DRO on a WM18 mill

[Brian AbbottParticipant @brianabbott67793]

[Brian AbbottParticipant @brianabbott67793]

Hello all..

I am looking at adding a DRO onto my warco mill,

Thought maybe these

**LINK**

Has anyone any experience of them ?

Thanks

[Tony RayParticipant @tonyray65007]

Brian,

Not directly, I have this version that shows x & Y on the same display

**LINK**.

When it works its OK but I have a lot of trouble with either axis freezing which requires power cycling and sometimes changing of batteries in the scales. Having paid ~£100 for the whole system I wish I had saved up for a 'real' system such as available for <£300 from e.g. Goodwin Technology or M-DRO. These systems have addtional features like PCD and are pretty much coolant proof whereas I had to fabricate my own protective guards from scratch.

Don't get me wrong I have no complaints about Arc Euro, it is well documented that the Chinese digital scales can have issues.

It will be interesting to see how others have got on with theirs.

Tony

[CrocadillopigParticipant @crocadillopig]

Hi Brian

I too had a similar system (but used SR44 batteries) on my WM16 and although it worked in a basic way it did have its drawbacks i.e cold workshop = batteries drained quickly, even when not being used and in the end the contacts began to show signs of corrosion and needed regular cleaning. I have since moved on to a WM18 and have invested in a M-DRO system like Tony , which I am currently fitting, this has many more functions including ARC contouring, PCD, Oblique line of holes, centre finding etc and I think is well worth the extra money, especially if you use coolant.

Russ

[Douglas JohnstonParticipant @douglasjohnston98463]

If the cost is acceptable go for a decent glass scale and LED display module. The cheaper systems do work and it was what I used at first, but I then changed to a better system after the cheap system developed a number of problems. The difference in performance is well worth the increased price and the glass scales are easier to fit to the machine.Mentally subtract what you would spend on the cheap system from the dearer one and it won't seem so bad.

Doug

[Nick_GParticipant @nick_g]

Posted by Douglas Johnston on 26/01/2015 14:57:39:

The difference in performance is well worth the increased price and the glass scales are easier to fit to the machine.

Doug

Seems we are all good at spending the OP's money here. – He may be on a budget.

So I will add to this and spend a bit more for him.

I fitted DRO's this weekend past and used magnetic scales. My mill like the WM is a small one and fitting them was a breeze and can be cut very easily to the exact length required. But the main reason I went for magnetic ones is there small profile so I would not loose any of the machines capacity. They also do not require any additional protection in the way of coolant and swarf guards further adding to small profile.

Nick

[Ed DuffnerParticipant @edduffner79357]

Hi Brian,

I have exactly the ones you linked to, set up on my WM-16 X and Y axes. Out of the box one display wouldn't work properly with the slide so I swapped it with the other and they then both worked ok.

They are useable but I intend to upgrade later to something more reliable and consistent.

Pros:

– Relatively inexpensive compared to other systems.

– Easy to fit.

– Can be cut to length if required.

– Nicer to use than hand-wheel dials.

 

Cons:

– Displays can be difficult to read in certain lighting conditions. Would be nice if they were powered by an adaptor and back-lit.

– Sometimes one of my displays goes haywire during a cut and can then read any value. This means re-finding the edge and re-zeroing.

– I don't know why yet but the units don't like creeping up on a whole number e.g. lets say I'm moving the X axis to a value of 50.00mm. I move the table until it reads 49.99 ad the display seems to not read any more until it displays 50.01.

Just my honest opinion of having used the units.

 

Ed.

Edited By Ed Duffner on 26/01/2015 16:33:10

[John StanParticipant @johnstan]

I've got the ones in the OPs link fitted to a lathe. You need to look at the claimed accuracy of the scales, especially on the longer lengths. I've got the Sino glass scale dro on my WM18 size milling machine (Warco WM32) which I'm pretty happy with. Obviously not comparing eggs with eggs due to cost difference between the two systems. 

Edited By John Stan on 26/01/2015 19:25:48

[Bob Brown 1Participant @bobbrown1]

I have glass scales on the larger mill and some of these **LINK** along with one of these **LINK** all connected via an old laptop on the Dore Westbury mill, much prefer the glass scales and may fit them to DW as they can be interfaced to the same unit.

There are issues with the cheap caliper style readers and would not fit them given a choice but when on a budget needs must.

Bob

[Enough!Participant @enough]

Brian, the link you posted look like iGaging scales. You could Google for them and get other peoples' experiences.

