Sexism in engineering language

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, WEM had a very popular slave, and you could work up to ten of them in a gang.

WEM SL100

As far as male and female goes, this is the physical determination normally at birth, of most living things on earth. One’s soul/personally is a different matter, and I doubt that a taper or a screw thread would be at all concerned what you wish to call them, whether they screw/push on or into anything else.

Regards Nick.

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Causing offence to someone over something they cannot change is unacceptable and always has been. However some people deserve to be offended, in fact ought to be as perhaps they will change. Anyone telling me a barefaced lie is a good candidate, politicians, car salesmen etc. Friend of mine once said his role in life was to seek out prats and tell them. He makes even me look diplomatic

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

This thread WOKE me up to the fact that Common Sense is no longer that common!

Of late, to avoid offending the overly sensitive, even I have taken to referring to External or Internal threads

So how do we refer to multiple alternator sets that have to be connected in parallel?

One set will have isochronous governing, and the others will be droop governed do that each can adjust to synchronise with what we used to call the Master set.

Definitely an issue if the entire combination has to be connected in parallel with an infinite bus, such as the mains.

Should we ban using any word that has Latin, Norse or Anglo Saxon roots because of what they did to our forebears, many centuries ago?

Now, I hope to return to the real world!

Howard

[JAParticipant @ja]

I try not to offend people and I know some are when words like male and female are used for fittings etc. However among those I know, both male and female, these terms are not offensive. The one thing I did think offensive was girlie calendars. They really lowered the tone of the workplace and I now find it surprising that the yearly launch of the new Pirelli calendar was a major news event.

There are many things I don’t understand like non-competitive school sports. Also I am told that I cannot call a middle age woman living alone a spinster (a suggested alternative, a single woman is far, far, worse).

JA

One place I like going on holiday to is looked over by the Paps of Jura. I don’t think an attempt has been made to rename them, yet. [Howard beat me to that one]

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

It doesn’t matter what terms you use, some one who is determined to take offence will do so.

If you speak you are using offensive language.  If you stay silent, you are insulting them by ignoring or snubbing them.

You’ll never win!

And winning is forbidden, since it implies that someone is inferior to the other.

Is the prcess known as dumbing down, to avoid elitism?

Howard

[HollowpointParticipant @hollowpoint]

I’m with Kiwi

The woke mob can take their nonsense and shove it. In fact, I take great delight in offending the lunatics. Language doesn’t belong to them. 🙂👍

[Hollowpoint]

On Hollowpoint Said:

I’m with Kiwi.. …

 

Which one is going to be the giver, and which the receiver?

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, in my old maintenance job, any sexual type of calendar/posters were banned from being hung up of any gender, anywhere on the site, in the latter 1990’s.

Regards Nick.

[dodmoleParticipant @dodmole]

Why should myself, a bog standard male (in my opinion) have to change my use of the guid auld Scots language, attitudes and perfectly respectable actions to accommodate the modern language preferences of the rest of the world.

I now consider myself to be in a persecuted minority and as such should receive legal protective rights against the new woke (whatever that is) to go about without being offended the same as everybody else

[CHAS LIPSCOMBEParticipant @chaslipscombe64795]

The lunatics are running the asylum now.

As John Cleeves once said “it is impossible to find anything that does not offend someone”

[Diogenes]

On Diogenes Said:

On Hollowpoint Said:

I’m with Kiwi.. …

 

Which one is going to be the giver, and which the receiver?

I suspect you are testing to see if I’m offended. Try again, I don’t care.

[Alan JacksonParticipant @alanjackson47790]

All these woke, transgender, just stop oil, global warming issues etc, are just pushed carefully and deviously into normal society to disrupt and distable normal western society. We will never know the higher instigators, but it costs them relatively very little to organise and finance these useful idiots into doing what they consider their solemn duty to the cause. We can only ignore or laugh at its purpose and dispise the perpetrators.

[Alan Jackson]

On Alan Jackson Said:

All these woke, transgender, just stop oil, global warming issues etc, are just pushed carefully and deviously into normal society to disrupt and distable normal western society. We will never know the higher instigators, but it costs them relatively very little to organise and finance these useful idiots into doing what they consider their solemn duty to the cause. We can only ignore or laugh at its purpose and dispise the perpetrators.

