Latest ME, ELS Article

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

tells us that the next edition will continue the tale of fitting an ELS to a lathe, which will make gear cutting very simple. I'm all agog.

Having picked that nit, I've got the same system on my lathe, it is well worth the small effort in fitting it.. Metric and imperial threads at the touch of a button, any pitch you like (not tried BA but I can't see why not)

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

I have just read the article in ME..but cant find the kit mentioned from clough42 is it on eBay?

i would like to fit a system on a Colchester student..will it handle 6tpi and 4.5 tpi threads? 2 inches diameter in steel?

[Mike PooleParticipant @mikepoole82104]

Posted by Ian Parkin on 09/09/2023 16:00:18:

I have just read the article in ME..but cant find the kit mentioned from clough42 is it on eBay?

i would like to fit a system on a Colchester student..will it handle 6tpi and 4.5 tpi threads? 2 inches diameter in steel?

The table of threads for the Clough42 ELS can be modified to include any pitch or tpi you would find useful. It is not a feature but as the software is open source you can find the places to modify quite easily even if you are not a programmer.

Mike

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

Mike

i was more thinking of the cutting loads driving the lead screw quite fast with large chip loads

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Text says Cloough42 sells the controller not the stepper or power supply so it's really upto you to sort the hardware(stepper) to be upto the job.

His Shop

Follow the links to the Youtube videos to see what you get and what you provide

 

Edited By JasonB on 09/09/2023 18:12:06

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Why is an article on fitting a ELS in ME and not MEW?

Robert.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

There are often "workshop" type articles in ME, makes a change from all the Loco stuff.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Posted by Ian Parkin on 09/09/2023 16:00:18:

i would like to fit a system on a Colchester student..will it handle 6tpi and 4.5 tpi threads? 2 inches diameter in steel?

It would be a lot cheaper to just get the extra change wheels to modify the existing thread selections on the QCGB. However it is such a capable lathe that if they didn't provide for such a course thread it might be unwise to try it, especially if you insist on high chip load,

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

A small note for anyone wanting more grunt for whatever reason

It apparently depends upon the voltage, so 24V if you're on a hobby setup, 48V for more power and 72V if you're a real man

The Mach3 guys have lots of threads on stepper voltage

Nema 17 at the bottom, Nema 23 in the middle and 34 is the biggie

However there are more alternatives, AC servo motors and other kit that industrial level guys use, it's actually a pretty huge and diverse industry and you need to check that the route you take has the software as well as the hardware to do the job you want if you take a different path

Edited By Ady1 on 10/09/2023 09:14:29

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Could a mod perhaps change the title

Latest Issue of ME – ELS (electronic leadscrew)

kinda thing

and delete this post.

ta

[Bob WorsleyParticipant @bobworsley31976]

I was interested to see that there is no feedback encoder on the lead screw, so the assumption that a step always happens is made. As a post says, will it work with 4.5tpi?

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

I fitted a 4Nm closed loop stepper motor to my lathe when I followed James Clough's series for adding an ELS. The closed loop stepper eliminated "lost" steps by virtue of some clever electronic wizardry and/or software manipulation of data which I can't pretend to understand. The setup never gave me a moment's trouble and as far as I know continues to give faultless service in its new owner's hands. Interested parties can waste lots of time by watching the ups and downs of the installation on YouTube.

The journey starts here.

There's quite a number of episodes and a lot is specific to my lathe so can easily be skipped through.

John

Edited to make it slightly less unreadable.

Edited By John Hinkley on 10/09/2023 10:01:19

[Ian ParkinParticipant @ianparkin39383]

I do make quite a few 6tpi whit form 1 3/8 and 1 1/2 and 2” 4.5 tpi a month

it always involves a lot of gear changing cover removal etc…even though a student has the gearbox to do a 3 tpi …but with a change of driver gear.

then changing it all back again to do finer threads and the metric ones i do ( 3.5mm)

i wondered if a ELS would make it better..i did fondly imagine that there was an encoder on the leadscrew too so the start and stop could be automated..i do have problems engaging and disconnecting the handle particularly when doing deep blind holes and usually leave the handle engaged and reverse out

[simondavies3Participant @simondavies3]

Posted by John Hinkley on 10/09/2023 09:59:02:

I fitted a 4Nm closed loop stepper motor to my lathe when I followed James Clough's series for adding an ELS. The closed loop stepper eliminated "lost" steps by virtue of some clever electronic wizardry and/or software manipulation of data which I can't pretend to understand.

