Fusion 360 – full, free 3D CAD and CAM

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Murry has it in one.

Flood the market and move on. You will have had all the serious money, the copiers will get the dregs, tyre kickers and model engineers

Just joking lads

[Involute CurveParticipant @involutecurve]

I suppose I already know the answer, use it for hobby stuff which matters little and keep the work stuff as I do now, the question was more about the future, if all design software goes in this direction what then, I sign NDA's with some of my clients this means I'm responsible for there IP, that's why my site rarely has client drawings on there, its more a hobby website anyhow, it was a question that's still open, I do design work for some quite big names, although I'm semi retired, I ran it by one of them a whle back and the answer was to not use the cloud for storing files never mind development.

I don't know I have a 1978 MV Agusta 850s Monza, that's worth a couple of quid I think .

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

Posted by Muzzer on 22/06/2015 17:03:48:

Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 22/06/2015 14:47:18:

I had a quick look at the link. I think you only get CAM on the paid for versions – I could be wrong!

Rod

Take another look – "A free 1-year startup license is also available for hobbyists, enthusiasts, makers, and emerging businesses that make less than US$100,000 in revenue per year. At the end of 1 year, you can reselect the startup entitlement or transition to a commercial entitlement.". Essentially it's free until you reach this threshold of profit, which none of us never will as hobbyists. And even then it would be something like $300 / £200 per year.

I'm convinced! Just have to save up for a CNC mill now.

Thanks for the heads up,

Rod

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

I suspect most companies now use some form of outside storage nowadays and even Outlook 365 is on the cloud. NDAs don't constitute liability insurance, they are a promise to take (very) reasonable care and not to knowingly divulge details without permission. Like patents, you have to ask what you think you are protecting. If you are a design house or consultancy, any conscious and public breach of confidentiality would be commercial suicide. The NDA defines penalties and scope but generally isn't what prevents leakage in itself.

Either way, whether the work is stored on a 3rd party server farm or simply on a network drive is pretty much semantics as they are just as accessible from almost anywhere (rather like online banking?). Only the truly self important or those dealing in national security need worry.

Ironically, when storage is isolated, it can increase the risk of leakage – you still need to be able to access it and in the process often resort to crudely controlled methods like flash drives, floppies(?) and the like which can famously be left lying around, unlike VPNs, firewalls etc which can be made very secure.

Murray

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Posted by Muzzer on 22/06/2015 17:03:48:

Autodesk are looking for market share in the professional sector, so giving it away to students and hobby users costs them very little but can only help them to gain acceptance and increase said share

 

You mean they finally woke up to that fact after getting really vicious in the 80's and 90's with computer hobbyists who used pirate copies of Autocad, learning (Autodesk-style) CAD in the process and making it attractive to their subsequent employers? (Who then paid the enormous licensing fees). Autodesk certainly had market share then.

Edited By Bandersnatch on 22/06/2015 21:46:12

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

I have spent a few hours going through learning this package since Sunday, watching a few videos on youtube. Managed to draw up a design of the QCTP broaching tool I made recently, except the CAD version has better pivot joints than the 6mm cap head screws I used

For the moment I have no use for the CAM as, like Rod, I need to save for a CNC machine. I have tried a few different parametric CAD applications in the past and so far this is the easiest I've tried out. Thanks again Murray for the pointer.

I've created some 2D drawings from within the application and I can share these as PDF documents if anyone's interested. They are very basic though and I'm no designer or draughtsperson so you'll have to excuse the very amateur conversions and cramped annotation. I can also share the models if you are using/trying Fusion.

I accept no responsibility for inaccuracies if you decide to make one of these, however a test motion animation within Fusion gives me some confidence that the design would work.

Note: The design uses 5mm E clips to secure the pivot pins and have been drawn at 1mm thickness but they are apparently less than 1mm in real life, so the pin grooves should be cut to suit whatever you would like to use.

Cheers all,
Ed.

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

The only way to find out of something will run under wine is to down load it and install it. It's best to get the very latest version of wine.and install wine tricks. When it comes to tossing in some real windows dll's etc there isn't much help about.