…and if we do nothing, we are guilty, and no-one will forgive us. As for ‘normal western society’, it’s got to change, but not by inventing silly new pronouns…

[Alan Jackson]

On Alan Jackson Said:

All these woke, transgender, just stop oil, global warming issues etc, are just pushed carefully and deviously into normal society to disrupt and distable normal western society. We will never know the higher instigators, but it costs them relatively very little to organise and finance these useful idiots into doing what they consider their solemn duty to the cause. We can only ignore or laugh at its purpose and dispise the perpetrators.

Hooray, a conspiracy theory.   We can laugh at its purpose and despise the perpetrator!

Alas Alan, whilst you may believe in what you said, the evidence is that you are wrong!  For example, the idea that ‘global warming issues etc, are just pushed carefully and deviously into normal society to disrupt and distable normal western society.’  is incompetent. Global warming isn’t a matter of opinion that can be safely ignored by simply asserting it doesn’t exist.  If you can show climate change theory is wrong, please provide evidence.   Alan won’t, because there isn’t any!  (Other than the theory underestimated the rate of change, it’s worse than predicted!)

I’d be delighted if Alan was correct about climate change not existing but we now have 40+ years of weather reports that confirm science predicted warming, not 40 years of weather reports that contradict the theory.    The reality is serious trouble is brewing.  Not understanding does not mean it ain’t happening.   Ignorance isn’t bliss, it’s asking for trouble.

As what’s happening to the climate in the real world does not accord with Alan’s belief system, his opinion is wrong.  And it becomes toxic because Alan is a member of a largish group out to deny urgently needed adaptations.  Root cause I suspect is fear of change,  not realising that the entire history of humanity is of adapting to continuous irresistible change.   Our job is to manage change, not to pretend it’s not happening!

Dave

 

[Kiwi BlokeParticipant @kiwibloke62605]

Well, we can agree about something, SOD… Climate change is real, and supported by abundant evidence. I think that Alan’s point was that information is being manipulated and ‘weaponised’, by who knows whom, with the express purpose of de-stabilising the West. Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater, folks! It’s not all loonies and conspiracy theories, but it takes effort to unravel sense from nonsense!

[dodmole]

On dodmole Said:

[…] should receive legal protective rights against the new woke (whatever that is) […]

I have deliberately stayed out of this discussion, but I must just refer dodmole to the Wikipedia page, which gives an excellent summary of “whatever that is”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woke

The cultural progression of the term, from Leadbelly to the Grauniad-reader, is interesting … however daft the outcome may have been.

MichaelG.

[JAParticipant @ja]

Life and society are always changing and a lot of people look back to times, usually in their youth, when things appeared to be fixed and certain.

I can well imagine Neolithic men and women having very similar debates, or and rants, about what was happening on Salisbury Plain.

JA

[Alan JacksonParticipant @alanjackson47790]

I know we all have different opinions on this subject. But this man Lord Monckton speaks more sense to me. You can believe who you like but try listening to this lecture to see what is said.

Lord Monckton: Net Zero Emissions — The Costliest Error of Physics and of Economics in History – YouTube

Alan

[dodmole]

On dodmole Said:

Why should myself, a bog standard male (in my opinion) have to change my use of the guid auld Scots language, attitudes and perfectly respectable actions to accommodate the modern language preferences of the rest of the world.

I now consider myself to be in a persecuted minority and as such should receive legal protective rights against the new woke (whatever that is) to go about without being offended the same as everybody else

Interesting that a Scot doesn’t see any connection between woke and his past!   Happy with the Highland Clearances are we, and the characterisation of Scots as being mean with money, rowdy, and drunk.   Until recent times the whole of Europe thought Scots were uncivilised cannibals, a suspicion supported by a diet of Haggis, Deep Fried Battered Mars Bars, and no fruit or vegetables.   Scots die young!

Not long ago, Boris Johnson, whilst editor of the Spectator, published this poem:

The Scotch – what a verminous race!
Canny, pushy, chippy, they’re all over the place,
Battening off us with false bonhomie,
Polluting our stock, undermining our economy.

