Looking for Linux useres and software

[BigAlParticipant @bigal15229]

Am I on my own in not owning a Windows machine? All of my computers run Linux. It is a lovely operating system and generally there is no problem with running Linux compatible software. Sometimes there is a problem with manufacturers of hardware refusing to release the small programs, called drivers, that actually operate whatever hardware they have produced but you become aware of this and simple do not buy that particular bit. That is no different from a Windows user not buying a piece of equipment designed for a Macintosh.

My big problem is that no one seems to publish model engineering software, or at least write about it, that is usable on Linux. G-Code is fine but CAD is, to say the least, difficult and yes, I do have the 2D program LibreCad (and in common with a lot of Linux programs, there is a version of that for Windows die hards). It is clunky and not up to modern standards. There does not appear to be anything that is anywhere any good for 3D, even more especially when you want to animate something – in my case a clock escapement.

I just do not believe that there are no model engineers that do not use Linux. Why do we not hear from them?

Edited By Alan Taylor 7 on 19/05/2015 12:27:20

[BigAlParticipant @bigal15229]

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

Hi BigAl,

There are a few references to CAD and other types of engineering software for Ubuntu at the link below. I expect they may be available for other Linux distro's too.

**LINK**

and here:

http://www.tech-edv.co.at/05_LUnIx/80_CAD~2f3d/10_CAD~20Links/index.php

 

Ed.

 

 

Edited By Ed Duffner on 19/05/2015 12:44:57

[Mark Simpson 1Participant @marksimpson1]

Hi Alan

You can get a free personal copy of MEDUSA4 on Linux. There are a lot of Linux users in the personal world for this product…. http://www.cad-schroer.com/products/medusa4-personal/free-private-use.html

I declare an interest that I've earn't my living as a user and still do working for the vendors of this product; but this is free so not perhaps not such a commercial interest. My hobby is turning larger pieces of metal into swarf; which may result in a 6" traction engine one (far off) day.

I can tell you that there is almost zero commerical (CAD) interest in Linux products currently; with the exception of servers for data managment. We've always offered some kinds of unix (well 30 years or so anyway) as well as Windows (Used to be Primos and VMS years ago).

From a vendor point of view, with the possible exception of IOS, there are a lot of compatibility issues across the infinite variations of Linux. You can do it, especially with a Linix savvy person, but there are far more obscure support questions than Bill Gates pet products.

Hope this is of interest

Mark

[Capstan SpeakingParticipant @capstanspeaking95294]

BigAl,

I think what you mean is, good Linux software that is free. That is asking a lot.

Draftsight 2D is available for Ubuntu and Dassault own Solidworks and Catia too. It is free and it is good. AutoCAD compatible in useage and files too.

3D solid modelling is niche even in industry in the UK. It is also very conservative.

Here are some choices;

**LINK**

**LINK**

[blowlampParticipant @blowlamp]

Here's a discussion on running the nurbs modeller MoI under Linux.

Check the MoI forum Gallery for examples of its easier-to-use capabilities.

Martin.

Edited By blowlamp on 19/05/2015 13:55:53

Edited By blowlamp on 19/05/2015 13:57:00

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Hi Alan,

I use Linux Mint v.13 although I hope to move onto v 17 sometime.

For CAD, I use an old version of Design Cad 3D – Design Cad 2000 (DC2K) – which although it is a a Windows program, runs reasonably well under Wine v.1.6. I do have to load the program first and then load the desired file into DC2K as Mint sees these files as a Dreamcast ROM.

I also have Design Cad 3D v.17.2 which is a much newer program, but still obsolete. It does not work anything like as well as DC2K, hence my usage of DC2K. Which, when all said and done, does everything that I need.

Although I have Mint 17.1 on the computer in a dual boot mode with v.13, I have not tried either of these programs under v.17 – after all, what incentive is there to change when what I've got works satisfactorily for me?

Incidently, I also use Paint Shop Pro v. 7.0 (PSP) – another Windows program which works ok under Wine.

So why am I using what is to all intents a hybrid solution? The answer is that at my age, I don't have the luxury of decades in which to come to grips with new programs. With PSP, I generally only use it to "improve" old photos and to convert "stuff" into the .jpg format, with/without any "improvement". I do not use any of its fancier functions. In respect of DesignCAD, either version, I migrated onto this program when the program I originally learned CAD on, Draft Choice for Windows, started playing up and eventually became unusable as Windows moved from W3.x, to W95, to W2K along with changes of hardware. DesignCAD was the nearest, and cheapest, that I could find that was similar to Draft Choice. I did try TurboCAD, but could not get on with it – I found it abominable compared to both Draft Choice and Design CAD.