There is no need to dual boot these days if some one wants to run windows and linux on the same machine. VirtualBox is probably the easiest virual machine to use but there are others. I'm not sure if it will run 64biit windows. There was talk last time I used it and that was some time ago. In terms of obtaining windows some smaller PC outlets may have earlier versions around that they will sell. Totally illegal of course.

Seeing comments about 32bit and memory a lot depends on what the OS decides to let users do. It doesn't take much memory to blat a pc screen even a big one and the overheads for paging in memory are surprisingly low.

Me – well I have only used Linux plus KDE for around 18 years now. I did use both for a couple of years before that. I do have Vista Home on a laptop that I use for the web when I am away from home and also for upgrading firmware in certain items when I can't do it from Linux.. I also have a copy of XP pro that will have to go on it at some point.

John

–

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Picking up on Eds comment about drawing a 5 mm E-clip 1 mm thick despite the real thing being thinner how does Fusion stack up in the component library stakes. Being able to call out standard hardware directly rather than drawing it yourself is a major timesaver and probably more accurate anyway. Its also useful to be able to import drawings of commercial components. Given its professional links I would have expected Fusion to have all the standard E-clips in a data library and to be able to import commercial components supplied in standard file formats such as AutoCAD ones. Is the 5 mm clip just one of a few omissions or is the library still very much a work in progress.

Does anyone know if it will import Vectorworks files? I'm distinctly underwhelmed by Vectorworks 2014 which I currently use so if Fusion will output 2D files to suit my current workflow it would be a good opportunity to make the jump to modern 3D methods. Especially as I have an unused Taig Micromill CNC sitting about the place!

Clive

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

Hi Clive,

I have just been looking at parts import. There are currently two sources to pull parts from that I can see, McMaster Carr and PartsforCAD. Importing from McMaster Carr I was able to pull parts directly into a design in STEP format. PartsforCAD requires a registration and acceptance of terms before you can import. I didn't go that far as I'm only trying the software. E Clips are available from both sources.

I found a video of the parts import feature: LINK My experience so far is that it takes a lot longer to import a part than the video shows, about 40 seconds. Maybe just connectivity issues across the pond.

I don't know if all the parts available are strictly from companies based in the USA. It would help if there was some kind of international part number cross-reference for standard items, (maybe there already is ? )

Ed.

 

Edited By Ed Duffner on 24/06/2015 01:13:35

[John Stevenson 1Participant @johnstevenson1]

Have you tried Traceparts ~?

[richardandtracyParticipant @richardandtracy]

I have, with SoiledWaste SolidWorks.

Have to confess it has never been that useful as the parts are often ones I'm not interested in, modelled incorrectly or just modelled badly (excessive detail where not needed [such as modelling the helix of a thread] &/or inadequate detail on interface areas). Have downloaded a generic 'Man' to provide scale references in the brochure engineering phase of projects, but the ones available are not very lifelike. Unfortunately the figures exported from the figure animation package I use are a little too lifelike, and a bit too obviously female for an engineering company to use to illustrate drawings. Hrrumph.

What is more useful is that places like Protex & WDS have full 3D CAD models to download for registered users. At work, that makes it much more likely that we'll use their latches, knobs, handles etc. I wish other manufactures would take the hint & do it too.

Regards,

Richard

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Posted by John W1 on 23/06/2015 19:41:00:

The only way to find out of something will run under wine is to down load it and install it. It's best to get the very latest version of wine.and install wine tricks. When it comes to tossing in some real windows dll's etc there isn't much help about.

It doesn't currently work under Wine, see Bug 34851 at WineHQ.

I haven't tried it in a Virtualbox installation but I found that Solidworks ran extremely slowly like that when I tried it some time ago. For now I will dual boot for playing with Fusion.

Russell

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by richardandtracy on 24/06/2015 09:25:22:

I have, with SoiledWaste SolidWorks.

Have to confess it has never been that useful as the parts are often ones I'm not interested in, modelled incorrectly or just modelled badly (excessive detail where not needed [such as modelling the helix of a thread] &/or inadequate detail on interface areas).

