Fusion 360 – full, free 3D CAD and CAM

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

I was over on John Saunders' Youtube site yesterday (NYC CNC) to catch up on his latest posts as I do from time to time. He's an enthusiastic user and promoter of the Tormach CNC machine tools and I can see why – they are rather well designed and supported. I'd love to be able to "find" enough funds to be able to go out and buy one of their milling or turning machines.

Recently he's posted a few videos on Autodesk Fusion 360. This is a full 3D CAD application that uses cloud-based storage so you can access your work from anywhere with internet access.

So what, you might think? What surprised me was that it's free for hobby, educational and startup use. But above all, it includes FULL 3-axis CAM – not 2.5D but proper 3D (scallop, spiral, radial, contour, ramp, adaptive clearing, etc). Wow. Autodesk owns HSM Works now and it appears that they have integrated it into Fusion 360. There's a pretty good range of post processors (including LinuxCNC, I noticed) in the library and more are promised.

I have to admit I had no idea this was happening. I've never been a great fan of Autodesk despite (or possibly because of) using AutoCAD 10-13 way back, when it was considered quite exciting. I thought Onshape was turning out to be an interesting development but of course they are starting from scratch and it will be quite a while before they have got all their CAD features implemented, let alone got started on the CAM extension. They have also started to charge for even fairly limited hobby users. In contrast, Autodesk are in a position to leapfrog ahead of Onshape by offering CAD, CAM, cloud, collaboration etc today. It also takes the fight to the likes of Sprutcam, Solidcam etc by offering full, powerful 3D CAM (HSM Works) for free. For hobby users like us, that is a massive bonus.

I love the direction things are taking, as 3D printers, home CNC, CAD and CAM rapidly acquire capabilities that were previously industrial (not least the pricing) and become more freely available to the younger (and older!) generation.

Take a look **LINK**

Murray

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

Shame it only supports 64-bit users – I was looking forward to trying this out.

John

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

It's going to be difficult to run any meaningful graphics program in a 32 bit environment, as you can only address 3GB of memory. Conversely, most 32 bit applications can be run in a 64 bit OS. Small price to pay for the benefits you gain in return. When your current installation dies, you can reinstall with more bits – hard disks seem to have distinctly finite life.

Murray

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Seems too good to be true? Tried to download and get report "unexpected error" So I guess it is??

[BowberParticipant @bowber]

No it does work and I've got it on my laptop (have had for about 2 months), bit underpowered on my laptop but it works similar to inventor, I've not done a huge amount with it but it looks to have all the normal tools.

Steve

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

Thanks Murray. I've installed and started using it today. Very intuitive (even for my brain cell ! ).

Ed.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Yes, looks like the Inventor CAD environment. The CAM is pretty interesting – it's the full 3D machining package complete with post processors and all (HSM Works). For me, that's the exciting development, given the price!

The post processing is a little slow on my i3 / 4GB / W8-64 lounge laptop but flies along on my i7 / 8GB / W7-64 workstation laptop with graphics card ie it doesn't seem unduly bothered about the platform.

Murray

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Sorry humbled ! Working now.

Before I get in to find it. Has anyone found a PP for Mach 3/4.

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Shame Linux isn't supported. Especially when they provide a LinuxCNC post processor. Guess I'll just have to reinstall W7 on my machine as dual boot.

Russell;

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Rod Ashton on 22/06/2015 08:39:38:

Sorry humbled ! Working now.

Before I get in to find it. Has anyone found a PP for Mach 3/4.

There seems to be a Mach 3 – and also a Mach 2(??). No mention of a Mach 4 yet but presumably this will follow. You could ask on the forum about Mach 4 timing.

As ever, LinuxCNC is listed as "EMC".

Murray

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Muzzer – Yes thanks. Found hat now. Will run some simple shapes on the machine to see if everything is OK.

Overwhelmed by what they appear to be giving away?? Cannot get it out of cinical old head that there must be a price to pay somewhere down the line. Here`s hoping I will have to apologise for the thought!

[Anonymous]

Ah well, that's me stuffed. The download barfed when it found I was using XP.

Andrew

[Russell EberhardtParticipant @russelleberhardt48058]

Overwhelmed by what they appear to be giving away?? Cannot get it out of cinical old head that there must be a price to pay somewhere down the line. Here`s hoping I will have to apologise for the thought!