John

I went down the same route using a closed loop stepper and I have had no issues at all since installing it for either cutting threads or autofeed.
IMO, a really well-worth modification especially since I didn't have a gearbox and had to juggle change wheels every time I wanted to do anything – and it deals seamlessly with metric/imperial as well.

Simon

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by Ian Parkin on 10/09/2023 11:43:18:

i wondered if a ELS would make it better..i did fondly imagine that there was an encoder on the leadscrew too so the start and stop could be automated..i do have problems engaging and disconnecting the handle particularly when doing deep blind holes and usually leave the handle engaged and reverse out

As far as I know the Clough only controls leadscrew rotation in relation to the spindle and will therefore not stop and start the thread at specific lengths, it only replaces the changewheels/gearbox.

Maybe others can confirm

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

With mine it allows you to set a start and finish point, but I'm aware that the code has been breathed on by Steve Ward of electronic dividing fame. Not sure whether the original has this feature

[Roy VaughnParticipant @royvaughn26060]

The standard Clough42 ELS only replaces the lead screw, as described in the first video of his series. However, additional functions have been added by others such as driving to a stop. Some are described in the Issues list on Github. There are other ELS designs which have more functionality I believe but I have no detailed knowledge of them.

Re parts availability, James seems to have more or less abandoned Ebay for his online shop. He used to sell a kit comprising the interface board (still available) and parts for the control panel. The latter is no longer in the shop. In his last ELS video a couple of months ago he talked about replacing the current setup, which utilises a cheapo control panel module, with something better (more reliable and less prone to interference). I suspect that he has run out of the old kits and is waiting until the replacement is ready. This need not hold up construction of your own ELS because the use of his front panel is optional, mine doesn't use one, just purchase the interface panel from him and buy the control panel module off Ebay. In fact, get a couple in case the first doesn't work.

It may well be cheaper to purchase more change gears to get the pitch you need but the ELS is far more than that. No more messing around for ten minutes with oily spanners just to cut one thread, it's a boon.

Roy

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

I don't know if we've ever really had a dedicated lathe CNC solution in here, can't say if I've ever seen anything specific that folk could do as a definite starter

There's quite a bit on milling CNC

Cambam has a profile solution but there's plenty not included, no facing boring or threading, officially at least

The last milling CNC job I did ran for 12 hours, CNC can give you some serious workrate and outputs, especially for annoying less interesting work

[simondavies3Participant @simondavies3]

Posted by duncan webster on 11/09/2023 12:33:15:

With mine it allows you to set a start and finish point, but I'm aware that the code has been breathed on by Steve Ward of electronic dividing fame. Not sure whether the original has this feature

Duncan, is this a Clough42 derivative or another?
If its from Mr. Clough, can you share some links please?

Simon

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

It's a Clough 42, but Steve Ward is a member of our club, so he did the clever bit, downloading his modified software to the control board. I'll contact him and see if he will chip in to this thread.

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

Simon,

I was interested in this addition, but Duncan's link didn't work for me. However, it gave a starting point for a bit of Googly detective work. There's World of Ward for starters and from Roy Vaughn's pointer you get to Thread to shoulder mod in James Clough's "issues" tab on github. The discussion progresses to stopping and starting threading. It sounds more complicated than it is, probably. Easier if you have the code installed and the display in front of you, I guess.

John

[simondavies3Participant @simondavies3]

Thanks John, I followed your link to the issues tab and found the thread to shoulder page on Github.

And yes, after reading it through a couple of times, I agree, sounds complicated but I strongly suspect it will be easy in practice.

I will ponder extracting my TI board from the under bench location – or maybe a long USB lead and a spare laptop – one for when the weekends finally cool down here.

Simon

[Stephen Ward 1Participant @stephenward1]

If anyone has any questions about the "Thread to shoulder mod" (or divider) feel free to ask/message.

Steve

​​​​​​​Posted by John Hinkley on 11/09/2023 15:51:58:

Simon,

I was interested in this addition, but Duncan's link didn't work for me. However, it gave a starting point for a bit of Googly detective work. There's World of Ward for starters and from Roy Vaughn's pointer you get to Thread to shoulder mod in James Clough's "issues" tab on github. The discussion progresses to stopping and starting threading. It sounds more complicated than it is, probably. Easier if you have the code installed and the display in front of you, I guess.

John

[John HaineParticipant @johnhaine32865]

Sorry to keep saying the same thing but why not just add 2 steppers or servos to your lathe plus a spindle sensor and use a standard CNC controller? All the "thread to a shoulder" stuff plus a wide range of threads all comes for free.

[Author]

Posts