Micro Four Thirds : Lens Mount problem

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

From reading the "which camera?" thread, it appears that several members use M 4/3

I have a problem with my Panasonic Lumix DMC-G1

Both of the kit lenses [14-45 & 45-200] are currently unuseable on this body, because the camera is not detecting them.

Please Note: I am familiar with the 'Shoot Without Lens' setting, and that is NOT the problem here.

Both lenses work on my other bodies, and the problem clearly lies with the electrical sensing at the lens locking pin … The question is; what does the 'contact' look like?

Has anyone here taken the female bayonet-mount off the camera body? … and are there any surprises lurking beneath?

Thanks

MichaelG.

.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 08:21:06

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Sorry, can't help you on that one, as all my stuff is Olympus.

Unfortunately being an older model, unless it has sentimental value, it's probably not cost effective to have it repaired commercially. Luton Cameras seem to have a good reputation from what I've heard.

Are you sure the gold pins are clean? They should be self cleaning, since they are a wiping contact, but it's not unknown for there to be issues. IPA or a soft pencil eraser seems to be the order of the day.

Personally I think I'd be out with the watchmakers screwdriver.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks for the reply

I have cleaned the gold pins, to no effect [but may try again]

The problem appears to be that there is another 'contact' related to the mechanical locking pin.

On a good body, just pushing the lens release button causes the same failure mode.

[could you please check what happens on the Olympus]

… It looks like this body may now only be useable "without lens"

… This is not really a problem as I use it a lot with manual lenses.

As for repair …

I've just found the Service Manual, and now I'm certain that it is not cost-efective. !!

MichaelG.

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 10:04:35

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Michael, yes the button on the Oly has the same effect.

It needs the contact behind it to ensure that the lens is sitting correctly on the contacts to initialise the handshaking betwixt lens and body.

I think I'd just take the ring off carefully and have a squint behind it.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by peak4 on 31/05/2016 10:26:04:

I think I'd just take the ring off carefully and have a squint behind it.

.

Thanks again

… That's what I thought until I had a look at the Service Manual'

There may be four tempting little screws on the ring, but :

See references to the 'Mount Box Block" 

MichaelG.

 

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 11:17:17

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

Michael I've sent you a PM Worth a try

Roy

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks, Roy

MichaelG.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

There can be several things to look at on any camera that uses electronic lens contacts.

A loose bayonet fit. Can be either side and sometimes possible to bend something with care to improve the fit.

Bodies can vary a bit and if things are marginal a lens may work on one but not the other. Teasing the lens contacts out a touch may help. Bit tough on M 4/3 as there are a lot of them. I can't see the problem being the spring loaded body pins unless one is a bit stuck for some reason.

Not so sure about cleaning with IPA. It generally leaves an oily residue. Of late when optics are in need of a really good clean I have been impressed with how well those micro fibre cleaning cloths work. I've used them following IPA and they do get the residue off but do need some pressure. I don't intend to use them on camera and telescope optics unless a very real need but can't see them harming contacts.

My Olympus's don't throw a wobbly when I press the lens release button. Just tried it to be sure. All I ever get on some lenses is the open it message and if I try something strange with adapters the camera gets ratty. It's oh so easy for them to check that all pins are connected to what they expect to find.

We'll all have to wonder about Roy's solution. I always wonder why.

John

–

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

John My solution was to supply Michael with details of a gentleman who repairs cameras

I didn't feel it right to publish details on an open forum although he is a professional

Roy

Edited By roy entwistle on 31/05/2016 14:20:37

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Ajohnw on 31/05/2016 12:22:27:

My Olympus's don't throw a wobbly when I press the lens release button. Just tried it to be sure.

.

John,

Are you saying that Auto and Manual focus both still work properly with the lens release button pressed

… or just that you didn't get a warning message

Details may differ between Olympus and Panasonic, but, on the DMC-G1 the warning message does not appear if 'shoot without lens' has been set [except when 'intelligent Auto' is selected] … but the lenses don't focus.

… Your experience appears contrary to peak4

MichaelG.

.

P.S. Both lenses work fine on my other two bodies, so I certainly won't be bending any contacts in the hope of improving things.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 14:04:48

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Not exactly Michael. The view just blacks out if I press the lens release and try to focus the camera. I didn't try focusing with it pressed.

A decent loupe can sometimes show problems with both spring loaded pins and contacts but bayonet fit is more often a problem after a lot of use with different lenses.

I had a thumb wheel go on my EM5. Going on that the camera may not use contacts as such. They use capacitive switches so that there is no contact wear. It was repaired under guarantee and went after a session with rather a lot of wheel twirling when it was about 2 years old. They may use the same sort of arrangement to detect button presses.

I can't download the service manual. Just get a blank page but if it was me I would take a look inside with great care. I generally do because I feel what some one has put together can be taken apart and providing I take photo's at each stage – if needed – I should be able to put it back together. The usual first problem is how to take apart. The worst one is often the order in which they were assembled which of course influences dismantling. Youtube can be of great use sometimes on things like this.

Whoops should add that the loupe would come out first of all. Just to make sure a pin isn't slightly bent or jamming etc.

John

–

Edited By Ajohnw on 31/05/2016 15:00:24

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Sorry about the link, folks …

It must be some 'feature' of the ApoTelyt website

This link may work … otherwise you will need to browse the site

**LINK**

It's on the page about re-setting shutter counts

MichaelG.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

I can get at the one for a GH 1 not the one at the top for a G1.

Looking at that one it does seem to be possible to remove the front plastic cover safely without much trouble leaving the difficult bits alone. That may enable you to see if it's anything obvious on the part that actually holds the lens in place.