And just to really through the spanner in the works, I also use a DOS based database program – Masterfile Professional. With a little bit of help from another forum, I now have this program working via DOSEMU in an 80 column x 50 line mode. Which, as you will realise, is quite a large area of text. And all under Linux.

There we are then, another happy Linux user, albeit with a hybrid solution.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

ps. Just to forestall the obvious questions, I used to be a happy XP user until Microsoft removed support, and ok, I understand their reasons for doing so, but I did not feel like further increasing their already bloated coffers to buy S/W which I already knew would entail further expense in buying newer hardware, and replacing existing S/W. I was already using Firefox, Thunderbird, Libre Office Calc & Writer, so moving to the hybrid solution outlined above was a no-brainer.

[Roger Provins 2Participant @rogerprovins2]

It's far from free but investigate BricsCAD

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Capstan Speaking on 19/05/2015 13:12:02:

3D solid modelling is niche even in industry in the UK. It is also very conservative.

I'd agree solid modelling is fairly conservative but like most CAD, it's a major investment in time and money, so users tend to be reluctant to see significant change within the programs or change from one program to another. That's not just the UK.

Not so clear that it's niche in the UK. Solidworks/Catia, Inventor, Solid Edge/NX etc are all 3D parametric systems and I honestly haven't seen anything else here since the mid 90s.

[Capstan SpeakingParticipant @capstanspeaking95294]

Posted by Muzzer on 19/05/2015 18:52:00:

Posted by Capstan Speaking on 19/05/2015 13:12:02:

3D solid modelling is niche even in industry in the UK. It is also very conservative.

I'd agree solid modelling is fairly conservative but like most CAD, it's a major investment in time and money, so users tend to be reluctant to see significant change within the programs or change from one program to another. That's not just the UK.

Not so clear that it's niche in the UK. Solidworks/Catia, Inventor, Solid Edge/NX etc are all 3D parametric systems and I honestly haven't seen anything else here since the mid 90s.

The number of AutoCAD users far outumbers solid modelling users and will do for the foreseeable future.
If you haven't seen AutoCAD or anything else in use then sorry but you don't get around much.

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Posted by Muzzer on 19/05/2015 18:52:00:

Not so clear that it's niche in the UK. Solidworks/Catia, Inventor, Solid Edge/NX etc are all 3D parametric systems and I honestly haven't seen anything else here since the mid 90s.

Pro/Engineer (Parametric Technology) had a Linux-specific (as well as Unix and Windows) version ten or so years ago which I presume was available in the UK. I believe they later dropped it – perhaps when they started the Wildfire interface.

I remember playing around with the Linux version once, but I only ever dabbled in Linux and the program installed (and ran) in the shell (not the GUI) which I found difficult and didn't persevere for long. If there are any extant copies around it might be a possibility …. although Pro/E of that vintage is not exactly intuitive if you haven't received training.

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Onshape is browser based so not limited to any operating system, works on Linux and Mac OS

Also 3D parametric.

[Jesse Hancock 1Participant @jessehancock1]

I run ubuntu and I have run Linux in one shape or form since 2006.

I remember buying the kids (+me) a commodore 64 for Christmas, I think it was 1982/3 hoping that we could all gain by the experience. After a while the wife became very annoyed with it as the kids only wanted to play Falkland Patrol whilst arguing who's go it was and wasting hour on hour reloading games. I kidded myself about getting a job in computing messing about into the wee hours for years.

I dropped MS as it seemed to me that they continually upgrade their software in a way which forces users to pay again. The upgrades appeared dubious to me as well and in some cases in the past really felt retro grade. The final straw not supporting XP.

I do have Easycad 2 which has absolutely no glitter but I've always found it EASY to use with adequate results for a layman who's not interested in designing the next space shuttle.

I'm no longer terribly interested in the guts of computing being happy to float along and use it just for pleasure and using my money where I need to use it. (Buying tools and making swarf) Linux are in the habit of upgrading regularly as well but it dose not cost anything.

Edited By Jesse Hancock 1 on 20/05/2015 07:39:40

[Paul BarrettParticipant @paulbarrett57424]

Try Freecad. It was designed for Linux and is very good. Huge following and loads of tutorials available on You tube.

