Problems with a breadmaker

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

My wife has been using a Panasonic bread-maker for many years. She always uses the same recipe, brand of flour, and yeast, but the results vary. Mostly the bread rises OK, but has a distinct slope, with one end taller than the other. Once in a while she gets a pretty near perfect loaf, and occasionally it hardly rises at all.

We've been unable to figure out why the variation and, in particular, why it sometimes hardly rises at all.

She uses the same brand dried yeast and stores the opened packets in the fridge.

Any ideas?

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

If it has more than one heater element perhaps one has an intermittent contact so doe not heat up one end, and sometimes more than one fails, or the switch is dodgy.

[Bob StevensonParticipant @bobstevenson13909]

We also use a Panasonic breadmaker with mostly consistent results, however, it was not always so…..

I don't think it's a good idea to keep the yeast satchets in the fridge as temp is everything when making bread…we buy the yeast in small regular batches and make sure we only use fresh yeast. we also use the same tepid water temp every time and make sure that the Allinson strong white bread flour is also fresh…ie we don't buy too much at one time. We have also noted that kitchen temp is critical too and make sure it's the same each time we use the machine.

a friend of ours makes really excellent and tasty bread with her Panasonic maker but has developed her own recipe using equal amounts of white and brown/wholemeal flours

[BazParticipant @baz89810]

The long suffering ( her indoors) has had a Panasonic bread maker for at least 15 years. Started off with yeast sachets but got variable results, ever since using packet all in one mixes results have been very consistent, machine has one heating element in base and bread rises equally end to end.

[Gary WoodingParticipant @garywooding25363]

I don't think the machine has more than one heater.

Somebody advised her to store the yeast in the fridge in an attempt to solve the problems I've mentioned, but it had no effect.

She uses only Carr's flour purchased in 1.5Kg bags, and weighs 10oz of wholemeal and 4oz of strong white per loaf, which she makes every two days. She typically has one opened bag with one unopened in reserve, and always checks that the water is at approx the same tepid temperature every time. There is no heating in the kitchen but there is a doorway (without a door) to a heated room.So the kitchen temperature does vary, but, because it's an old Victorian house it takes a while to respond to the external temperature.

[Cornish JackParticipant @cornishjack]

SWMBO also has a Panasonic (12 years plus) and has mostly good results but occasional, inexplicable oddities – lopsided or heavy texture. Uses Canadian Strong flour and sachet yeast and measures quantities very carefully. No clues, so far, as to the cause of the anomalies.

rgds

Bill

[Stuart BridgerParticipant @stuartbridger82290]

I have a breadmaker, but never use it to bake. It makes the dough, which I then cook I the oven. Vastly superior results

[VicParticipant @vic]

We’ve had the same problem a few times with our Panasonic Gary and we’ve put it down to stale yeast. We use ours a couple of times a week and get great results from it once we realise the powdered yeast has gone off. My wife uses Sainsbury’s whole meal bread packs that you just add water and butter to but I normally add a little extra yeast to make it rise a little more. “Sloping” loaves are definitely down to not enough rise. Our Panasonic must be over 20 years old now?

[VicParticipant @vic]

Posted by The Oily Rag on 23/09/2018 13:25:41:

Useful thread for me. I am being pressurised to buy a breadmaker for our kitchen as I am constantly complaining it has been alleged about supermarket bread. Top of our list was the Panasonic machine.

regards

Ian

You don’t want to know what goes in some supermarket bread or where it comes from …

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Vic on 23/09/2018 15:02:51:

You don’t want to know what goes in some supermarket bread or where it comes from …

I heard a story in my college days that you definitely won't hear repeated on this forum…

N.

[Wout MoermanParticipant @woutmoerman25063]

We aRe on our third Panasonic. We bake daily, sometimes twice. Number one was used until the anti stick coating was gone in many places. That seems to be the weakest part, also in the replacements. But they are really good machines. I guess we get about 1000 breads out of a machine, so that about 10 cent per bread.

We vary a lot in recipes and sometimes they breads are even, sometimes not. But it always tastes vastly superior to supermarket bread!

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Batch to batch, flour will and does vary (Source – Friendly Master Baker)

[Adam MaraParticipant @adammara]

Thought it was me getting inconsistent results with my Panasonic bread maker using recipes, pleased to hear I am not alone. I get far better results from the ready to bake packs, Wrights Mixed Grain is favourite, and has a fairly long shelf life, but always read the instructions, this is what happened when I missed 'use half a pack' on a Ciabatta mix!

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by Stuart Bridger on 23/09/2018 14:50:49:
I have a breadmaker, but never use it to bake. It makes the dough, which I then cook I the oven. Vastly superior results

+1. I turn it off before the bake starts, then knock the dough flat and roll it up to bloomer shape, let it rise again and bake in the oven.

Mind you, since the sourdough loaves at Lidl, Morries and Sainsbury's have recently become so good, I haven't made any for a while…

[Grizzly bearParticipant @grizzlybear]

We have a Panasonic SD 2500 about 4 years old, had a cheapo previously, no comparison.

+ 1 for fresh yeast, it soon goes off.

Good results with various makes of flour, usual mix is 300g strong white and 200g of wheat meal or country mix,

not sure of the name, but its coarse. Add honey & olive oil + 260ml of water.

Regards, bear..

