How do I remove grease from wood prior to painting?

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

I’m making a very small wooden model and the natural oils from my hands and fingers are getting into the wood when I use my fingers to handle small parts. Obviously the primer may not stick to the wood properly if it’s greasy. How can I best remove this but not undo the PVA glue I’ve used? Alcohol or soap and water? Any other ideas?

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

[IanTParticipant @iant]

I generally use white spirit to clean up, using a very fine wire wool – let it dry and if there is any oil/grease left repeat. When happy, very lightly sand. Water/soap can also work but tends to raise the grain more. Don't soak your model and the PVA joints should be fine.

If painting, use a special primer such Bulls Eye 1-2-3, relatively expensive but it works very well (and there's no need to use 'knotting' either). 1-2-3 is a 'white' primer so may not suit every job of course.

However, it adheres well and will stop anything coming through to spoil your top coats.

Regards,

IanT

PS If it's just oil from your fingers, prevention is a good (better?) idea – so wear gloves. 

Edited By IanT on 25/05/2022 21:55:07

[brickyParticipant @bricky]

Try oxalic acid

Frank

[DalboyParticipant @dalboy]

I have never had problems from the natural oils from my hands when finishing wooden models. If however you are talking oil and grease that you have picked up from handling metal engineered models and the like the hand cleaning is the answer before working with wood.

Oxalic acid will clean it off but if left on may dis-colour the wood as in that it can act like a bleach.

I don't paint my wooden models but do apply a lacquer for protection after applying a sealer first.as in this model

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by bricky on 25/05/2022 22:22:28:

Try oxalic acid

Frank

?. I would have thought a caustic solution would be better than an acidic agent? Washing soda helps ‘dissolve’ oils and sodium hydroxide saponifies them, making them into soaps which are aqueous soluble.

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

If water based primer will not adhere to the surface, try an oil based primer. (This is also a solution if stains, etc keep leaching thru the primer). Most acrylic/water based paints will stick to oil based primer.

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

Posted by Derek Lane on 25/05/2022 22:41:21:

I have never had problems from the natural oils from my hands when finishing wooden models. If however you are talking oil and grease that you have picked up from handling metal engineered models and the like the hand cleaning is the answer before working with wood.

Oxalic acid will clean it off but if left on may dis-colour the wood as in that it can act like a bleach.

I don't paint my wooden models but do apply a lacquer for protection after applying a sealer first.as in this model

Very nice. What scale is it? and how did you make the tracks? 

Edited By Simon Robinson 4 on 26/05/2022 13:33:21

[Simon Robinson 4Participant @simonrobinson4]

Posted by IanT on 25/05/2022 21:53:08:

I generally use white spirit to clean up, using a very fine wire wool – let it dry and if there is any oil/grease left repeat. When happy, very lightly sand. Water/soap can also work but tends to raise the grain more. Don't soak your model and the PVA joints should be fine.

If painting, use a special primer such Bulls Eye 1-2-3, relatively expensive but it works very well (and there's no need to use 'knotting' either). 1-2-3 is a 'white' primer so may not suit every job of course.

However, it adheres well and will stop anything coming through to spoil your top coats.

Regards,

IanT

PS If it's just oil from your fingers, prevention is a good (better?) idea – so wear gloves.

Edited By IanT on 25/05/2022 21:55:07

Thanks. Can I add a tiny bit of artists black acrylic paint to the 1-2-3 white primer to make it grey?

[DalboyParticipant @dalboy]

Posted by Simon Robinson 4 on 26/05/2022 13:32:36:

Very nice. What scale is it? and how did you make the tracks?

Edited By Simon Robinson 4 on 26/05/2022 13:33:21

I did not make it to a scale but it is 17" long to give an idea of size.

The tracks are mad of three components the pad a guide cleat and the pin. There are 66 pieces of each component all machined. The pads where all machined to width and thickness in long lengths then cut to size. I made a jig to route either the tongue or groove. Also a jig to drill the holes for the track pins.

It took three days of cutting and assembling both tracks

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi Derek, not my type of thing, but it looks tidy and very well made, ever thought about entering it into one or two of the model engineering exhibitions?

Regards Nick.

