MEW 214

[clivelParticipant @clivel]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 12/03/2014 21:02:44:

Perhaps MEW ought to feature an extended loco build series

Neil

Even though said tongue in cheek, I think you may have hit the proverbial nail on the head.

As a beginner I feel that I gained far more from the Stepperhead series having read almost every word, than I did from either of the two long running beginner's series – "Engineering for beginners" and "Everyday engineering for absolute beginners" neither of which I managed to finish reading a whole article and for the most part barely skimmed the articles at all.

The big difference is that the Stepperhead produced a practical product which even if one has no intention of building it, made interesting reading in seeing how the writer achieved his goals. Whereas the two beginners' series read more like text books, it didn't help of course that two such similar series were published almost concurrently.

I think that it is also why Harold Hall's beginners' series have been so successful. Because the focus is on producing a practical product.

So an extended build series for MEW yes, but instead of a loco, a series describing a compelling bit of workshop kit with enough detail to enable a beginner to achieve success. As for the project, unfortunately I have no suggestion, but definitely not another tool and cutter grinder!

Clive

 

Edited By clivel on 12/03/2014 21:57:24

[OuBallieParticipant @ouballie]

Oh dear!

What have I missed/am missing?

Quite a lot it would appear since I stopped taking both magazines some years ago.

Geoff – Everything at a standstill due to treatment (bummer to say the least)

Edited By OuBallie on 13/03/2014 09:59:02

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Please, please, please. No long extended series on loco building – leave that to ME.

I know that times, and we, change, but may I refer to paragraph 11 of Stan Bray's introduction to the very first issue: "Unlike its fortnightly parent, Model Engineer, MEW will not be embarking on the publication of long multi-part series of articles. Instead, we intend to deal with each project on a one-off, start-to-finish basis in each issue, so you won't have to wait for the next instalment to complete a job." I have to say that I think with some of the technology (CNC) and some projects (StepperHead) it is almost impossible to achieve this aim, but in both these instances these, and other articles are aimed at either constructing workshop equipment or new techniques, not about building yet another "motive powered turn buckle people creative machine".

Bray also says, in paragraph 10: "we will be catering for both the advanced and the not so advanced and there will be material too for the absolute beginner since it is only through the encouragement of newcomers to our hobby that its future can be assured. The task represents something of a balancing act to cater for all levels of experience…"

I think it is obvious from this that Bray was well aware of the problems that could, and indeed have, arisen with his brainchild. From my point of view, I think his original idea of "a brand new magazine specially compiled for all those who are interested in using model engineering machinery at home to make models, tools, and a host of other items!" was about right and that is how it should continue. Bray, in paragraph 3 also talks about the "intention to cover in depth the multiplicity of techniques….". And again, harking back to the newcomer, how are we to encourage them if we don't give chapter and verse on how to do at least some of the things that we take for granted. Newcomers to any subject, whoever they are, no matter how clever they are, need that initial "kick" to get them going.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Stan Bray envisioned a quarterly, or even less frequent special, not a monthly magazine. Series would have been impractical, if nothing else. The popularity and large circulation of MEW suggests that the balance isn't too far wrong, but like most things, it can be improved without spoiling what is good.

The loco idea was in jest, by the way…

Neil

[J A Harvey-SmithParticipant @jaharvey-smith]

A long and interesting thread. The outgoing editor has taken a pasting for taking his holiday at the local branch of 'Sheds R Us', and sharing his many varied and interesting snaps with us. I wish him well for the future and welcome the new editor. Maybe I'll renew my subs and give him a chance.

Quite frankly I seldom find much of interest in MEW these days. Too many interminable series interspersed with 'How to make a Three-Eighths Gripley With a Knurled Flange' type articles by authors who have spent too many years surrounded by three-eighths gripleys when they should have been getting out more. If the title were ME Nineteenth Century Workshop then fair enough, but I'd like to see some fresh ideas, some novel new approaches to familiar problems. I'd like to see more use of low cost tools that never need grinding – computers and electronics, for example, and why is it that even the simplest of maths is so studiously avoided?

"intention to cover in depth the multiplicity of techniques…." indeed, a pull back towards this ideal would be welcome, recognising some of the exploding mutiplicity of techniques blossoming in the 21st century.

