Infrastructure Engineering

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Strange to see VW re-branding as Reichenwagen isn’t it

MichaelG.

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/04/2023 22:33:05:

Strange to see VW re-branding as Reichenwagen isn’t it

MichaelG.

I think I'm the only one mentioning VW in this thread, and I don't know what that's supposed to mean. It doesn't make any sense in my knowledge of German.

[egaParticipant @ega]

Is that the third or the first reichenwagen?

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Mick B1 on 10/04/2023 09:19:19:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/04/2023 22:33:05:

Strange to see VW re-branding as Reichenwagen isn’t it

MichaelG.

I think I'm the only one mentioning VW in this thread, and I don't know what that's supposed to mean. It doesn't make any sense in my knowledge of German.

.

It was a response to Duncan Webster’s post

… and was one of several German translations offered by DeepL when I typed-in the English phrase:

Rich People’s Car

Nothing whatever to do with any of your posts, Mick

MichaelG.

[John McNamaraParticipant @johnmcnamara74883]

And how do you charge that many cars in a parking station? Depending on the rate I guess say 200 cars. at say 10kwh. each Not by any means a fast charge. Do the math. That's a fair size substation. OK what about 10 charging stations? Still a lot.

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 10/04/2023 11:47:53:

Posted by Mick B1 on 10/04/2023 09:19:19:

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/04/2023 22:33:05:

Strange to see VW re-branding as Reichenwagen isn’t it

MichaelG.

I think I'm the only one mentioning VW in this thread, and I don't know what that's supposed to mean. It doesn't make any sense in my knowledge of German.

.

It was a response to Duncan Webster’s post

… and was one of several German translations offered by DeepL when I typed-in the English phrase:

Rich People’s Car

Nothing whatever to do with any of your posts, Mick

MichaelG.

Thanks for that, I get that now.

Though I paid what seemed a sensible and very moderate price for my low-mileage but (at that time) 9-year-old Touran – and a practical workhorse it has proved to be.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Posted by John McNamara on 10/04/2023 12:18:03:

And how do you charge that many cars in a parking station? Depending on the rate I guess say 200 cars. at say 10kwh. each Not by any means a fast charge. Do the math. That's a fair size substation. OK what about 10 charging stations? Still a lot.

The maths is more complicated than that. At the moment IC car owners put a premium on fast recharging because most people drive them until the tank is something under half full and then start thinking about refuelling. The nature of the fuel makes rapid bulk filling the best way of re-energising the car. It's not the only way.

Electric cars are different. Not smart to drive EVs until the battery is running low, and most urban-commuter journeys make driving that way unnecessary. EVs can trickle charge at any time they're not actually rolling: on the drive at home, from street-side charge points, in car-parks at work or whilst shopping. Most cars do not drive long distances between refuelling opportunities.

Diesel and petrol make it necessary to bury large tanks of oil under a special forecourt, and to keep those tanks full with fleets of road tankers fed by oil refineries and shipping millions of tons of oil world-wide. EVs don't need that infrastructure and fairly ordinary wiring will trickle charge them without fuss. Charging slowly overnight is more than enough to cover the average British commute. It's those who wants to drive the Canning Stock Route who are in trouble. 1800km across 3 Australian deserts and the journey starts in the middle of nowhere…

Not normal motoring! Most British cars are completely unsuitable for this type of trek though I'm sure someone on the forum would try it in their Baby Austin towing a caravan…

Dave

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

SOD said:
" EVs can trickle charge at any time they're not actually rolling: on the drive at home, from street-side charge points, in car-parks at work or whilst shopping. "
That's fine if you have a drive and charging at work. Same for on-street and car parks. There is no public on street charging in the city near me. The local large supermarket has at several hundred spaces but only 6 charging points.

No I'm not anti-EV, just pragmatic. I own a PHEV. I can actually charge at work but with a10kW limit and only If one of the 6 spaces (shared with over over 1000 employees) is free.

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

This really has drifted off hasn't it? What I object to is one manufacturer of hybids advertising the as 'the electric car that charges itself'. No it's not, it's a petrol car with a complicated transmission system. I appreciate that around town it might be a good idea, but for those of us who don't live in metropoli, you're just dragging round a big battery to no purpose.

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

…

Charging slowly overnight is more than enough to cover the average British commute. It's those who wants to drive the Canning Stock Route who are in trouble. 1800km across 3 Australian deserts and the journey starts in the middle of nowhere…

…

Dave

But many cars are needed to do more than commuting. I don't want to arrive in Dartmoor or The Lakes from the Midlands with a near-exhausted battery, and then have to join a queue to spend hours recharging.

