Hand shaper

[anthony brooks 3Participant @anthonybrooks3]

[anthony brooks 3Participant @anthonybrooks3]

Hello All. All the best for 2018.

Does anyone have any opinions/advice on the hand shaper featured in the recent Model Engineer special? I am looking at buying the electronic comic but also have my eye on a couple of the other editions.

Cheers

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Looks like it needs a bump or nobody has any experience!

I have not seen a pic or any other detail of this one, but if it works as well as a Drummond it will be good. I also like my Alexander as it provides a superb finish on aluminium, even without its autofeed bits (although it would be far easier to operate with an automatic cross feed).

If this is a build project an autofeed system really needs to be included, to make operation more of a continuous nature as I find manually altering the cross feed every stroke makes getting into a rhythm, with the cutting stroke, a bit awkward or slow.

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by anthony brooks 3 on 31/12/2017 21:29:57:

Hello All. All the best for 2018.

Does anyone have any opinions/advice on the hand shaper featured in the recent Model Engineer special? I am looking at buying the electronic comic but also have my eye on a couple of the other editions.

Cheers

Do you mean the Adept Number 2 in Bill Morris' article?

I have one, it's come in handy for a couple of otherwise difficult jobs, but its a slow and steady machine not a racehorse.

Neil

[richardandtracyParticipant @richardandtracy]

Honestly 'slow' is a bit fast for describing a shaper.

I have a Boxford 8", and it's very therapeutic in the way it has all sorts of spurious motions. I can watch it for hours. Which is just as well because I need to to see a job through with it.

Regards,

Richard

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

OK, if it is the Adept. Here are a few pointers .

If it has a manual feed, a finer thread would most certainly be better. The Drummond has an 8 tpi feed screw and it is a pain to advance it in sufficiently small increments while being consistent in size of cut. My Alexander has a thread pitch of less than a third of that.

As in my first reply, an auto crossfeed would be a great improvement. I’ve started on the parts for my Drummond, but other things have got in the way over the Christmas period. I will get to use it properly when sorted and be able to compare the machines (OK, the Drummond will win).

One of the gib adjusters on the cutter height adjuster would be better changed for a locking screw – to reduce any movement/backlash in the mechanism wihie operating.

With T-slots, for table height adjustment, it is fiddly to have to set the table level every time it is altered.

They operate better with the cutting edge further back, than in the lathesdotco pics. The proper cutters had a crank in them. Not sure of the proper term for them. Operating with the cutter as short as practicable is good (just look at the tool extension length on some pics!).

Cutters are single point, so far cheaper than end mills for a milling machine. But you do need a means of sharpening the cutter to a razor sharp edge – and to keep it like that.

Apart from being slow, they are a good machine for getting really flat surfaces and useful for other jobs which might be awkward with a milling machine, or it might avoid breaking down a set up on the mill.  Definitely good for internal keyways.

Those without a shaper (of any form) will often say they are simply not needed, but those with them usually would not wish to divest themselves of their machine unless almost forced to.

Hope that helps. I like shapers – even hand powered ones.

Edited By not done it yet on 02/01/2018 21:38:42

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Manual feed on my adept, but about 16tpi. An auto feed ratchet would be the one thing to add.

Neil

[anthony brooks 3Participant @anthonybrooks3]

The notes say it is 'FT Leightfords'. It said it was built from rolled sections.

[John OlsenParticipant @johnolsen79199]

People always say shapers are slow, but they should see my 18 inch Alba taking a quarter of an inch off in a single pass.. Ok, you are not going to do that on a hand operated Adept, but even that will be faster than the same guy pushing a file, which would often be the alternative.

Actually the rate of metal removal is mostly a function of the horsepower, Isn't it supposed to be a cubic inch per minute per horsepower? A horizontal mill will remove a lot of metal in a single pass, but requires a correspondingly powerful motor to do it, as well as an expensive wide cutter.. But anyway, for amateur work speed is not usually all that important.

John

[I.M. OUTAHEREParticipant @i-m-outahere]

They do have many uses – cutting splines is one , i use mine to cut the lines on dials .

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by anthony brooks 3 on 03/01/2018 02:38:17:

The notes say it is 'FT Leightfords'. It said it was built from rolled sections.

Can you give us the issue number and date?

Neil

[anthony brooks 3Participant @anthonybrooks3]

Best of Model Engineer Vol.3. The cover has a Lynx OHC engine.