Down with sandy hair and knobbly knees!
Suppress the tartan dwarves and the Wee Frees!
Ban the kilt, the skean-dhu and the sporran
As provocatively, offensively foreign!

It’s time Hadrian’s Wall was refortified
To pen them in a ghetto on the other side.
I would go further. The nation
Deserves not merely isolation
But comprehensive extermination.
We must not flinch from a solution.
(I await legal prosecution.)

Though Scotiaphobia is somewhat on the rise again,  Scots today are pretty much universally respected, at least in my experience.  But it was a long painful fight and despite dodmole’s ancestors being on the receiving end of prejudice and worse, he has no sympathy with today’s victims.  Pity, because woke is about fighting current racial prejudice, injustice, sexism and inequalities.  It’s not about grandad being ordered not to use words, it’s about educating him about when they indicate offensive attitudes.   Woke has no legal force: if anyone wants to cause offence by gobbing off, there’s little to stop them.   Apart from the risk of being being punched!

Possibly there’s a high element of “I’m all right Jack” in anti-woke sentiment.  My dear old dad was fond of singing to the tune of the Interationale:  ‘The working class can kiss my *rse, I’ve got the foreman’s job at last‘.

Of course the woke movement has a bonkers element. It’s far from perfect, like the extreme anti-vietnam war protesters in Nixon’s time who thought bringing violence to US streets was logical!

Dave

[Alan Jackson]

On Alan Jackson Said:

I know we all have different opinions on this subject. But this man Lord Monckton speaks more sense to me. You can believe who you like but try listening to this lecture to see what is said.

Lord Monckton: Net Zero Emissions — The Costliest Error of Physics and of Economics in History – YouTube

Alan

Or viewers might prefer to start with Debunking Lord Monckton, which is much shorter, and contains various examples of Monckton misunderstandings.   For example Monckton confuses the surface area of the polar ice cap with it’s volume.  He claims the increase in area proves global warming isn’t happening, whereas 98% of climate scientists suggest the reduction of ice volume is evidence it is happening.  The ice may be spread more widely, but it’s thinning out, so there’s less of it.   It’s melting, Lord M, duh!

Lord Monkcton is not a scientist!!! He’s a right-wing politician and journalist with the gift of the gab, but what he says is only convincing if one happens to share the same opinions, and can’t be bothered to check.

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

The human race has spent millenia burning fossil fuels, and proliferating, so that there are many more to burn the fuel. And finding more devices to buirn the fuel.  So, yes, probably we are to blame.

But then the earth and the sun have their natural cycles, (In the 1700s, the Thames froze over so that fairs were held on it)

So mankind, is contributing, and climate change, whether natural or manually induced results in the viscious circle of extreme weather and wild fires which worsen the situation.

Apart from the obvious problem, the philosophical one is to separate the wheat from the chaff to distinguish accurately, what is within our control and what is natural, and therefore not.

It is not quite as clear cut as the propagandists would all have us believe.

Howard

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi Howard, one of the contributing things that caused the Thames to freeze over, was London bridge, and that was because all of the pillars for the arches, and there were a good many arches, which were slowing the flow of the river down at that point, and with a very low drop in temperature, caused the start of the freeze, which made the flow even slower, which increased the rate of the freeze. It hasn’t frozen over since the old London bridge was removed, and widening it in later years, helped to stop the chances of it ever freezing over again, which allowed the river to flow even faster. So the inhabitants at the time, through the lack of knowledge were probably more to blame than the climate was.

Regards Nick.

[vintage engineerParticipant @vintageengineer]

When I worked on IT cables, if we needed to change a cable end from male to female we used a “Gender bender” fitting!

[Alan Jackson]

 

On Alan Jackson Said:

I know we all have different opinions on this subject. But this man Lord Monckton speaks more sense to me. You can believe who you like but try listening to this lecture to see what is said.

…

That’s the problem. People get personal opinion and belief mixed up with science and wrongly call it a “debate”.

[vintage engineer]

On vintage engineer Said:

When I worked on IT cables, if we needed to change a cable end from male to female we used a “Gender bender” fitting!

“Non-binary” today perhaps?

[Author]

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