[Martin HockingParticipant @martinhocking93749]

As someone who would class themselves as a beginner , even after several years of playing around with my lathe and bits of metalwork. I have found this thread very interesting. So much so that I registered so i could post a reply.

i think it's a shame that David has received a bit of a pasting as has been mentioned, his series has potential to be something good. However I think this sort of series in a monthly magazine will take such a lot of time that it will be very hard for a majority of newcomers to make use of it. Not to mention the fact that if you are a newcomer able to afford a lathe then you can probably afford a book by Sparey or hall which will get you going.

I think the magazine is still a good read which really depends on your interest some months will be better than others. The real problem that mew has is that there is a wealth of information out there on the web which is easily accessible not to mention a good 100 years of good ideas in the me/mew's past issues.

What I'd like to see is a bit more stuff on modern developments, I found the outrunner drill an interesting read perhaps a bit more of a discussion of what outrunners could do would have been interesting.

As far as beginner series go I think, a problem solving feature every month a bit like the old me letter pages were. Where someone has aproject but isn't sure of exactly how to do it or has got stuck. I.e. A bit of tricky work holding, and an experienced swarf monger could help in person, then it could be made into an article. A little bit like calling in the a team!

I like the short snappy tips idea that would be great and really useful. I think even I could contribute then!

cheers

martin

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Martin,

Another point you might care to consider, that "project" that has run into trouble/stop due to lack of experience/how to do it.

This Forum seems to do an excellent job in that respect, it's pretty spontaneous as well. That I would suggest is one reason why an article in MEW would fail, it's too late to help the original query, may be it might help some else's problem.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Welcome, Martin.

From a personal perspective, I find that articles which describe how the writer has solved a problem – of any kind or scale – are usually the most interesting. I don't know if all readers feel the same, but it's clear some do.

Neil

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

As an increasing number if not most beginners will nowadays be computer users why not put all the beginners articles on the website? Or maybe that would mean there isn't enough "editorial" material to fill the spaces between the adverts….come to think of it what's the point of a printed mag?

(duck)

[David ColwillParticipant @davidcolwill19261]

Posted by John Haine on 15/03/2014 17:24:30:

As an increasing number if not most beginners will nowadays be computer users why not put all the beginners articles on the website? Or maybe that would mean there isn't enough "editorial" material to fill the spaces between the adverts….come to think of it what's the point of a printed mag?

(duck)

I have always thought that this site is under used and that extra information about the magazine articles could be put here. I would much prefer a more concise magazine even if this did reduce the page count. It is easier to read 3 pages of well presented information than 10 of waffle.

This in no way impacts on profits as the good stuff is still kept in the magazine.

David

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Paper subscribers and casual purchasers of paper magazines still hugely outnumber digital subscribers, although the number of the latter are growing. But yes, one of my assigned tasks is to look at putting more content on this website.

I have spoken to a number of contributors about making supplementary information available online, and have already received one contribution that I am sure will be popular when it is made available. Other contributors have been willing to do this as well.

A limiting factor is that online content needs as much effort to edit as paper content. This means it is limited by the spare capacity of me and the other people involved in design and illustration.

Finally, it is true, however, that I can only publish what In get, and within reason the more contributions I get the more choice and the greater variety. Equally, I would not want 'online content' to be seen as 'stuff that wasn't quite good enough for the magazine' – it should be supporting material. An example could be research material that informed a design, or content like links or spreadsheets that just won't work in a paper format.

New authors should not worry about quality, what matters is having something interesting to say, and as this forum shows we all can contribute something. Just don't dive in a with a 40-part series! Write a short piece and if necessary I'll help you get it straight. The more you articles you write the better you'll get, and you can widen your horizons.

Anyone wanting advice can email me on neil.wyatt@mytimemedia.com

Neil

[mgnbukParticipant @mgnbuk]

Finally, it is true, however, that I can only publish what In get

Sadly, if that is the way that MEW is going to continue with a new hand on the tiller, it is unlikely that I will be subscribing again any time soon. That is the attitude from the publisher that has given rise to the current situation as bemoaned in the foregoing posts.