Last year we went to Orkney, which needed a 400 mile trip each way to Aberdeen, and a couple of hundred more miles touring. That'd be considerably more difficult and time-consuming in most current EVs. Right now I can put in over 500 miles' range in a few minutes. I'll be interested when I can buy a lowish-mileage but several-years-old EV that can deliver comparable performance for a modest SH price.

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

" lowish-mileage but several-years-old EV that can deliver comparable performance for a modest SH price. "

Err, I wonder if that will ever happen, rather than second-hand at modest price because the £ umpteen-thousand batteries are on their way out, perhaps?

On other points raised, it's amazing how many EV enthusiasts glibly talk about trickle-charging your car you only ever use around town, at home, from a street-side charger or a charger in their employers' car-parks. I suspect these people all live in suburban houses with sizeable drives and work in big premises with ample car-parking; not live in flats or in narrow terraced streets (be those Victorian or the modern pseudo-village type); nor are retired or work in premises with little or no parking. Oh, and constrain even their social lives to a 10-mile radius from home.

[SamsarandaParticipant @samsaranda]

It’s rapidly emerging that EV ownership will be for a certain social sector of society, many of us live in circumstances that mean owning and maintaining the batteries on said EVs is not going to be practical, a recipe for dissatisfaction amongst the peasants ! Dave W

[HOWARDTParticipant @howardt]

Interesting piece on the news this morning, electric HGV needs, I think they said, 340kW charger connection. Can you imagine the drain on the local grid when they all settle down for the night.

[Martin ConnellyParticipant @martinconnelly55370]

It is hard to find hard and fast figures for this and it is based on current technology. The break even point for the green credentials of an EV is a far greater mileage than I will do in 15 years since I no longer commute to work 5 days a week. Since it seems likely that the battery will need replacing if it gets wet or damaged in that 15 years the true eco-friendly cross over point of an EV is probably greater than claimed. Estimated lifetime of the batteries is turning out to be optimistic. Insurers are writing off EVs with damaged batteries because they are too costly to replace.

My conclusion is that it makes little sense for a driver doing low annual mileage to be forced to buy and use a vehicle whose production using current technology causes such damage to the planet over and above current ICE vehicles before they have left the showroom. Where I live is poorly catered for by public transport so a car is pretty much essential. I was recently asked to go to for routine check-up at a local hospital 39 miles away.

Back to infrastructure matters, I remember reading that if all cars are driving down the centre of traffic lanes under the control of a self driving vehicle computer then the road will rapidly become rutted as wear is not distributed over the whole area of that lane. I was reminded of this recently when driving in lane 1 of a motorway that had obvious ruts from HGV wheels. Heavy EVs will also add to this damage.

Perhaps we need a small, lightweight, high mpg class of ICE vehicle for people who only do a low annual mileage as an alternative to being pushed into a heavy EV with a high, upfront, carbon footprint.

Martin C

Edited By Martin Connelly on 19/04/2023 08:42:51

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Is there a phone app, without being full of spyware, that tracks you movement over a year to give you a profile of usage that then helps you select the most suitable battery size / range?

Then we need a car designed for different sizes of battery to match this, with a system of either hiring a different car for occasional long journeys or a battery trailer that you exchange halfway down the motorway.

BTW one third of urban households don't own a car, and one third own >2.

[V8EngParticipant @v8eng]

Or tow a trailer with a nice big diesel genny in it for recharging on long journeys.👹😉.

Sorry I just couldn’t resist that one!

[Bill DawesParticipant @billdawes]

Heard about this car park problem the other day, one in the states collapsed apparently.

Out of interest I looked up the weight of the original mini, between half and three quarters of a ton, current ones about twice that depending on model.

Regarding parking if I have the choice is park where there are plenty of spaces around, you can guarantee that some one will be cuddled up beside you when you get back, it drives me mad, do a lot of drivers need something solid to aim for when parking. I have seen drivers struggling to get into a tight slot when the car aprk wa half empty, I get it if they have difficulty walking but the ones I have seen seemed perfectly able.

Bill D

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Posted by Bill Dawes on 21/04/2023 09:20:53:

Out of interest I looked up the weight of the original mini, between half and three quarters of a ton, current ones about twice that depending on model.

Of course the original MINI was a car, now it is merely a BRAND created by BMW with no relationship at all to the orignal concept.

[Mick B1Participant @mickb1]

One of our local Tescos is closing its filling station for several weeks' refurb.

Me missus said, "Ah, they'll be putting in EV charging points".

"How'll they do that?" I said. "People usually do their shopping, then fuel up on the way out. Even the quick recharges for EVs take 30 minutes instead of 3, so they're gonna need at least 10 times the space and 10 times the number of points, aren't they?"

"They'll have to rebuild the caff bigger and nearer the filling station, too," she said.

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