[An OtherParticipant @another21905]

Hi, Al,

Sorry I dont have a Linux CAD app to recommend, but the following may be useful.

Like you, I have been using Linux for over 10 years (now Linux Mint 17.1), and had a similar problem with CAD.

LibreCad is an ongoing development project (There are daily updates available for download), but it still need some work.

I also tried WINE in Linux so I could run a WIndows CAD, but WINE is terrible, and many WIndows apps don't run, or run badly under it, so eventually I used Oracle VirtualBox.

**LINK**

I can strongly recommend VirtualBox – usual disclaimer – it sets up a virtual machine under Linux, and then you can install any OS (in my case XP) in this virtual machine. XP runs perfectly in the virtual machine, and provides access to all the computer functions – printer, network etc. I open the Virtualbox tool in a second workspace on Mint, so I can move from Mint on one workspace to XP on another as I work…easy.

I wanted also to run Microlabs Pickit 2 in order to program PIC controller ICs – It can only be run in a terminal under Linux, so is a bit fiddly to use, but in XP under VirtualBox the GUI works fine, making life much easier.

There is also the advantage that if care is taken with the setup, there is little risk of virus infection using Windows like this, and little risk of it affecting Linux, so no need to mess about with Virus Killers.

[doubletopParticipant @doubletop]

I run Ubuntu 14.04 with a number of Windows programs being successfully run under Wine. For those Windows programs that have problems with Linux and Wine I have an old XP box on the network that has no display or keyboard. I access it with the Remmina remote desktop client. The Remmina desktop is as good as running programs directly on a Windows system. Wake on LAN for the box means it can live in a cupboard, dormant until I need it

If you are concerned about XP not being updated run the registry patch that makes XP think it's in an embedded POS system and you'll be getting patches for another 4 years.

Pete

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Capstan Speaking on 19/05/2015 19:22:35:

Posted by Muzzer on 19/05/2015 18:52:00:

Posted by Capstan Speaking on 19/05/2015 13:12:02:

3D solid modelling is niche even in industry in the UK. It is also very conservative.

I'd agree solid modelling is fairly conservative but like most CAD, it's a major investment in time and money, so users tend to be reluctant to see significant change within the programs or change from one program to another. That's not just the UK.

Not so clear that it's niche in the UK. Solidworks/Catia, Inventor, Solid Edge/NX etc are all 3D parametric systems and I honestly haven't seen anything else here since the mid 90s.

The number of AutoCAD users far outumbers solid modelling users and will do for the foreseeable future.
If you haven't seen AutoCAD or anything else in use then sorry but you don't get around much.

Haha, funny. No idea where you get those numbers from!

Been working full time in product development (industrial, commercial, automotive) for the last 30 years, as engineering manager / director in charge of mech and electronics PD design. The only time I've seen 2D Autocad in the last 20 years is on the amateur sites. Some people persist with what they learnt decades ago (conservative, as you say) but when you compare "3D"(??) Autocad 13 onwards etc to proper parametric CAD, you have to wonder why.

Murray

[Another JohnSParticipant @anotherjohns]

Linux user here – have NEVER owned a windows machine, nor have had one at work since 1995 (mind you, getting a windows 7 box shortly for email and time sheets – ho hum)

I do use QCad, (paid for) CamBam (paid for) sometimes FreeCAD, OpenSCAD, and of course LinuxCNC. Might try BRLCad on it; Mark – thank you for that Medusa4 link!

Did use Rhino on OSX at one point, but don't know if it survived a recent OS update or not.

Not sure I like "renting" software, especially as lots of areas are either not Internettable, so license checking on application startup is a bit of a problem.

[BigAlParticipant @bigal15229]

Thank you one and all for the replies to my post. Linux is the so called 'free' operating system. It is widely understood that 'free' means that there is no cost to the user. A lot of the time the understanding stops there. While that is true it is not by any means the end of the story. A more in depth meaning is that it is a community software. Each and every part of a Linux operating system, or the programs that run on it are written by people who are skilled at writing that sort of thing. Because 'free' also means that the actual code is freely available every part of both the system and the programs can and is shared with the community. Those who have both the skills necessary, and the time, help to develop and improve all parts. Linux is free software, More importantly it is 'open source' software. To create a metaphor, look at science over the aeons of time. If those who we now call scientists had not shared their core ideas modern scientists would not be in a position to either test, develop or build on them. Exactly what are we doing on this and any other forum, apart from sharing our ideas and thoughts.