ME & MEW seem to be run like glorified club newsletters, not commercial publications. Rather than just laying back & waiting for anything to appear to publish, how about actually planning a publishing schedule and commisioning the content ? And then making space for any suitable unsolicited submissions as they come in ?

£0.02

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Nigel you will be pleased to know that even before his appointment was made public Neil was actively seaking out old contributors and also making enquiries with potential new ones to get articles in rather than just sitting back and waiting to see what came to him.

J

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

HI Nigel,

Please don't judge the quality of the publication under my editorship until I've had a fair chance to influence it and you've read a few issues that I've edited.

MEW isn't Rolling Stone. To get content written on demand like you want demands staff writers, and for a special interest publication it is very unlikely that the budget would ever stretch that far anymore (ME did have staff writers back in the 50s). Yes – Martin Evans was paid to build locos and then write about it, and the magazine had it's own workshop. They had a professional photographer at one time who would go and photograph peoples' models.

Sadly those days are gone.

Commissioning articles is very difficult as you are obliged to pay for what you get, even if you can't use it.

As Jason says I have tried to be in contact with as many established authors as possible. To all enquirers (new and old) I have been passing on my understanding of the sort of content subscribers want to see. I would encourage any and all authors to let me know what they are thinking of writing about before committing to a lot of work.

I also intend to make available a list of subjects in which interest has been expressed and allow authors to 'reserve' a subject. Not a commission as such, but hopefully a way of making sure the content reaches new areas.

In many ways MEW is a glorified club newsletter, after all it sprang from ME and that was, in effect, the SMEE newsletter when Percival Marshall set it up. This is not a bad thing – both magazines are written by and read by hobby engineers, not professional journalists.

Neil

[Brian WoodParticipant @brianwood45127]

Well said Graham,

I too would like to see how the agreement looks after MTM's solicitor has had his input, there was a lot of confusion just at the time Neil was taking over and an early task for both he and Diane was to remodel it in some way.

I think it is only fair to let Neil get a grip on the job and start rectifing mistakes of the past—-I am mindful of the praise Diane has earned after taking charge of ME; it is not an instant process and as in good farming, crops grow from tended land.

Brian

[Diane CarneyModerator @dianecarney30678]

To pick up on a a point made above; not that long ago Model Engineer had a Chief Editor, Assistant Editor, Techinical Editors, Commissioning Editors, (note the plurals) and (and this is highly significant) an Administrator. In other words, all those above mentioned, in their editorial capacities, could spend their days Editing and Comissioning and advising and building etc. The Administrator would deal with all correspondence, payments, enquiries, the requests for telephone numbers (yes – I still get them and am happy to oblige!) etc. All those roles, editorial and admin, are now the responsibility of one single person. We do have a head office with a small staff, but they provide the admin service to all the titles in the MTM group.
There is no need to go on to state the obvious and Neil has more or less covered it anyway but, whilst we do attend exhibitions, visit clubs, read club magazines and generally do the best we can to generate copy, one person still only has so many hours in the day and having spent, at the very least, 12 of them at the Editor's desk editing and covering admin, I am afraid that we are, to a large extent, reliant upon contributors coming to us, rather than searching them out. As Neil say … changed days!

Diane

Edited By Diane Carney on 18/03/2014 10:30:34

[WALLACEParticipant @wallace]

I do think the idea of a ‘subject list’ is a good one – I think this happened in MEW a few years ago when someone requested information on the types and use of reamers. The follow up article was the best I’d read on the subject – it was very well written.

W.

[michael coleParticipant @michaelcole91146]

Posted by John Haine on 15/03/2014 17:24:30:

As an increasing number if not most beginners will nowadays be computer users why not put all the beginners articles on the website? Or maybe that would mean there isn't enough "editorial" material to fill the spaces between the adverts….come to think of it what's the point of a printed mag?

(duck)

I think you may be wrong here, in one of the steam clubs i am in there is around 1000 members. There is a very good website but less than 20% of members have logged onto it including the newer members. There will always be a place for printed material over the web. I for one enjoy reading back issues of engineering/steam mags I do not want to be trawling the web for the same stuff. I get enouth of computers at work.

