Sentinel S6 Steam Lorry

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

An associate of mine has purchased a 1936 Sentinel S6 steam lorry (full size) which he intends to restore. In the late 1940's the rear axle (not driven) was removed and the chassis shortened to enable tar laying equipment to be fitted.

There are no drawings providing details of the suspension and means of axle location for the missing undriven axle. It is his intention to restore the steam lorry as closely to original as possible and having checked with the Sentinel archive there are no drawings. This lorry is very rare and there are no known examples with only one driven rear axle.

Is there anyone out there who may be able to throw any light on this problem. Robert Butler

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

[Phil PParticipant @philp]

Is this waggon 9103 Reg KUX 205 that has not been out for a while, or is it 9101 Reg BMG714 that belongs to Chris Rhodes in Castleford and kept near Leeds by any chance ?

If it is the former, then contacting Chris might a good idea as he has been dealing with the same problem on his.

Phil

Edited By Phil P on 08/07/2016 19:31:09

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Welcome to the forum. Robert.

Diane Carney has an S8, she may be able to help. Also, are there any photos that show helpful details?

Neil

[Phil PParticipant @philp]

Neil

Diane's waggon is also an S6 not an S8.

There is only one surviving S8 and about half a dozen S6's in the UK, of which Diane's is the oldest.

Phil

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Thank you all for responding and Neil for your welcome, the lorry has been out of the country (Canada) since 1958, and has only recently been repatriated to the UK. The front driven axle is sprung almost conventionally with the spring fixed at the front but a cast slider locating the rear of the spring rather than a swing shackle allowing the rear of the spring to slide in the cast bracket permitting the spring to deflect on compression. From the slider the chassis was cut and nothing exists rearward of the original chassis. The six wheeler was a rare beast and with a single drive axle rather than a double drive rarer still?? (maybe only this example).

There is a well known photograph of an eight wheeler which when blown up seems to show no spring behind the second rear axle, I have put forward the suggestion it may have been fitted with a quarter elliptical spring (as Austin Healy Sprite rear spring) rather than a half elliptical spring. This would explain no evidence of the other half of the spring. As the chassis to the rear of the drive axle is missing there is no clue as to the design of the spring and how it is fitted to the chassis or axle.

I understand at the time this lorry was built Sentinel were short of cash so components may have been sourced from the parts bin

Phil thank you, can you kindly pass my contact details to Diane and ask if she would mind contacting me. However others involved in the project are familiar with existing Sentinels and her S6 may be known to them, but any information will be useful.

Robert Butler

[Diane CarneyModerator @dianecarney30678]

Hello Robert

My understanding is that the S6 waggon presently owned by Richard Hazell (8928 – UJT 333) of Berkshire is also a single drive rear – it was always renowned as a great perfomer – much quicker than ours. It was in the same stable as ours when we bought 8821 from Brian Richmond-Dodd (who had the S8 and an S4 also, at the time) and it had previously been owned by Dr Dyke, I think.

Give me a call some time if you like (number in the mag).

Diane

[Anonymous]

It might be worth asking the question on the 'tractiontalkforum', which is primarily for full size traction engine and waggon owners.

Andrew

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Not much in The Engineer, one piccy from 1929

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Thank you all once again for your replies, the S6 is a much later model than the one forwarded by Ady. The suspension on this S6 will be under the chassis.

Diane please excuse my ignorance but "which" magazine is your number in?

Robert Butler

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

There is a drawing of an pair of axles in 3091 but they are both driven rather than your single drive.

What number is the waggon?

You have a PM with Diane's number

[Alastair MacphersonParticipant @alastairmacpherson52003]

I have a lubrication chart for the model S which shows the rear axle to be a bogie with both axles sharing a common inverted semi-elliptical spring on each side. I will scan and post it later; have to go out now.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I've uploaded some info into an album here

There is also

180,4068,642,Countryman's Steam,Caradoc in 4in. Scale & the Sentinel S Type Engine,13,John Haining,"Lubrication,
steering and suspension. Front axle and suspension, power steering, the S type Sentinel engine"

in issue 4068 which may be useful (& me not got), Mr Haining did a few S series articles for ME

[Phil PParticipant @philp]

Robert

I have sent you a PM with Chris Rhodes phone number.

Phil

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Robert Butler on 09/07/2016 08:07:33:

Diane please excuse my ignorance but "which" magazine is your number in?

Model Engineer – Diane is the editor.

Neil

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Thank you for the various posts.

Sorry for the delay, Domestic Engineering Services considered it necessary to go shopping!

The Chassis No. is 9242 and the Registration No. is WN 9752.

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Just a thought several posts refer to a PM, i thought he had resigned but perhaps PM in this context has a different meaning – please ladies and gentlemen what is a PM and how do i access this?

Robert Butler

[Diane CarneyModerator @dianecarney30678]

Private Message, Robert. If you click on the poster's name (white name in a green box) it links to a place where you can click another link to send them a Private Message.

My apoloiges, I kind of assumed you would have ssumed I meant Model Engineer as we are on the Model Engineer forum. Sorry …

I've got a vague notion that 9084 was also single drive but I'm not so sure about that. 8928 definitely is though.

I believe you now have my number?

Diane

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Dear All

The Chassis No. is 9242 and the Registration No. is WN 9752 hope that helps

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Robert What Diane says only works in some situations. If you look at the top of the page there is a green line, your "inbox" will take to to your Private Messages, the evelope icon will flash if you have a message.

J

[Alastair MacphersonParticipant @alastairmacpherson52003]

The promised drawing of the S6 rear end is in my album. Both axles are driven, but deleting the second drive should give what you want. I wouldn't be surprised if the non-driven axle had the same casing with the drive opening blanked off.

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Dear Alastair many thanks for your efforts, regrettably the rear suspension for the twin axle and single axle bears no resemblance to what is in place on the S6 in question. Once again thank you. Robert Butler

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Dear Alastair many thanks for the drawing, regrettably the single and twin rear axles bear no resemblance to what remains of this S6, and the photographs such as they are of this lorry when operated as a flat when new. The undriven axle had only one wheel per side rather than twin wheels and was probably "pinched" from trailers made by Sentinel. I have not yet had time to make contact with Diane or other contacts suggested – work tends to get in the way. Once again many thanks. Robert Butler

[Diane CarneyModerator @dianecarney30678]

I thought I had this somewhere. Posted just for interest. The waggon in question in it's working guise as four wheeler.

Diane

[Robert ButlerParticipant @robertbutler92161]

Dear Diane the beast in question before export to Canada. The engine, gearbox and driven axle look to be in good order, the boiler is being rebuilt and the cab requires work. I will try and phone soon but some images of the rear axle and springing arrangement would be most helpful. Robert Butler

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