Myford ML4 ?

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

Hi,

I have just bought what I believe is a Myford ML4. (1940's ?)

Is there a serial number on the bed somewhere to identify this lathe and perhaps date it.?

There seems to be just one nut which holds the headstock to the lathe bed. Is this correct, or is there a hidden screw/bolt somewhere ?

There is a shaft that sticks out at the rear left of the headstock held on whitha small bracket.. What is the purpose of this shaft ? The headstock is fitted with v belt pulleys.

Mike.

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

[RainbowsParticipant @rainbows]

Ahah. As a man who has [EXTENSIVE] knowledge of taking apart myford lathes.

There are three fastners that keep the headstock on the base. There is the nut between the bearing arms then there are two tabs near the right of the headstock which stick out forward and backwards of the headstock. The headstock is tapped so you will find the bolt head on the underside.

I think you are referring to the back gear shaft? It should have two gears mounted on it. It basically gives a low gear on the lathe for slow speeds.

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Know little about Myfords (I've got a Raglan) but I doubt it had a V belt drive originally. More likel

y a flat belt, I would guess, but I may be wrong.

[john brennan 1Participant @johnbrennan1]

the shaft that you mention on the left and rear of an ml4 normally holds the change gear cover

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by not done it yet on 25/08/2016 20:17:42:

… I doubt it had a V belt drive originally. More likely a flat belt, I would guess, but I may be wrong.

.

That's probably when it lost the back-gear.

MichaelG.

[RainbowsParticipant @rainbows]

Picture might help to work out what the thing at the back is then.

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

I will post a photo later when I get the lathe up onto the workbench.

I have read that early ML4 lathes had flat belts, but after late 39, they changed them to V belts, so mine could be original, if from that year.

Were these early lathes painted in same grey as the later Super 7 lathes ? What other colours could be used as per factory ?

The lathe came with a later factory cabinet that will have to be stripped and repainted, but might have originally had trestle type cast stands ? There is no large drip tray but a home made small one.I might get a decent sized alloy one welded up later.

Thanks for all replies so far.

Mike.

Mike.

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

My father bought a new ML 4 in 1945 and was able to pull the wool over the eyes of the civil servants of the day by using the business he ran as the front.

You needed a machine tool license in those war time years by buy new machinery.

It came via a London dealer called Steadall if I remember correctly complete with the 3 speed Vee belt countershaft unit as a bench machine pained in battleship grey. It came to me after he died in 1963 and I eventually sold it on to buy a Myford 7 about 30 years later for 15 times what Pop paid for it.

​Brian

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by sparky mike on 26/08/2016 08:04:05:

I will post a photo later when I get the lathe up onto the workbench.

I have read that early ML4 lathes had flat belts, but after late 39, they changed them to V belts, so mine could be original, if from that year.

.

Mike,

I hadn't realised that the 'final' version used V Belt

… There is an excellent photo on this page

http://www.lathes.co.uk/myford-ml2-ml4/

MichaelG.

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Sparky Mike,

​I forgot to add in my post that I still have an original handbook for the ML 4 lathe. I have copied it into my albums.

Because of a strange incompatibility with Microsoft Edge I can no longer post pictures from those albums on the forum, the appropriate button can no longer be accessed. Neither can I find a way of changing settings in Edge which might allow me to address the problem.

If you would like a copy please send me an email with your address to wood_y (at) btinternet (dot) com; all in lower case without spaces.

There is an underscore between the d and y

Regards Brian

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

If you look at my albums, you will see pictures of the back-gear assembly on the ML4. They weren't taken to show that detail, rather the actual headstock bearings. Irrespective you can see how the assembly works.

There is a lever to control the position of the back-gear on its eccentric peg. There is another lever to lock the eccentric peg in place. The lock mechanism works the same way as the tail-stock barrel lock. On the tail-stock the lock works to prevent sliding motion, on the back-gear the same scheme locks rotary motion.

There is no detent for the back-gear lever. Each time you engage it you have to carefully monitor the degree of mesh before locking the position.

There is a cast iron guard that covers the back-gear and a thin piece of sheet metal that screws to the guard casting to close the back-gear fully in.

Mine has a vee pulley now but it originally had flat belt. They came from Myford with either as a customer option, but early ones were sold as default with flat belt and later ones with vee pulleys.

I doubt you will want to paint it its original colour, which was a rather hideous shade of green. Not the modern soft green, but a vicious shade of malachite. I think it had a bit of yellow in it. I have seen flakes of it in areas of mine that have never properly been cleaned.