Mike

[Billy MillsParticipant @billymills]

I cannot agree with the last post. We live in a changing world, paper publishing is a very old media which is expensive, cumbersome and restricted. The future is more towards on-line publishing and individual initiative. If you are not on the web you are already missing out badly ( and not reading this forum ).

If you don't want to look at a screen then that is a self exclusion plan of your own – for whatever justification you want to make- but it has no influence on what happens in the years to come.

Paper publishing will disappear eventually. It is too restricted and expensive compaired with electronic media. The combination of text diagrams and pictures that is current publishing benifits from motion video and sound, For example you can show a beginner how metal is turned, they see chips come off and hear the sounds made by the process. If one picture is worth a thousand words then a video sequence with sound is worth ten thousand words- you see and hear the dynamics of the process.

I subscribe to some U.S. e-mags. I get them at a fraction of the cost of the paper version weeks before the printed issue. I can very quickly print any or all of the e-mag ( it uses a much better reader than ME or MEW use) and can instantly follow links to other external sites. I also watch Hack a Day which over say 28 days covers a massive range of ideas- some are trite or trivial but others are very good- you get to choose from the menu rather than the Editors preset minimal menu. Other dedicated forums also give the two way communication advantage of the e-media.

As an older person on a pension ( although still working) I do love the printed page, I have thousands of books and many magazine collections that I treasure however economics dominates and determines all human actions. As we read our last pages those that follow are a new kindle/ texting version of ourselves, to them e-mags will be the future.

Billy.

[Danny M2ZParticipant @dannym2z]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 17/03/2014 21:28:12:

HI Nigel,

Please don't judge the quality of the publication under my editorship until I've had a fair chance to influence it and you've read a few issues that I've edited.

Very well said Neil. Here in Oz it's called "Giving a bloke a fair go" and that is what I hope people will do.

Have you drafted the 'contributors guidelines' yet btw?

Regards * Danny M *

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 17/03/2014 21:28:12:

HI Nigel,

Please don't judge the quality of the publication under my editorship until I've had a fair chance to influence it and you've read a few issues that I've edited.

Neil

.

Roll on the time that to be able to post here you need a subscribers number.

That will sort out the people laying the law down who don't even buy the mags.

[jason udallParticipant @jasonudall57142]

Picked up ME.this morning and leafed through…several articles
that I would have been glad of seeing in MEW.

Lots of chuf chuf stuff too..
( can’t have it all )

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Billy,

last night I spent 20 minutes looking for a simple power connector socket on the CPC website without success. i just couldn't find the right keyword to find the section in the online catalogue. With a paper catalogue I reckon I would have found it in thirty seconds?

When the web allows you to 'flick through' a thick publication or a huge pile of 'virtual magazines' to find the half-remembered picture or title you seek and skip back to it in seconds, then it will become a bit more useful.

I'm no luddite, I have plenty of books and documents in pdf form, but the only disadvantages of paper are the space and weight and that ctting and pasting is a touch messier!

Danny,

They are still draft, but email me neil.wyatt@mytimemedia.com and I'll send you a copy.

Neil

[JoParticipant @jo]

Posted by John Stevenson on 19/03/2014 15:12:14:

Roll on the time that to be able to post here you need a subscribers number.

That will sort out the people laying the law down who don't even buy the mags.

It might become a very lonely place

Jo

[mgnbukParticipant @mgnbuk]

Here in Oz it's called "Giving a bloke a fair go"

My comment was based on Neil's original assertion highlighted at the start – a familar refrain from the previous incumbent. Neil's subsequent expansion suggests the comment I refered to was not actually the case & that there is some movement in editorial policy – had this been stated originally, my post would not have been made.

Roll on the time that to be able to post here you need a subscribers number.

That will sort out the people laying the law down who don't even buy the mags

Your point ?

I took MEW from Issue 1 & subscribed from Issue 8 to Issue 197 before I felt it had deteriorated to the point that it was not worth buying. I tried again from Issue 202 to 208 but found it no better, plus MTM changed the T&Cs by removing access to the back issues. I would like to take a Home Workshop related magazine & hope that MEW returns to being worth buying. I still check it out in the WHS Reading Room – and look forward to doing so to see the changes Neil appears to want to bring. But I have a limited workshop related budget & MEW has to earn it's place in that budget – my days of buying through habit regardless of content are over.

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