Proxxon collet size?

[jon hill 3Participant @jonhill3]

[jon hill 3Participant @jonhill3]

Can anybody identify the type of collets that the proxxon ff400 milling machine takes?

I have a funny feeling that they are a not standard spec which is frustrating as proxxon ony do a limited range.

I have tried a few aftermarket supply companies without much luck.

Jon

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

The Proxxon website is pretty poor but says the FF500 takes ER20. There doesn't seem to be an FF400, maybe it's a previous model., though a Google search says that it is a fine feed attachment.

[jon hill 3Participant @jonhill3]

Yes FF400 is now discontinued, I think it was meant to pair with the PD400 lathe or with additional table like mine.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by John Haine on 22/08/2020 18:02:58:

The Proxxon website is pretty poor but says the FF500 takes ER20. There doesn't seem to be an FF400, maybe it's a previous model., though a Google search says that it is a fine feed attachment.

.

John,

I posted this on jon’s previous thread :

[quote]

This may inform the advisors : **LINK**

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1204863/Proxxon-Ff-400.html?page=12#manual

MichaelG.

[/quote]

I think it adequately explains what the FF400 was

MichaelG.

.

Ref. https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=167233&p=1

Edit: The manual is also available here:

http://proxxonspain.es/images/pdf/manuales/2224304-M.pdf

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 22/08/2020 18:28:13

[jon hill 3Participant @jonhill3]

Unfortunatly the manual doesn't describe the specification of the collets.

Any ideas?

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by jon hill 3 on 22/08/2020 19:34:46:

Unfortunatly the manual doesn't describe the specification of the collets.

Any ideas?

.

I think they are probably ER20 … but that’s only my ‘reading between the lines’ on various Proxxon pages.

The machine is said to come with some collets … do you have any ?

… A picture would be worth the proverbial thousand words.

MichaelG.

[Dick HParticipant @dickh]

I think the Proxxon collets are a special design, you have to engage the collet in the nut before you tighten it in the spindle. Conversely if it doesn´t disengage on loosening you have to jiggle it a bit until you can remove it from the tightening nut. I hope this is clear but I don´t know the correct terms to describe this. I have a Proxxon FF230 (notmy choice) and I know if the collet is not properly engaged it will move in use.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

The plot thickens …
These don’t look like ER20 [although they could have the same basic dimensions]

**LINK**

https://www.hobbyland.eu/eng/shop/5-pcs-collet-set-for-ffpf-400500-proxxon/p-17921/

MichaelG.

.

Edit: At last, I have found a picture which purports to show the Proxxon collets:

Manufacturer ID 24252, as per the previous link

http://us.100y.com.tw/viewproduct.asp?MNo=64443

No useful dimensions to identify the style though

 

Edit: Alternatively, we are offered these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/c/1295140767

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 22/08/2020 22:31:33

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 22/08/2020 22:41:29

[Dick HParticipant @dickh]

Look at the annular slot that locks into the tightening nut , then you understand how it works.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by John Haine on 22/08/2020 18:02:58:

The Proxxon website is pretty poor but says the FF500 takes ER20. […]

.

The combination of that ^^^ plus my links of yesterday, would seem to confirm that the outside dimensions must be compatible with ER20 [even if some Proxxon collets are slit in the ‘fixed capacity’ style.

MichaelG.

[Former MemberParticipant @formermember32069]

[This posting has been removed]

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Michael, did you not look at page 4 of your linked manual, shows they are slit from one end only and unlikely to be ER as we know them.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by JasonB on 23/08/2020 10:26:35:

Michael, did you not look at page 4 of your linked manual, shows they are slit from one end only and unlikely to be ER as we know them.

.

YES, I looked, Jason !!

That is precisely why I wrote: outside dimensions must be compatible with ER20 [even if some Proxxon collets are slit in the ‘fixed capacity’ style.

… Did you not look at the links I posted yesterday ?

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2020 10:38:30

[Former MemberParticipant @formermember32069]

[This posting has been removed]

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2020 10:35:28:

Posted by JasonB on 23/08/2020 10:26:35:

Michael, did you not look at page 4 of your linked manual, shows they are slit from one end only and unlikely to be ER as we know them.