Edited By Nicholas Farr on 26/05/2022 16:36:47

[An OtherParticipant @another21905]

I have built many wooden models over the years, and like Derek, I preferred to leave them in the natural wood, just protected – in my case with water-based lacquer. I can't say I ever took any steps to remove grease or oils from the wood before finishing – I simply never saw any. (I can post some photos of the results if anyone is interested in the appearance). I used many different types of wood, and some had a natural oiliness, which also didn't seem to cause any problems.

At the time I lived in Germany, and due to the onset of 'ecological protection', it was quite difficult to find oil-based lacquers, which is why I used the water-based stuff, and eventually I became quite a fan of it.

This makes me wonder if there is any connection to the 'rusty hands syndrome'? I worked for a while in a small engineering company – most of the material used was stainless steel, but I quickly found that if I handled steel or iron items, they developed clear corrosion marks where I had handled it – this was very fast – it only took a few hours for the marks to be clearly visible – I had to wear thin cotton gloves to get round it. Eventually, this seemed to clear up, and no longer happened, which makes me think that possibly certain people do produce oils naturally, which may explain the problem Simon is having, and which I had.

[DalboyParticipant @dalboy]

Posted by Nicholas Farr on 26/05/2022 16:35:39:

Hi Derek, not my type of thing, but it looks tidy and very well made, ever thought about entering it into one or two of the model engineering exhibitions?

Regards Nick.

Edited By Nicholas Farr on 26/05/2022 16:36:47

If they were closer I might consider it if they would accept wooden models. I have made a few others some have been featured in the Woodworking Magazine.

I also have a U tube channel but I only did them in a series of photos. Making the Rob Roy is really a progression from wooden models.

[Mike PooleParticipant @mikepoole82104]

People can certainly produce some corrosive sweat, Rory Gallagher’s famous guitar suffered badly over many years of live performance. The metal fittings corroded badly and the body finish suffered.

Mike

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi Derek, well this wooden traction engine was in the Midlands Model Engineers Exhibition awhile ago along with a few other bits of wooden models and there is normally many wooden boats, ships, aeroplanes and even models of farm related things all made with wood at most exhibitions.

Needles to say the guy who built the engine, didn't fancy lighting up the boiler.

Regards Nick.

Edited By Nicholas Farr on 26/05/2022 19:41:08

[DalboyParticipant @dalboy]

Now that is amazing Nick way beyond my humble model

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Posted by Simon Robinson 4 on 26/05/2022 13:35:04:

Posted by IanT on 25/05/2022 21:53:08:

If painting, use a special primer such Bulls Eye 1-2-3, relatively expensive but it works very well (and there's no need to use 'knotting' either). 1-2-3 is a 'white' primer so may not suit every job of course.

However, it adheres well and will stop anything coming through to spoil your top coats.

Regards,

IanT

Thanks. Can I add a tiny bit of artists black acrylic paint to the 1-2-3 white primer to make it grey?

Never tried that Simon, so cannot really say.

Best I can suggest is to try it on a test piece and see if there is a reaction. I have over-painted it with both acrylics, enamels (inc Humbrol & Precision Paints) and various water based paints without any issues though.

Regards,

IanT

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi Derek, you shouldn't put yourself down, I would imagine the traction engine would have taken many more hours of work due to what it is representing and its size, I'm not familiar with your truck as trucks are not really an interest of mine, but I do appreciate the workmanship you've put into it and the skill on both of them is what I see. Traction engines while of interest are not high on my list of interests. Wood work especially in these models is far beyond what I could achieve and I would have taken a photo of your truck if I saw it on display and I do like the contrast of the colours of the wood used.

Regards Nick.

[JohnFParticipant @johnf59703]

Posted by not done it yet on 25/05/2022 22:57:12:

Posted by bricky on 25/05/2022 22:22:28:

Try oxalic acid

Frank

?. I would have thought a caustic solution would be better than an acidic agent? Washing soda helps ‘dissolve’ oils and sodium hydroxide saponifies them, making them into soaps which are aqueous soluble.

Oxalic acid has been used to remove oil from gunstocks for decades and works very well, you do need to wash it off and allow to dry before applying the new finish. It certainly works for me and I have never had any ill effects.

John

[Christine McNeilParticipant @christinemcneil64071]

These models are amazing. I've never tried building anything out of wood like this. Derek please share your model photos I'm sure they're really good ☺️

Christine x

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