We drive on the left side of the road. Other nations choose the right. Never the less there are rules. Because those rules are publicly and freely available they are used by everyone. There are rules on the internet. There has to be otherwise it wouldn't work. The biggest inhibition with proprietary operating systems is that the owners do not release the source code. That results in a closed shop. The originators only write for commercial gain. No one can add, no one can develop, and no one can improve. What would our wide variety of tools have been like if you were not allowed to add your own little tweaks? How about not being able to add a DRO to your milling machine.

I use Linux Mint version 17.1. It is the current version. Wine has been mentioned. Wine is an emulator. It stands between Linux and Windows and supposedly allows Linux users to access and use Windows software. Sometime it works, sometimes it doesn't and somewhere it falls between the two. I will not use it. It hogs my precious resources but more to the point it defeats the whole ideal of Linux. I started this post to try to find out what software other Model Engineer Linux users are using. I highlighted CAD and am very grateful for all the suggestions that have been made. I could have highlighted desk top publishing if I was particularly interested in it. Or how about photo editing and yes, I do use 'Gimp' (and even use it in my Windows days). The point is that there is Linux software out there for most things. That a lot of it needs improving it is true, but there again, that can be said of most software no matter what operating system it runs on. Will the improvements get done. On one hand the answer is yes, but with the caveat that there will be some money to be made out of it. On the other hand the answer is also yes. The caveat this time is if the users want it. I opt for the second yes.

Okay, I am preaching but I'm converted and have been for a long time. Sorry. I'll stop. Thank you again for everyone’s input. It is what 'community' is all about.

BigAl

[blowlampParticipant @blowlamp]

I can't see how running 'Wine' defeats the purpose of Linux, it simply allows you to use software that isn't currently available for that Operating System – bear in mind that it's written by supporters of Linux to help users of Linux.

There are quite a few people running MoI flawlessly on Linux, so it is a viable proposition. However, its developer (Michael Gibson, the author of Rhino) is not in a position to work full-time without reward. I think you perhaps should have stated in your original post that you were looking for free software only.

Martin.

[Peter G. ShawParticipant @peterg-shaw75338]

Wine has been mentioned. Wine is an emulator. It stands between Linux and Windows and supposedly allows Linux users to access and use Windows software. Sometime it works, sometimes it doesn't and somewhere it falls between the two. I will not use it. It hogs my precious resources but more to the point it defeats the whole ideal of Linux.

Is the computer a tool, or is it a toy? And how many years do you have left on this planet? If you consider it to be a toy, or you have a reasonable expectation of a further couple of decades of life, then your argument is ok. But, if like me you consider it to be a tool, or you have arguably at most a further decade of reasonable life, then your argument simply does not hold water. As I said, I have a hybrid solution which does what I want, and most importantly, will see me out leaving what time I have left to be spent on doing things I wish to do, of which learning new software is not one of them.

On my machines, Wine works with the programs mentioned. Is it a resource hog? I neither know nor care, the programs work fast enough for me.

Does using Wine defeat the objective of Linux? Utter, absolute rubbish. Linux is an operating system, nothing more, nothing less, and the only advantage it has over Windows is that it is free. It is not the be all, and end all of computing, although some people would have you think otherwise. The plain fact of the matter is that Wine has been created to allow people to use Windows based programs, and if it was not available, then I suggest that there may well be fewer users of Linux.

Regards,

Peter G. Shaw

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Another Linux user here.

Why do I use it? Top of my list must be reliability. Crashes are very rare, viruses non existant and if I do have a system problem it's usually caused by finger trouble and I can ask for help on one of the forums and get the solution usually in minutes. Next comes performance. It comes without all the bloatware that is shipped with Windows and slows everything down.

O.K. it's free but for most people so is Windows. Just try buying a PC without it. Where the big advantage comes is the cost of software. That is mostly free.

Engineering software: I mostly use Draftsight for CAD and then DXF2GCODE and F-Engrave to generate gcode. I must admit that I have tried FreeCAD but couldn't get on with it, having been used to Solidworks for years.

Other good software: LibreOffice, Firefox, GIMP, K3b, Eagle, Calibre, the list goes on.

I expect that nearly everyone here is now using Linux, many without realising it. Strictly speaking "Linux" refers to the operating system kernel not the familiar user interface. Android is now everywhere in tablets, phones, and televisions. You guessed it. The kernel of Android is Linux.

Russell.

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