As JS and Ed suggest, there are various sources for CAD models. IIRC, RS Compts, Farnell etc also supply CAD models and most manufacturers of connectors, bearings, pulleys, fasteners etc provide them – they pretty much have to. There's usually quite a choice, so you can select one with the right level of detail and modify it to provide the features you want without having to start out from scratch.

Another excellent resource is Misumi. You can configure most of their products on their website, then download the resulting part as a CAD model, even if you don't actually order it. The fascinating thing is that they will manufacture it to order and deliver it within days at often surprisingly reasonable prices. It's a new business model and one that makes me wish I was a young machine designer!

Murray

[AjohnwParticipant @ajohnw51620]

Posted by Russell Eberhardt on 24/06/2015 11:54:54:

Posted by John W1 on 23/06/2015 19:41:00:

The only way to find out of something will run under wine is to down load it and install it. It's best to get the very latest version of wine.and install wine tricks. When it comes to tossing in some real windows dll's etc there isn't much help about.

It doesn't currently work under Wine, see Bug 34851 at WineHQ.

I haven't tried it in a Virtualbox installation but I found that Solidworks ran extremely slowly like that when I tried it some time ago. For now I will dual boot for playing with Fusion.

Russell

Ubuntu mantain an engineering type list of programs. It might be worth looking through those to see what is about now. It's here

**LINK**

There are an ever increasing number of multi platform package about in many areas now so some may run on windoze and mac.

I'm not sure where they all are in terms of end to end cad cam but work is always being done on several of them. I suspect freecad might offer better rendering than some packages.

I've noticed zero difference under VirtualBox but haven't used it at all for a long long time.

Then there is the pay for wine ?? Crossover if I remember correctly. I suspect they might test it if you ask. Not sure on that point. The problem with wine is that there is little help about on sorting applications out and a lot of the interest stems from running windows games. I filed a bug on one application some years ago. Nothing happened as some body would have to pick the job up. It's an optical design package but it does run ok on the more recent versions of wine. There are no good OS optical design packages. I find that Q4Wine helps a lot with more complex packages that have to run from their own directory. Swine on the other hand is not of much use. Q4Wine is a bolt on which removes the need for general wine configuration knowledge.

There was an odd bug involved in running 64bit packages under wine. A search of the forum should bring up a solution. I'd have thought that would have been fixed by now.

John

–

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Oh! Oh! HERE WE GO.

Trying to run a trial CAM program. – When calling up the tool locker the whole programme crashes with a software error report. There is the option to send a report which I did three days ago without response so far.

Please check on a trial download to see if you can get past this to actually post process a simple shape.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

I've run a few parts through the CAM environment without any issue (10 days into the trial period). Apart from the time limit, the program is identical to the "proper" version, so any crashes seem likely to be for some other reason.

I've imported some parts from Solidworks and then run 2D and 3D operations on them. The import is a bit of a faff – you have to upload them onto the "A360" web area and then open them from there from within Fusion. That route would seem to allow you to model stuff in a friendlier application like Solidworks etc and then take advantage of Fusion's CAM capabilities. Horses for courses.

My work laptop has a hybrid graphics card which caused problems today (HP Zbook, W7, dual Intel and ATI graphics). If you don't go into the BIOS and disable the hybrid operation, the panel at the left of the desktop goes black and you can't access any of the web area which is rather limiting. The Autodesk technical support is almost as useless as the Fusion documentation but I finally sussed it out. And the HP user manual instructions for changing BIOS settings was just plain incorrect. Where do they get these clowns from? Grrr.

Merry

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Well that's funny. My work laptop now crashes every time I try to….select a tool. I allowed it to install an update today (v1516) and now it is goosed. My other home laptop has the same update installed and still works. Bizarre. That'll teach me to be smug….

Merry

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Not sure what that was about. The BIOS change to disable hybrid graphics hadn't stuck. Having changed the settings again, all CAM seems to be working. Tool selection, path generation, simulation etc.

Neither of the other 2 PCs had this problem (W8/64 with Intel HD graphics and W7/64 with Quadro 620), so seems to be a hybrid graphics issue.

Murray

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Perhaps an OpenGL vs DirectX (and versions thereof) thing?

As far as I can tell, Fusion 360 uses DirectX (although it seems to work – admittedly very little testing – with my Quadro FX-4800 which is OpenGL).