.

YES, I looked, Jason !!

That is precisely why I wrote: outside dimensions must be compatible with ER20 [even if some Proxxon collets are slit in the ‘fixed capacity’ style.

… Did you not look at the links I posted yesterday ?

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2020 10:38:30

I was going by the fact that yesterday you said "at last I have found a picture" when there was a picture in the manual all the time

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Thanks for dimensional description Barrie, Saves irritant squabbling. Probably a dimensioned drawing of all ER size collets, there seems to be for all other types, Crawford Etc.. And part of design is that ER collets are supposed to be self extracting. We all seem to have lost a great mentor.

Regards Ian.

Edited By Circlip on 23/08/2020 12:38:39

Edited By Circlip on 23/08/2020 12:40:55

Edited By Circlip on 23/08/2020 12:44:47

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by JasonB on 23/08/2020 12:25:53:

.

I was going by the fact that yesterday you said "at last I have found a picture" when there was a picture in the manual all the time

.

A usefully informative photographic picture of the collets which are supplied in the boxed set; not just a line drawing in the manual.
 

most others only show them in the box, with just the noses visible

MichaelG.

.

[quote]
 

Edit: At last, I have found a picture which purports to show the Proxxon collets:

Manufacturer ID 24252, as per the previous link

http://us.100y.com.tw/viewproduct.asp?MNo=64443

[/quote]

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 23/08/2020 14:06:18

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Circlip on 23/08/2020 12:36:54:

[…]

.

Not for the first time on this forum … I find myself wishing I hadn’t tried to help.

MichaelG.

[Dick HParticipant @dickh]

Just to give the pot a stir, I looked at a German Proxxon dealer´s site and they sell a set of ER20 collets for the FF400 for machines with a serial number beyond 401-10910 manufactured after 05/ 2012. Before then I think they used the Proxxon style collets with slits from the front face. Around 2012 the ER20 collets became the norm, hence the confusion. See https://www.fluidonline.de/proxxon-24304-81-ersatz-spannzange-12mm-fuer-ff400-pf400_3629_4029.

Dick.

[jon hill 3Participant @jonhill3]

Thanks everyone for all your research, I did eventually find a US chart that lists the exact dimensions of er collets. Previously I thought it might be er20, however another site had a table which suggested it was er16.

Having done some measurements from one of the genuine proxxon collets they are as follows: 4 Deg taper, 27.06mm height, 18.24mm diameter (widest point). However as others have said it is a non standard size and not an 'er' collet.

I will leave the chart for reference: **LINK**

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

For the benefit of any future visitors to this thread:

A [superseded?] Proxxon catalogue is, at the time of writing, available here: **LINK**

http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/315590.pdf

Within which, the FF400 is briefly described on p49

MichaelG.

.

Edit: and I also found another photographic image; which shows a different style of collet described as 24252

http://www.hobbiesguinea.es/es/proxxon-coleccion/2099-proxxon-24252-set-5-pinzas-portapiezas-para-pf400-y-ff400.html

… looks like there is a lot of scope for confusion.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 24/08/2020 09:43:10

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 22/08/2020 21:25:01:

… A picture would be worth the proverbial thousand words.

.

For the sake of my sanity, jon … could you please confirm which style of collet your machine uses.

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 24/08/2020 10:00:47:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 22/08/2020 21:25:01:

… A picture would be worth the proverbial thousand words.

.

For the sake of my sanity, jon … could you please confirm which style of collet your machine uses.

MichaelG.

.

< bump >

[Roger BParticipant @rogerb61624]

In an attempt to add more confusion. The FF/PF 400 (FF was freestanding, PF mounted on the back of the PD 400 lathe) appear to have had two types of collet. The early one looks a bit like an OZ but I think was a Proxxon own design is shown here as part number 24252.

**LINK**

The later machines used normal ER20 collets. The changeover from the old style is mention at the bottom of this site:

**LINK**

A German owner of an older PF 400 ordered the newer ER20 spindle from Proxxon complete with bearings and tolerance washers for around €100 (in german).

**LINK**

The Proxxon spares site (in english) is here:

**LINK**

Roger

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