Edited By Grizzly bear on 23/09/2018 18:32:20

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I always thought it was in the kneading of the dough but there's also a bit of alchemy in breadmaking

Like with the making of alloys and steels

My own preference is Hovis White and their consistent results really do astound me

Other mass produced breads just taste like total rubbish to me, even the more expensive stuff

 

So IMO there's deffo a sprinkling of breadmakers magic in a good loaf

 

EDIT

With beer I believe the wort is a critical part of the process for consistent results

Edited By Ady1 on 23/09/2018 18:58:11

[MeunierParticipant @meunier]

Posted by Ady1 on 23/09/2018 18:56:37:

…/

My own preference is Hovis White and their consistent results really do astound me

/…

Have thought often about inconsistent results with our Panasonic machine and believe the consistency you mention is probably due to using large – enormous by home standards – quantities in their mixes where a small variation in quantity has a minimal effect and controlled water/environmental temperatures make the difference. Our kitchen scales quantities and water temperature estimates give a proportionately greater difference than with large mixes.
DaveD

Edited By Meunier on 23/09/2018 20:24:19

[GeorgineerParticipant @georgineer]

I've been baking our own bread since the village bakery where we then lived closed down. I've worn out two Kenwood machines and am well on the way to wearing out my second Panasonic.

After a lot of experimenting we've settled on 1/3 Waitrose green flour and 2/3 Waitrose orange flour – I've no idea what's in them, I just go by the colour of the packet ! I recently experimented with Waitrose grey flour, which I know is rye. It rises but can't keep the bubbles (not enough gluten) so it sits down again. I was going to add PVA glue but was over-ruled, so I've given up the experiment.

I've found that a draught can affect the loaf – our breadmaker sits next to a window and I have to be sure to close up before baking on a cold or breezy day.

I use Allinsons tinned yeast – Easy Bake I think it's called. A tin lasts me about a month, and the yeast gets noticeably less active toward the end of the tin, which I counteract by gradually increasing the dose.

For water I use filtered tap water which I keep in a jug at room temperature. I don't think the temperature matters, but sometimes our tap water smells of chlorine and that may well upset the megobs.

George

[Mark RandParticipant @markrand96270]

I'm surprised that nobody seems to be keeping a working yeast culture. Why is this?

[Trevor Crossman 1Participant @trevorcrossman1]

Posted by Mark Rand on 23/09/2018 21:58:57:

I'm surprised that nobody seems to be keeping a working yeast culture. Why is this?

Most probably because it is not easy to keep such small quantities of live yeast as would be used by a domestic baker working and maintaining a constant culture due to other wild yeasts present. It is much easier to start and maintain a sourdough culture in the kitchen environment, I started mine ages ago, some homes have them handed down from mother to daughter. I stopped baking yeasted breads ages ago and only bake sourdough which produces a more consistent, and to my mind, a better flavoured and more digestible loaf.

Regarding the OP's breadmaker, I don't have one nor see much benefit of them other than using them for the initial proving, and I, as others have mentioned prefer the oven for consistent results. However, perhaps the inconsistent results are due to temperature variation that particular kitchen, due to local air movement, sunshine, other heat sources.

Trevor

[StephenSParticipant @stephens]

Posted by Grizzly bear on 23/09/2018 18:27:51:

+ 1 for fresh yeast, it soon goes off.

+1 for really fresh yeast, it is surprising how much it can lose it's effectiveness over a short time period.

Panasonic definitely the best bread-makers.

StephenS.

[Simon CollierParticipant @simoncollier74340]

Even hand made bread, properly shaped, will invariably (almost) end up asymmetrical. You might check the lid seal to see if anything is jacking it open a little at one end. Make sure water is not too warm and killing the yeast. Have the machine in a draft free place. Mine is in the laundry and I close the window and door when it is on. It will help to activate the yeast first in say, a couple of tablespoons of warm water, one of flour and perhaps a few grains of sugar. Stir, cover and wait till it froths up. Deduct starter ingredients from the total. I weigh everything including water. I keep yeast in the fridge for ages without any trouble, but I mostly only make pizzas these days.

I have done a lot of beer brewing and baking in the past, and made sourdough as our regular bread for a couple of years. Ultimately, with living cultures, there is a degree of variability you can't control.

[Andrew Moyes 1Participant @andrewmoyes1]

I put the lopsidedness down to the ball of dough coming to rest on one side of the machine. Adding a tiny bit more water might make it self level a bit more. I’ve also got the impression that adding slightly more water makes a loaves rise more if they are heavy (especially wholemeal). Worth a try. I agree that batches of flour and yeast do vary as well. I’ve used Panasonic for years and it’s the one kitchen gadget that’s stood the test of time.

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

Why buy a breadmaker? You don't need one to make bread.

I use a recipe of 500grams strong bread flour, 500gms plain flour, 3gms salt (to taste, that's good for me), 14gms dried yeast, 2 tablespoons olive oil and about 320-340 gms warm water depending on how the flour takes it. Mix in mixer with dough hook for 10 minutes, let rise in oiled basin at normal kitchen temperature until at least doubled in size, knock down, very briefly hand kneed, divide into size for loaf tins available, let rise again and bake – and great results every time. Mind you, our mixer is a Kitchen Aid which has enough grunt to handle the volume; if yours doesn't do half measures instead, which is what I have to do when in France.

Simples!

Chris

Edited By ChrisH on 24/09/2018 10:16:50

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