrew is a very usful feature when you are having to use the lathe for milling as it makes it easier to put on a known depth of cut but can be overcome by clamping a plunger type DTI somewhere to measure movement.

Screw cutting gearbox, I've said this before if you are going to be doing a lot of odd or large threads then yes it is handy but most of the time change wheels will be fine. Myself I may thread cut once or twice a year and an do a fair bit of model making so the extra few mins to change over a couple of gear wheels is not an issue.

J

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

T-slotted cross slides are a boon for milling on the lathe – although if you can make one on the lathe you have probably worked out away around the problem of not having one… and then you will probably buy a mill anyway…

Neil

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Just something I heard some time ago Jason. People finding that the cross slide distorted. Maybe the bit clamped down was seriously not flat.

I just use the micrometer bed stop if things need to be accurate and a rule prior to that or that only. I understand some people do add hand wheels to chinese lathe leadscrews. I would have thought that they would be pretty easy to turn if the banjo can be taken out of mesh with the spindle. A graduated dial might be a problem. The other alternative is a dro on that axis. Simple one can be bought or BW Electronics do one that can be hooked on to anything pretty easily. It seems that the battery for them is a touch expensive but I understand that these do resolve to a higher level than the display. An area where costs vary rather a lot.

My lathe isn't that perfect. I try not to take too fine a cut for it. If I have to increasing the feed rate maintains the finish.

When I visited Chester they showed me some rather long vernier calliper type scales and claimed that they don't miss read or loose counts. A 400mm one would cost around £70. They were surprised that some one hadn't adapted them for cnc as they provided an output. Must admit the lack of similar ideas surprises me too. Hung up on steppers rather than measured movement.

I like to have a small lathe about and as I saw it the wm180 is the first lathe available so thought about buying one. Not right though so would prefer to try and resurrect and old one as it needs to be compact as well. Until I manage that a Hobbymat is mostly ok.

Pass on are these ideas any good etc but while refreshing my memory about the wm180 I noticed this.

http://andysmachines.weebly.com/

John

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Edited By Ajohnw on 26/12/2016 13:10:18

[bodgeParticipant @bodge]

Might be worth a look at —- Axminster Tools & Machinery ME series C4A bench lathe, A nice straight forward lathe with induction motor with speed control by belt change on pulleys , so no need to worry about torque / power problems or failed circuit boards i"m sure some will say it is a bit low on the range of speeds ! and so it might be, but you wont be long in getting the hang of it to make modifications of your own ,

Every body does sooner or later no matter what lathe they buy, new or s/h.

One thing i would recommend is learn to sharpen hss tool bits, some folk swear by tipped & insert tooling , but it is worth getting the hang of grinding your own

A clock maker of note once said " It is easy to make a small clock on a larger lathe, but not so easy to make a large clock on a small lathe"…………………….b

**LINK**

Hi all i got the link sussed now

Edited By bodge on 26/12/2016 14:37:49

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

That Axi one has some serious overhang on the topslide, should be good for parting off

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

The Chester 9 x 20 is very similar in appearance to the C4 ….but has the added benefit of a gearbox….and is cheaper….

Quality is good and generally I feel it a good first lathe ( it was my first purchase)….

I've added a vfd-3 phase motor conversion on mine, qctp and a few other mods….

For a first time lathe I feel it a good buy, 6 speeds, gearbox for screw cutting ( if needed) ….no motor or speed controller to burn out…. 9 inch swing and 20 in centres….plenty of accessories if needed….

Edited By John Rudd on 26/12/2016 14:53:18

Edited By John Rudd on 26/12/2016 15:02:51

[bodgeParticipant @bodge]

Hi Jason

Yes i see what you mean , but surely thats more just a case of winding the top slide back so as all the support falls under the tool post

I could configure my own lathe to look as shown , but would not try part off with it set like that

Have i got that right or have i missed something ?…………………b

[bodgeParticipant @bodge]

Posted by John Rudd on 26/12/2016 14:52:53:

The Chester 9 x 20 is very similar in appearance to the C4 ….but has the added benefit of a gearbox….and is cheaper….

Quality is good and generally I feel it a good first lathe ( it was my first purchase)….

I've added a vfd-3 phase motor conversion on mine, qctp and a few other mods….

For a first time lathe I feel it a good buy, 6 speeds, gearbox for screw cutting ( if needed) ….no motor or speed controller to burn out…. 9 inch swing and 20 in centres….plenty of accessories if needed….

Edited By John Rudd on 26/12/2016 14:53:18

Edited By John Rudd on 26/12/2016 15:02:51

Hi John

I think the Axminster one is made by Sieg which is why it might be costing a bit more ,

The Chester one looks a pretty good buy , all accessories included !! —– Just one or two small problems

A, its out stock . B, Chester have not been doing to well on delivery times going by what some have said on the forum……………b

If & when they do restock be sure to check for any spec" changes

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by bodge on 26/12/2016 14:59:58:

Hi Jason

Yes i see what you mean , but surely thats more just a case of winding the top slide back so as all the support falls under the tool post

I could configure my own lathe to look as shown , but would not try part off with it set like that

Have i got that right or have i missed something ?…………………b

As you say I would hope anyone using it would as you say wind it back so the toolpost is over the cross slide. Just seems to have a lot of overhang or movement, maybe the pair of grooves in the topslide allow it to be used for milling with a column bolted to teh back of the head?

[MalcBParticipant @malcb52554]

Hi John

I think the Axminster one is made by Sieg which is why it might be costing a bit more ,

The Chester one looks a pretty good buy , all accessories included !! —– Just one or two small problems

A, its out stock . B, Chester have not been doing to well on delivery times going by what some have said on the forum……………b

If & when they do restock be sure to check for any spec" changes

I would not just go off their web site if you get interested in buying from Chester. When i initially called to view a Crusader Deluxe, they were showing no stock when in fact they did have three in stock. Do a telephone check with Tony If at all interested.

Its always difficult to judge from a few negative comments on delivery which are usually the ones that get published. Its how many of those in relation to positive situations which never seem get published that matters, but unfortunately never seem to able to get quantified. You need to go off gut feeling when talking to them.

[John RuddParticipant @johnrudd16576]

Like MalcB says,

Give Tony a call at Chester…..get them to give a firm commitment to delivery.

I've had several big machines from them over the years, 9 x 20 lathe, mini mill, Eagle 30 mill and more recently a 626 mill….no issues with delivery… Nor with accessories….all round great service.

[bodgeParticipant @bodge]

Malc B

Yes valid point , I would phone first , As its a good deal for the money, have dealt with Chester in the past no problems……………b

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

I suspect some people find Warco's alignment test certificates reassuring. I would – just in case.

John

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