Edited By Andy Ash on 26/08/2016 10:57:08

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

Mystery solved re. shaft at left hand rear. It is for the cast iron guard, which was in a box of bits that came with the lathe.

The electric motor is fitted with a step pulley with the largest pulley on the outer end of the long motor shaft, but only one drive pulley on the bench mounted counter shaft casting assembly. A bit odd, but I have seen photos of the same lathes with exactly the same set-up.

Mike.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Brian, I had the same problem with photos until I started using Chrome.

Ian S C

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Thank you Ian, I also use Chrome as that will support the Norton software and Rapport protection against malware for when I am using the computer on accounts etc at the bank.

​I'll try it to see if it works for me.

Regards Brian

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

I have uploaded some photos to an album. perhaps these will determine the model ?

I stripped the motor today and found that one end was filled with sawdust.

Apart from that, it looks in good order with quiet bearings, so apart from a repaint, I will leave well alone. The alloy end covers and foot have been stripped and etch primed and I just have the centre section to derust and prime.

Not sure if this morot can be fitted to a Dewhurst switch, as only one set of windings are on the terminal studs.

Motor has a centrifugal switch which brings in the other winding for starting.

Mike.

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

I now have a list of the change wheels that are with the lathe.

65/ 60/ 55/ 50/ 45/ 40/ 35/ 25/

Is this complete set ,or are any missing ?

Mike.

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Mike

I had a lathe like yours to start with – it was a good introduction!

Click HERE for the best information I've found.

Norman

Edited By NJH on 26/08/2016 19:33:28

[Andy AshParticipant @andyash24902]

Posted by sparky mike on 26/08/2016 17:58:09:

I now have a list of the change wheels that are with the lathe.

65/ 60/ 55/ 50/ 45/ 40/ 35/ 25/

Is this complete set ,or are any missing ?

Mike.

I think you might have some missing there.

Not including the ones that are part of the tumbler, I have;

2 x 20

then

25 – 65 in steps of five

Eleven in total.

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

Thanks Norman for the link.

Good information on there and when I looked on there previously, I had not realised there was a page 2, so now more in the clear.

I am still not sure of the difference between the ML3 and ML4. Is the ML3 a longer bed lathe ?

The motor, by the way ,is an AEI and would seem to be original.

One other question, is the headstock driving belt a Z or A section. I intend to buy some of the split type belt for easy removal.

Mike.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by sparky mike on 27/08/2016 08:40:13:

… when I looked on there previously, I had not realised there was a page 2 …

.

I linked directly to page 2, yesterday morning

… All's well that ends well.

MichaelG.

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

The lathe came with the cast iron upright stand for the motor and layshaft. The stand which has fain numbers cast in, is MA 124 I think. A bit hard to decipher.

When I placed the stand on the bench it rocked and is seems that the base was not machined very accurately, or that the cast iron has warped over the years. I will need to rectify that before painting.

I have now found some marks on the bed which might be a serial number. I will take a photo and add to my album.

Re. " a good beginners lathe", my first ever lathe was (according to the original Myfords) a Drummond built around 1917. It had the cast in arch between the two headstock bearings.With the gap bed, it was amazing what could be done with this small lathe.

After this I acquired a nice toolroom lathe complete with collets. Then came a Boxford , then another Drummond but possibly built by Myford, a Super seven and now this ML3/4.

All in all plenty to keep me amused !!

Mike.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Sorry Entered In Wrong Thread

 

Edited By Journeyman on 27/08/2016 15:39:43

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Mike,

​The machine serial number is stamped on the end of the shears (front I think) at the tailstock end. The same number will be stamped on the spindle and the 25T gear locked to it with a 2 BA grub screw.

The saddle and tailstock were all identified in the same way, but I can't now remember where the marks were stamped. Don't forget to look in my albums, there is a copy of the original manual there which you might find helpful

Myford used the MA identity on a lot of their castings in those days

Regards

Brian

[sparky mikeParticipant @sparkymike]

Hi Brian thanks for the info in last post.

I could not find the manual in your albums. Maybe I am having a senior moment !!

There is a number, 163 on the 25T gear and there is a raised cast -in plate on the side of the bed below the headstock area with LH 163 stamped on it..

I found two small grub screws next to each bearing on the top side. Do these locate the shell bearings, to stop them rotating ? They are both tight at the moment, so I will not remove them unless absolutely neccessary.

Mike.

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