Running ‘nukes’ in the red

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

Ady 1

I totally agree, I am ashamed of my own country especially when visitors from the continent see our conditions, we got a lot of continental visitors in our area of East Sussex. Don’t get me going about the state of our roads compared to the continent, our transport infrastructure is worse than you would find in third world countries. Dave W

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

I think the opposite about nationalisation. .I would once have agreed with you but not now.

Perhaps the biggest problem is that far too few politicians of all parties, have such a woefully low, even lay-level, knowledge of anything Science and Engineering. If they even know the word 'Engineering'. They prefer the desperately debased word 'technology' – or 'tech' if four syllables are too many.

I doubt many of them would know which single metallic element is crucial to virtually everything in our lives, why petroleum is a fossil mineral but not a fossil fuel, how power differs from energy…. Yet they continue to try to make policies on matters for which such knowledge is key!

Regarding air-source heat-pumps, what Samsaranda tells us is pretty well as a friend in the building trade tells me. A Gas-Safe registree, (such accreditations are incidentally, an easy, hidden income to the Treasury), he admits he could not install such a system in his own home, largely by lack of space. He suggested possibly not mine either – although I could find room for the hot-water tank necessary.

Such a system requires very efficient insulation; replacing all the radiators (and if used, microbore pipes) with new, larger ones; and installing an indirect hot-water tank with auxiliary electric immersion-heater. That has to be designed for such systems – the existing types are not suitable. Installing in a new home as it is built is one thing; but for existing properties the disruption is considerable and at highly-variable but vast cost. The supposed £££ few-thousand grant from the tax-payers is a fraction of a total that can exceed £20 000.

It also appears from elsewhere that running a all-electric home with air-source heat-pump can itself be much more expensive than a mixture of gas and electricity.

Howver, my friend also explained, the boiler manufacturers are now making ones that can be adjusted readily from pure natural-gas to a mixture with hydrogen. The snag of course, is the country being able to produce vast quantities of hydrogen economically and in a "green" way!

I think I'll move into my workshop….

[J HancockParticipant @jhancock95746]

Probably time to close the thread , but for those interested in the 'facts' try accessing ' current-news.co.uk '

an industrial /commercial journal with all the past and up-to-date situation of our energy policy.

At one point the Irish SEM paid £4600/MWh to stop the lights going out.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Rather than arguing, the last ten years of data, averaged to ignore brief extremes, are easily accessible here.

http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/energy-data-and-research/data-portal/wholesale-market-indicators

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

It occurred to me recently that one of the few "high tech" nations that is reasonably environmentally sustainable is actually North Korea. I think they're "high-tech" on the basis that they have some kind of space/missile program and more than a passing capability in commercial and military nuclear power.

At the time of the Korean war, they had the bulk of the heavy industrial capability in the Korean peninsular.

All this time later their industrial goals have withered and although their per-capita carbon efficiency is quite poor, their lack of commercial activity means that they have a fairly low environmental impact overall.

No part of me wants to live like a North Korean. For me the truth is that this is the required direction of travel, to meet the environmental obligations that have been set out. I don't actually think people will put up with it unless it is brought on slowly. As I look at things, I have to conclude that's exactly what is happening.

Edited By Andy Ash on 11/01/2022 16:30:55

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 11/01/2022 15:30:56:

Rather than arguing, the last ten years of data, averaged to ignore brief extremes, are easily accessible here.

http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/energy-data-and-research/data-portal/wholesale-market-indicators

Never mind arguing, someone will have to explain!

In the good old days, one just threw another log on the fire. Now I have to understand Clean Spark, Spark, Dark, Quark and Crack Spreads…

As an aside, I've been impressed twice by smart meters this month.

1. My ex has a simple display in her kitchen showing the rate at which she should consume energy in order to stay within her agreed direct debit, and another showing her actual consumption rate. She can see instantly if a money problem is building. No nasty surprises when the bill arrives!
2. Discussing bills here with me, my daughter rang her meter in Bristol and graphed her consumption over time. The graphs on her smart phone show unexpectedly high usage overnight and when she's at work. Now the hunt is on for a rogue device!

Dave

[Frances IoMParticipant @francesiom58905]

Dave Suggest look at fine detail as most appliances will have a ‘signature’ power draw – high power external lights controlled by IR might be switched on by foxes but the most likely heavy nighttime usage is setting the night time thermostat too high (even gas CH has quite a respectable electrical power requirement for fan etc) – likewise poor timing for daytime.

[Mike PooleParticipant @mikepoole82104]

Fusion will save us, it’s only 30 years away, I think it was only 30 years away when I went to the JET project open day in the mid 80s.

Mike

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