[anthony brooks 3Participant @anthonybrooks3]

Well I took a chance and purchased the digital magazine. What a disappointment. 80 of a hundred pages devoted to the IC engine on the cover and a steam loco. The shaper is a 3 page reprint from the 40's.

Pocket mags needs to put the first page of every article in its preview. They had too many pages of the engine build for this issue.

Once bitten twice shy. Unless I see the article I am interested in, I won't be buying.

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

An Adept (2, I think), which looked to be in good condition, went for a mere £250 on epay this last couple of days. I would not personally pay that much for one but, clearly, someone wanted it (unless it is relished…).

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

IMO Hand shapers like unimats command a good price because they can be sent in the post

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by not done it yet on 18/01/2018 09:04:40:

An Adept (2, I think), which looked to be in good condition, went for a mere £250 on epay this last couple of days. I would not personally pay that much for one but, clearly, someone wanted it (unless it is relished…).

Even allowing for buying a new angle plate selling mine for that would give a 500% ROI…

I think I'll keep it though

[Another JohnSParticipant @anotherjohns]

I love shapers, but:

Had an older Drummond hand shaper; it ended up being sold to a fellow club member, who in turn sold it to someone in another area of Ontario.

Beautiful machine. But, in the time I had it, it scribed exactly 3 lines, for something resembling a graduated dial.

It took up a lot of workspace. A piece of artwork, but, I don't own a machine-tool art gallery.

Years ago I had an AAMCO 7" powered shaper, which again was great, but it was slow, chips went all over the workshop, and one could not do what a vertical milling machine could do. Sold it when I moved to NZ for a bit.

Would I purchase another shaper? You bet! Have my eyes on one if I can clear out the workshop some more; would I use it though? Hmmm…

[Roy YatesParticipant @royyates15554]

Posted by not done it yet on 02/01/2018 21:34:52:

OK, if it is the Adept. Here are a few pointers .

If it has a manual feed, a finer thread would most certainly be better. The Drummond has an 8 tpi feed screw and it is a pain to advance it in sufficiently small increments while being consistent in size of cut. My Alexander has a thread pitch of less than a third of that.

As in my first reply, an auto crossfeed would be a great improvement. I’ve started on the parts for my Drummond, but other things have got in the way over the Christmas period. I will get to use it properly when sorted and be able to compare the machines (OK, the Drummond will win).

One of the gib adjusters on the cutter height adjuster would be better changed for a locking screw – to reduce any movement/backlash in the mechanism wihie operating.

With T-slots, for table height adjustment, it is fiddly to have to set the table level every time it is altered.

They operate better with the cutting edge further back, than in the lathesdotco pics. The proper cutters had a crank in them. Not sure of the proper term for them. Operating with the cutter as short as practicable is good (just look at the tool extension length on some pics!).

Cutters are single point, so far cheaper than end mills for a milling machine. But you do need a means of sharpening the cutter to a razor sharp edge – and to keep it like that.

Apart from being slow, they are a good machine for getting really flat surfaces and useful for other jobs which might be awkward with a milling machine, or it might avoid breaking down a set up on the mill. Definitely good for internal keyways.

Those without a shaper (of any form) will often say they are simply not needed, but those with them usually would not wish to divest themselves of their machine unless almost forced to.

Hope that helps. I like shapers – even hand powered ones.

Edited By not done it yet on 02/01/2018 21:38:42

Hi, I've just bought an Alexander with the auto feed. If you need dimensions etc I can help. I realise this is an old thread so may not be valid any longer

Thanks anyway

Roy

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Roy the term you are looking for is Swan Neck

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Someone produced drawings for an automatic cross feed for the Adept No. 2

From memory it involved fitting a longer grubscrew to one of the gib adjusters, to provide a derive to a pawl that engaged a thin gear mounted behind the feed dial.

Being hand powered, cuts and feeds are going to be very small, but it should be possible to generate some flat surfaces with a good finish.

howard

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by Roy Yates on 14/04/2022 21:30:22:Hi, I've just bought an Alexander with the auto feed. If you need dimensions etc I can help. I realise this is an old thread so may not be valid any longer

Thanks anyway

Roy

Hi Roy,

It is definitely still relevant. I never tried to modify mine because I bought a Drummond, whuch gets a reasonable ammount of use (at times🙂 ).

Dr Chris Woodcock has/had a superbly restored example.

The main reason (apart from having the Drummond) was that it has a different feed screw arrangement, so needed conversion, to the original, before the extra items were added. I think mine was likely a later model made with the basic Alexander castings, but without the added complication of auto-feed components.

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