How to repair a banjo

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

I have an old John Grey & Son Dulcetta bajo, about 100 years old. I know a chap who has about 80 banjos and he has given me plenty of advice on repairing, restoring and doing it up. He does some really nice work, such as milling out a new end pieces from solid brass and brush-plating them with bright nickel.

But one thing I diodn't ask – the tensioning ring on the front is cast brass and nickel plated. Its got a small crack right by one of the tension screw holes – unfortuantely one right by the big gap near the neck, so I can't get away with leaving this screw a bit slack.

Silver soldering the crack would be easy, but it's going to ruin a lot of the nickel plating and I'd rather keep the original plate if i can.

I have heard of 'heat stop' products can anyone advise on these or give any otehr ideas. It's not the sort of small part I can poke into a potato!

Neil

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

[alan knightParticipant @alanknight67321]

why not epoxy it?

[_Paul_Participant @_paul_]

Would it matter too much if you soft soldered it?

I have old solid copper soldering irons that you can solder quite substantial lumps with, perhaps you can use one like that.

That hopefully should'nt remove too much plating.

 

Regards

 

Paul

Edited By _Paul_ on 01/03/2012 22:55:53

[SpringbokParticipant @springbok]

Neil,

Please please take this to a specialist a banjo of that make and age must be looked after with the most of TLC. I know and respect the advice given but there occasionally comes a time where we have get a specialist in.

respectfully

Bob

[chris stephensParticipant @chrisstephens63393]

Hi Guys,

You know the definition of Perfect Pitch is throwing a Banjo into a skip and hitting the Bagpipes already there. I'll get my coat…….

chriStephens

[TerrydParticipant @terryd72465]

Posted by Springbok on 02/03/2012 12:08:52:

Neil,

Please please take this to a specialist a banjo of that make and age must be looked after with the most of TLC. I know and respect the advice given but there occasionally comes a time where we have get a specialist in.

respectfully

Bob

I agree with you here Bob. This could be quite a valuable instrument. it would be a shame to devalue it with a well meaning but unsympathetic repair.

Best regards

Terry

[Nathan SharpeParticipant @nathansharpe19746]

Neil , try Frost Auto Repair for heat stop but you could use Arctic Spray as used by plumbers which should be available at your local B+Q/ builders merchant. Use soft solder and a pencil flame and a self cleaning flux. Make sure you give it a good scrub in soapy water afterwards. Try to work from the inside of the ring and wipe the joint on the outside while the solder is still soft. Do not use wire wool/files to clean the area, let the flux do it's work. I build and repair guitars as a one of my interests and have recently resoldered a National Resophonic which had various open joints and avalue in the £1000s !! Just be methodical/slow and DO NOT DO ANYTHING THAT CANNOT BE UNDONE !! Sorry for shouting but that's main reason that instruments values are reduced. Hope this helps.

Nathan.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

ChriStephens, John Grey & Sons also made Bagpipes. They started in 1832 making watches, and pen nibs.

Neil, anything pre ww2 is worth a thousand pounds or more, yours is an old one, they started the Dulcetta in 1911, so even as is, its worth good money,  get it seen to by an expert.     Ian S C

Edited By Ian S C on 03/03/2012 11:22:49

[julian atkinsParticipant @julianatkins58923]

hi neil,

i have repaired ukulele banjos. i dont think John Grey and Co made very valuable banjos…pretty bog standard really. the tensioning ring is vitally important both to solidity of construction and tightning of the vellum and tone, and if cracked can otherwise cause an annoying buzz sound. anything other than silver solder as a repair wont be strong enough. easy to silver solder, you just need to get it replated afterwards.

can you take a pic of the tensioning ring where the crack is please? happy to help if i can.

cheers,

julian

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

An interesting mix of replies.

From y perspecive, if I can't play the thing, it's worthless, I don't collect tings for their value – I bought this because it was a cheap way to get a banjo. My mentor has 80 banjos and he restored one by milling up new parts from brass and modifying modern hooks – the value went from £80 to £875, so I think he knows what he's doing. But he would strip the plate right off, make a full repair, and replate – he wouldn't put up with the pitted plating I've go anyway. I'd rather not do any plating.

I am sure that ordinary solder won't be strong enough. Problem is, with a brass ring it will need a disproportionate amount of head for even my last strand of easyflo number 1

This first crack is on the central hole in this pic. Note the split on one of the holes for the strings as well.

This crack is bigger:

Finally the rather nice plate over the tuning heads.

Neil

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Neil, looking carefully at the middle photo, I would say that all three holes are suspect, the middle one yes, the the left one, and the one on the right looks as if it could go from a notch on the left side of the hole.

Bottom photo, looks good, but it needs the screws changed so they are all the same, nickle plated if you can find them.

The little bracket thing, could you fabricate a new one, and put the origional aside. Ian S C

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Spoke to Glen again today. He says braze it and replate, or it just won't be strong enough – the old sand castings are very porous, weak and bend easily. He even offered to do the plating but apparently a bright nickel brush kit is best and not too costly.

Glen says fill the holes in the 'bracket' with epoxy, file neat and get a batch of lost wax castings made! He reckons I can sell the extras and the cost will be covered by the value of the banjo if well restored (which he reckons is an early John Grey and one of the better ones). He also tells tales of banjos with green and purple hearts, moons and stars in mother of pearl valued at "up to £150K" if you can find the right buyer.

In the face of such enthusiasm I feel bound to give this my best shot.

Neil

[julian atkinsParticipant @julianatkins58923]

hi neil,

good luck!

looks like you have quite a bit of careful silversoldering to do to the tensioning ring and tailpiece. the brass probably isnt good stuff so go easy! good quality banjos have bellmetal/gunmetal tensioning rings etc. i would then get all the parts of your banjo properly replated. any cracks in the wooden hoop?

cheers,

julian

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

It's a zither banjo, so it's got a wooden bowl (resonator), rather than a hoop and it's in good nick, except teh veneer is l;ifting in one place.

Neil

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Neil,

To answer your original question:

http://www.goldschmiedebedarf.de/product_info.php?products_id=7520

MichaelG.

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

Thanks Michael,

Neil

[jomacParticipant @jomac]

Stub Hi, was watching "top gear" awhile ago, and on it was an American who liked old cheap cars especially English ones, he was also a banjo player, who on the show had a home made banjo made out of two Morris Minor hub caps fixed to a length of timber, it had only three strings, to my out of tune hearing sounded OK. Hows that for impreviseation.

John Holloway,

PS sorry about the spelling

[VersabossParticipant @versaboss]

Seasick Steve, I suppose.

http://youtu.be/Tq-7_OQaqCo

Greetings, Hansrudolf

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