Rocol RTD shelf life

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Swarf, Mostly! on 30/09/2018 14:55:51:

Again, I hope this contribution will not be too far off-topic:

When my late-wife was shopping in preparation for entertaining guests for dinner, she would attempt to arrive at the cheese counter and intercept the shop assistant when she was removing cheese from display because it was 'best-before date-expired' – she (my late wife) reckoned that was just when the cheese was ripe!

But her best story was of a visit to the food hall of an up-market department store in High Street, Kensington:

Shop assistant: 'May I help you, madam? '
Wife: 'Yes please, I want some Brie. ' (It might have been Camembert).
Shop Assistant: 'And when do you plan to eat it?'
Wife: 'Tomorrow.'
Shop Assistant: 'Lunch or dinner? '

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

If It was me it would go like this:

Shop assistant: 'May I help you, sir? '
Stub: 'Yes please, I want some Brie. ' (It might have been Camembert).
Shop Assistant: 'And when do you plan to eat it?'
Stub: 'When it liquifies.'

(And if you don't believe me I bought two reduced goat cheeses from Morrisons a few days ago, I'm waiting for them to go squishy.)

Edited By Neil Wyatt on 30/09/2018 16:22:47

[Phil StevensonParticipant @philstevenson54758]

I always understood that many sell by-type dates were there because of the packaging more than the food inside. Tin cans have a limited life (yes I know somebody had a bully beef sandwich from a WW1 tin and they lived to be 105), Plastic bottles of water are dated because of leaching of the plastic components into the water.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Just noticed on the bottle of sparkling sping water I was drinking today: "Suitable for vegans." Well, duh. You've got a big problem if your sparkling water is of animal origin, I would guess.

[Carl Wilson 4Participant @carlwilson4]

Regarding the query of the original poster. In industry, oils, chemicals and solvents often have a test date. This is to ensure that no deterioration has occurred in storage and that the product is fit for use. Certainly this was done in the aircraft industry.

That might be an explanation for the date on the Rocol.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Hopper, it just means that there are no live stock living in the water. What happens if a vegan, when eating an apple finds that he/she has eaten a worm?

When I was Nursing in a small country hospital, one of my jobs was a monthly check on use by dates for medications, and the likes of dressing packs and sterile instruments.

Ian S C

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

S O D.

The date on a can is meaningless, other than to persuade you to discard good food, and buy more.

If a can is blown, it IS unsafe. Otherwise the contents are quite eatable. (The contents were sealed having been heated to cook and to kill bacteria)

You would be horrified at how many "out of date" food items my wife and I have consumed without any ill effect, over the many years of our marriage. We've had more problems with supposedly fresh items!

Many years after Shackleton's expedition, someone brought back one of the tins from their supplies. The College lecturer opened the can in the morning, and put the contents onto a plate. When he returned after lunch, the plate had vanished. the lab assistant said "I thought that you had put out for my lunch"

As I keep saying, "Common Sense is no longer that common".

Howard

[egaParticipant @ega]

An acquaintance of mine insisted on referring to the sell by, etc date as the "death date". I thought it best to go along with this and never gathered whose death she had in mind!

PS like others, I am still using the RTD paste and fluid bought many years ago and am shocked by the price of the modern item. My tin of the former seems to have no date on it.

Edited By ega on 03/10/2018 23:19:54

Edited By ega on 03/10/2018 23:21:00

[Neil LickfoldParticipant @neillickfold44316]

Even salt has a use by date now days.

Some oils do go off, get rancid over time. Not noticed it with any cutting oils since 1984, which is my oldest cutting oil, and rocol paste are both fine, but not much left now.

[Mark Simpson 1Participant @marksimpson1]

Posted by JohnF on 29/09/2018 20:01:12:

My guess is its another edict from Brussels, an old pal who processes honey had to apply a best by date to that — honey is I believe the only foodstuff that does not "go off" it may crystallise but remained edible, no bugs ever grow on honey either.

John

Just for completeness: One piece of knowledge gathered from a medic who's seen it recently

Honey does not grow bugs, but it's the perfect host for a few special ones, keeping them in suspended animation for years… There are a few cases of Infantile Botulism in the UK each year, almost always attributed to babies eating honey. Outcomes vary wildy dependant upon when someone recognises the symptoms. KIds under 12 months are the only ones at risk; then we become relatively immune. Honey is very safe to eat, unless you are a baby!

I too have little respect for before dates, if it doesn't look or smell good, then don't eat/use it…the smellier the stilton the better.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 03/10/2018 22:54:20:

S O D.