Edited By Bandersnatch on 01/07/2015 17:18:05

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Yes, big brother Inventor also likes to use DirectX, unlike SE and SW and other CAD which use OpenGL. If Solidworks doesn't see a suitably fancy card it refuses to do fancy rendering etc, although it still works (slowly). Doesn't seem to bother Fusion so much.

Apparently the graphics panels in Fusion are rendered using Chrome (not the browser) and this is what gets screwed up with hybrid graphics, causing the black areas.

My works laptop has a graphics card that is more intended for gaming than CAD and it's fine for Fusion and Inventor. Not certain if this was also the cause of the crash when trying to open the tools dialogue but that seems to have been fixed for the moment – may just be a coincidence!

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

All my issues are now "somehow" resolved. Everything fully working. Both of my milling machines, mill and router perform faultlessly with the Mach3 post generated code.

"Will the bubble burst?"

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

My Fusion was close to expiry (5 days left) and I just got an email reminder. I was able to click the "remaining days" panel and sign up as an enthusiast / startup and it has activated the trial as an unlimited installation. Just took a couple of clicks and there is no obvious loss of functionality – still does all the proper 3D toolpaths.

At work I've been using Inventor quite a bit recently. I wish it didn't crash so regularly despite having all the latest drivers etc. Never had this problem with Solidworks…

[richardandtracyParticipant @richardandtracy]

Rod: From normal experience: Probably.

It usually happens that just as I think I've got the hang of the thing, it all goes to rats spectacularly.

Regards,

Richard

Edited By richardandtracy on 15/07/2015 15:49:54

[John McNamaraParticipant @johnmcnamara74883]

Hi All

I have just downloaded and installed Fusion 360 (Ultimate) the program runs on Macs and Windows. my machine uses windows 7. While it stores files in the cloud and some processing is done in the cloud it is not cloud based much of the processing is done locally, the program is installed on the PC. The installation ran perfectly, I registered it immediately with Autodesk as a hobby user. the one year licence was emailed back immediately.

As long as it is used for hobby interests or by small start-up businesses that turnover less than USD100K (for new projects) it is free. The company states that the one year free licence can be renewed free as long as your circumstances don't change.

Below is a link to a rather long forum thread worth reading. towards the end it covers licencing.

**LINK**

I particularly wanted to see if the program could successfully import an Autocad solid model. Then after importing edit it in Fusion 360 than finally process the file into G code. I could have drawn the part entirely in Fusion but I have many parts already drawn as ACAD solid models, it is important that this feature works. It worked very well. I made a test part with contours and pockets to test out the software. It will import a number of other formats.

After a weekend of testing and learning watching tutorial videos and Blogs I am able to feel my way around the program and was able to do the test below. Its a big program with many features to learn…. much more to do there.

I ran two cutting pass simulations on the test part, first a roughing cut using a flat end mill than a ball end mill for a finishing cut The image above shows the simulation having done the roughing cut and part way through the finishing cut. (There are more images in my Album)

The roughing cut uses "adaptive clearing" to maximise the amount of metal removed in the shortest time.
I chose a linear tool path for the finishing cuts. I let the CAM software do most of the thinking and only filled in the forms and selected a tool. No doubt not the best method to make this part but it is a start. and I got it to run without errors!

At the moment I am working on a converting a small mill to CNC, I cant wait to test this program on metal.

If you are interested in CAD CAM CNC This program will make your day.

Regards
John

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Yes, not bad for free! It's a bit clunky in places and lacks stuff like sheet metal but otherwise it's the full deal.

Jon Saunders over on NYC CNC has posted a lot of watchable videos showing how he uses Fusion 360. Gives you an idea how it works. The CAM portion is basically the full 3D version of HSMWorks, which Autocad acquired. There is a 2.5D version of HSMWorks (HSMXpress) for Solidworks that is free too but the difference between 2.5D and full 3D is significant. Alternatives such as Sprutcam will cost you over £1k for similar capabilities.

When you come to making assemblies from parts in F360, you have to convert parts to bodies or is that the other way round. It's pretty confusing but most CAD packages have their annoyances.

[Author]

Posts