Yes, that worries me as well. They say it's a 30 day free trial but then they say it's free for hobbyists. Will they change their minds? As it uses cloud based storage they have control of your data and could remove your access.

Am I just being cynical as well?  Still it should be worth the effort of setting it up to play.

Russell.

Edited By Russell Eberhardt on 22/06/2015 14:40:54

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

I had a quick look at the link. I think you only get CAM on the paid for versions – I could be wrong!

Rod

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Rod – Downloaded the programme today. Just tried the CAM. It works on 2.5D and PP`s to Mach3. So far so brilliant. Where on earth is the catch????

[Involute CurveParticipant @involutecurve]

I looked at this ages ago, and think its been posted here before, my question to them was, and still is, who ownes the designs created with this type of software? I am still waiting for an answer!!

 

Shaun

Edited By Involute Curve on 22/06/2015 15:46:30

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

If they are really donating this. They are welcome to my intellectual property!!!!!

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Shaun,

Not a problem, these software products are a tool just like a pencil with brains. You are the input intelligence and design concept, the program is dumb and works to rules and layout concepts, you own the product/design of your labour.

[Involute CurveParticipant @involutecurve]

Are you 100% sure of that? if so how?, I use various software types and keep all my designs off line until it suits me, in part for IP reasons, even to the point my main design computer has all the network facilities removed not simply turned off this may seem like paranoia but until you've had your intellectual property stolen you think it won't or can't happen.

Shaun

[Brian OldfordParticipant @brianoldford70365]

Posted by Russell Eberhardt on 22/06/2015 11:07:50:

Shame Linux isn't supported. Especially when they provide a LinuxCNC post processor. Guess I'll just have to reinstall W7 on my machine as dual boot.

Russell;

Would it be possible to get it to run with WINE?

[Rod AshtonParticipant @rodashton53132]

Shaun – In my category "retired hobbyist" the IP is not groundbreaking and to reiterate, they can have it in exchange and welcome. – Just to get a reliable Mach3 PP, (assuming it proves to be so) is worth any smarts my brain is likely to throw out.

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Yes I am sure, however ownership of IP and protection are two different matters. In the end only an action for passing off or illegal use will enforce your legal position if someone uses your design, way of the world I am afraid.

Been there and won damages over a software product. Need a deep pocket.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 22/06/2015 14:47:18:

I had a quick look at the link. I think you only get CAM on the paid for versions – I could be wrong!

Rod

Take another look – "A free 1-year startup license is also available for hobbyists, enthusiasts, makers, and emerging businesses that make less than US$100,000 in revenue per year. At the end of 1 year, you can reselect the startup entitlement or transition to a commercial entitlement.". Essentially it's free until you reach this threshold of profit, which none of us never will as hobbyists. And even then it would be something like $300 / £200 per year.

As for concerns about IP ownership, I'm trying to imagine how any of us would have reason to worry about that. I can't recall seeing anything in our hobby zone that has any obvious commercial value. If it did, then by definition, you'd want to treat it as a commercial venture, not a hobby. Any theft of IP is likely to happen out in the real world, not because your CAD company has given it away.

Autodesk are looking for market share in the professional sector, so giving it away to students and hobby users costs them very little but can only help them to gain acceptance and increase said share. Autodesk already have cloud based products (eg A360) and clearly commercial security is a key requirement for that.

This is the direction that products like Inventor / Fusion and others have to take as CAD and CAM become much more mainstream and the gap between amateur and professional activities narrows. Very encouraging!

Murray

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

I’ve been developing hardware and software products for manufacture in China for the last 15 years or so and the simple fact is that you can’t stop people copying your work, you can only delay them by making it more difficult, eg by keeping it local and under your control. You capitalise on your early advantage by charging premium prices until they catch up. Thereafter you need to keep ahead of them by continuing to innovate.

Once you stop innovating, you are engaged in a fight for the bottom of the market which is never going to be a good plan. Patents may help the process in some cases but many patents are both expensive and ultimately worthless. Rather than throwing money at lawyers, usually you are best to invest it in the next innovation. Of course, if it’s easy to copy, you probably didn’t have anything terribly valuable to start with….

Murray

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