The date on a can is meaningless, other than to persuade you to discard good food, and buy more.

If a can is blown, it IS unsafe. Otherwise the contents are quite eatable. (The contents were sealed having been heated to cook and to kill bacteria)

You would be horrified at how many "out of date" food items my wife and I have consumed without any ill effect, over the many years of our marriage. We've had more problems with supposedly fresh items!

Many years after Shackleton's expedition, someone brought back one of the tins from their supplies. The College lecturer opened the can in the morning, and put the contents onto a plate. When he returned after lunch, the plate had vanished. the lab assistant said "I thought that you had put out for my lunch"

As I keep saying, "Common Sense is no longer that common".

Howard

I'm not a great believer in 'Common Sense' myself – it's difficult to separate it from folklore, prejudice, beliefs, and generalisations. I prefer evidence every time.

In the context of billions of people eating food from billions of cans the experience of two people doesn't count for much – you need to look at population statistics. Good news – the statistics confirm eating canned food is very safe.

However, the purpose of canning food is to extend it's shelf-life, and the length of the extension depends on the contents and how it was prepared. The extension isn't indefinite and there is no universal rule. Milk is much less stable than Chutney. Whatever, it is nothing lasts for ever, though some foodstuffs try hard!

Unfortunately, common sense tells you nothing about the nature of any activity inside the can. Most bacteria are harmless, which is why 'common sense' rarely results in catastrophe. But, a few bacteria excrete vicious toxins, and others are dangerous pathogens. Some produce gas that blows the can, others don't. It's all about risk. The odds are much better than Russian Roulette, but every time you eat food past it's use-by date, you're taking a risk. Might be OK, might not. The longer past the use by date, the more likely something will bite. If you're a tough old bird, you might shrug off the ill-effects. Well done you. But what about the rest of us?

It's unlikely that dates on cans are an international commercial conspiracy designed to make me replace food unnecessarily, but I do understand that undated cans would make life more dangerous for babies, those already ill, and elderly persons in poor heath. To me, it's common sense to reduce the risk by dating the can, and I want to be free to make an informed choice. Not dating perishable goods is unhelpful and perhaps irresponsible. Of course anyone who believes the date is a confidence trick is free to ignore it.

A logic problem with Howard's rejection of Use by Dates is it requires him to put his frail mother into an old-folks home knowing the kitchen routinely uses time-expired canned food to save money!

Dave

Edited By SillyOldDuffer on 04/10/2018 09:48:34

[egaParticipant @ega]

Someone, I think, mentioned that packaging also degrades which reminds me that my RTD liquid's plastic bottle developed a split and it had to be decanted into another container.

Not sure if Rocol has been decoded as Ragosine Oil Co Ltd; RTD is, of course, ream, tap, drill.

[Swarf, Mostly!Participant @swarfmostly]

Posted by Howard Lewis on 03/10/2018 22:54:20:

SNIP

Many years after Shackleton's expedition, someone brought back one of the tins from their supplies. The College lecturer opened the can in the morning, and put the contents onto a plate. When he returned after lunch, the plate had vanished. the lab assistant said "I thought that you had put out for my lunch"

As I keep saying, "Common Sense is no longer that common".

Howard

Hoping, as usual, that the following isn't too far off-topic:

At very low temperatures, tin can change from a shiny metal to an amorphous grey powder. (I suppose that, strictly, it remains a metal but you know what I mean.)

It was my understanding that some of Shackleton's supplies had suffered this – maybe it was Scott's. Loss of the tin coating opens the steel of the can to rust.

My chemistry text book contained a story that the Russian government bought a consignment of tin ingots and stowed them in an unheated cellar. When the cellar was opened sometime later, there was considerable consternation!!

Best regards,

Swarf, Mostly!

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Some of the early explorers suffered from lead poisoning caused by the solder used to seal the tins. I have some ex US military MRE (Meals Ready to Eat) that I've had for over 20 years (traded a polo shirt for 3 boxes in the Jordanian desert) the outer boxes specifically said that they did not need refrigeration and had no expiry date….

Back on topic I've also had a plastic bottle of drilling fluid (not Rocol) split in storage and leave a sticky mess.

Robert.

[Anonymous]

Posted by SillyOldDuffer on 04/10/2018 09:47:43:

……. difficult to separate it from folklore, prejudice, beliefs, and generalisations. I prefer evidence every time.

…… it requires him to put his frail mother into an old-folks home knowing the kitchen routinely uses time-expired canned food to save money!

Where's your evidence for that statement, or is it just a generalisation?

Andrew

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