The usual problem is that the plastic parts actually interlock so that there wont be a gap. Often no screws on some things but in this case there are screws and they even give the length. They may still interlock as well.

Wish I could find similar on Oly – just in case. Also curiosity as well of course. Oly are even paranoid about some one hacking their firmware. Their servers actually do the update. Some one was playing with providing a fake server but don't know how far they have got.

John

–

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by roy entwistle on 31/05/2016 13:56:59:

John My solution was to supply Michael with details of a gentleman who repairs cameras

I didn't feel it right to publish details on an open forum although he is a professional

Roy

Edited By roy entwistle on 31/05/2016 14:20:37

Genuine third party recommendations are fine.

If you were offering a personal service a pm would be more appropriate.

Neil

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

I guessed it was something like that Roy. Doesn't stop me from wondering though.

John

–

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Might a dental mirror help?

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 31/05/2016 21:07:08:

Might a dental mirror help?

.

Not at all, I'm afraid, Neil

I can see the pin and the spring by squinting down the body mount.

Everything else is buried in that 'Mount Box Block' that mentioned earlier.

… The recommended repair, if that's faulty, is to replace it as a module.

MichaelG.

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 13:59:42:

Posted by Ajohnw on 31/05/2016 12:22:27:

My Olympus's don't throw a wobbly when I press the lens release button. Just tried it to be sure.

.

John,

Are you saying that Auto and Manual focus both still work properly with the lens release button pressed

… or just that you didn't get a warning message

Details may differ between Olympus and Panasonic, but, on the DMC-G1 the warning message does not appear if 'shoot without lens' has been set [except when 'intelligent Auto' is selected] … but the lenses don't focus.

… Your experience appears contrary to peak4

MichaelG.

.

P.S. Both lenses work fine on my other two bodies, so I certainly won't be bending any contacts in the hope of improving things.

Edited By Michael Gilligan on 31/05/2016 14:04:48

Michael, The Oly menu system is rather different to the Panasonic.

For one thing, there is no "shoot without lens" option.

For a purely manual lens, you just set the focus to Manual, and exposure to AP or Manual. In Body IS can be manually set according to the focal length of the lens.

On an m4/3 body with an m4/3s lens, depressing the lens release button on the body kills communication with the lens;

the aperture shows as -.-

the focal length goes to —

the EVF goes black, and the shutter release doesn't trip.

On a 4/3 body with a 4/3 lens pressing the lens release button kills the aperture display again; It doesn't focus either, but the shutter does trip, though the lens does stop down.

A manual lens, such as an 8mm Peleng, works fine on either m4/3 or 4/3 cameras, with the appropriate adaptor, and operates in MF, with either AP or Manual metering modes.

Neither throws a wobbly as such, but neither does it work correctly.

You don't get a warning message as such, the giveaway for the location pin not being quite home is the lack of aperture information in the Viewfinder/Monitor/LCD

Regarding whether the lens will Auto or Manual Focus with the release button depressed. AF doesn't work. Manual depends on the lens, some are purely fly by wire, in which case they won't MF, some have a clutch, in which case they will.

There's much more to it when you start interspersing extension tubes or teleconverters.

Edited By peak4 on 31/05/2016 21:40:39

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Posted by Ajohnw on 31/05/2016 16:50:07:

Wish I could find similar on Oly – just in case. Also curiosity as well of course.

John

–

The only thing I've ever found was an exploded diagram for the original E-1, nothing else at all, apart from user manuals.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by peak4 on 31/05/2016 21:35:21:

Michael, The Oly menu system is rather different to the Panasonic.

For one thing, there is no "shoot without lens" option.

For a purely manual lens, you just set the focus to Manual, and exposure to AP or Manual. In Body IS can be manually set according to the focal length of the lens.

On an m4/3 body with an m4/3s lens, depressing the lens release button on the body kills communication with the lens;

the aperture shows as -.-

the focal length goes to —

the EVF goes black, and the shutter release doesn't trip.

.

Thanks for the clarification

MichaelG.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Going on the repair on my EM5 they swap units rather than fixing individual parts. In my case the top plate inside the camera seemed to have been changed. There are places that sell parts and they seemed to be supplied this way. I was looking around to see what a diy replacement shutter would cost for a 5D in case I ever needed it.

In that case if a camera is serviced the cost of a replacement shutter drops by a lot because they have to dismantle to do the service. When the camera is serviced they ask for a phone number in case they feel the shutter count is at a level where it aught to be changed to save customers money.

John

–

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

There is a happy ending to this story, or at least to this chapter … Having determined that the official repair involves replacing the 'box', I decided to simply use this camera body on the microscopes and with other 'alternative' lenses.

I had, however, applied a very small drop of Servisol switch and contact cleaner to the moving pin [applied with the tip of a cocktail stick, via the body-mount opening] … There was no immediate improvement.

Yesterday; I took the camera from its bag and, as if by magic, it was all working fine

I can only assume that the touch of Servisol had eventually found its way to the right place.

MichaelG.

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

.

On the subject of lenses I bought a new one yesterday. – Nice thin DOF wide open. (you may need to go to my 'misc' album and click on full size to see it though)

Nick

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

O.K. Nick … I'll bite: What is it, and how do you intend to use it ?

I thought at first you may have bagged the legendary Canon 50mm f0.95

**LINK**

Sony A7 with the Canon 50mm f/0.95 Dream Lens

… but looking at your image I don't think so

… even the tiny sliver that's in focus doesn't look sharp.

Could you maybe post a crop of the central portion ?

MichaelG.

[Author]

Posts