I actually have a couple of iGaging scales around with a view to "doing something with them" but I haven't so far. I have glass scales on the mill. (Nothing on the lathe but I do have a spare Shumatech DRO-350 DRO …. which, unfortunately wont take iGaging scales without interface electronics).

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

Hi Brian,

I had originally installed the same DRO's on my mill which made machining much easier but they failed after about 6 months use. (kept losing the reference point and displayed random numbers) Replaced them with another set which also failed. Then replaced them with a better set which had a thicker aluminium bar and a common display for the 2 scales. These also failed with similar problems.

After wasting money on 3 sets of cheap scales, I bit the bullet and bought an Easson ES-14 display and glass scales. My advise is not to waste your money on the cheap scales.

Paul.

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

A few years ago I fitted capacitive type scales to my milling machine. These were the type with the display on the slider so this had to be visible. They were not satisfactory – fine swarf from milling was constantly getting into the works. I have since replaced them with glass scales and a remote readout from Machine-DRO.

However, this new type with the remote read out from ARC overcomes these major problems in that they can be mounted upside down and can be adequately shielded (with an extrusion from B&Q) whilst maintaining visibilty of the read out. I was therefore tempted to install them on my Flexispeed which does not warrant an expensive installation but needs something because there are no indexes on the feed screws.

These seem to work fine in this configuration.

Have a look a this LINK where these scales have been installed on a mill and the author has overcome the battery issue with a cheap wall wart.

HTH

Rod

 

Edited By Roderick Jenkins on 26/01/2015 22:47:41

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

Hi Rod & Brian,

I originally installed the DRO's shown in Brians's link, then installed these which have a remote display unit. Both scales, on the x and y axis were protected with a cover to guard them against swarf and coolant. But they would randomly lose their reference point and display random numbers.

Paul.

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

I have the same DRO's fitted on my WM 16 & to date & they have worked fine; I do have a similar problem as Ed albeit on the lighting scenario & the creeping up on last digit or so but nothing else, I still have the original batteries in from new as both readouts 'auto shut off' after a few minutes so I have to keep switching them on but that's no big deal. There are pics of my installation in my album if anyone want to look at the fitting up.

George

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

On my original mill installation I had to use an additional remote read out on the Z axis. This was constantly giving a nonsense display, confused between (I guess) the slider display and the remote display. The type in Brian's link ( the type I used on the Flexispeed) only has a remote display, not like the one in Paul's picture.

Rod

[John HinkleyParticipant @johnhinkley26699]

My experience with the ARC caliper-type scales and remote read-out reflect those expressed in the previous posts. That is, they work OK, are fitted reasonably easily, (I had to fit the X-axis one upside-down to avoid wiping the usb plug off with the vice – you can guess how I discovered how to do that!). Mine also lose position from time to time, go through prodigious numbers of batteries, but still allow me to do some fairly accurate work. (At least to MY tolerances.) When I upgrade my mill, I'll definitely go upmarket and fit glass or magnetic scales. If the credit card can stretch to, I'd suggest missing out the first step and going for the better option, but, as Nick said in a previous post, it ain't my money I'm suggesting you spend!

You can see some photos of my installation in my album entitled "Normandy Workshop".

Good luck, whatever solution you try – I can guarantee you won't be disappointed.

John

[ChrisHParticipant @chrish]

Hi Paul and Tony,

I have just fitted these – got them for Christmas! The bars were a devil to fit to my 'Economy' mill table, to get in a safe place and then protect against swarf and coolant/cutting fluid; what I did worked OK and is fine, but I am not totally happy with it as I am sure I could have done better, as always! It all worked very well initially and I was extremely pleased with it – not very sophisticated but much cheaper than units that are (more sophisticated) and did what I wanted it for. Was running all via the mains transformer, not batteries.

But, have had problems with the LCD Display, the X axis bar is always very slow to start, X axis readout on the Display going to zero when the mill is switched off, and the LCD Display also occasionally switching off when the mill was switched off. Have had excellent telephone help from Ian at Arc, who said they knew of the Display problems and was caused by static from the mill so the bars had to be electrically isolated. Did that and the Display switching off stopped, but the X axis going to zero continued. Then the Y axis reading on the Display started jumping about, followed by the X axis readout. The bars worked fine when removed from the mill and tested on the bench under battery power. Another call to Ian resulted in the Display being sent back to Arc for testing – am awaiting results back so this is where we're up to right now.

I have to say I've bought not a lot of stuff from Arc over the past couple of years but what I have has been just as described and of good quality and their customer supports has been excellent whenever I have had a query or problem, only had one problem before this one and it was sorted very quickly. I think they are an excellent company to deal with (so far – awaiting Display results remember!) – no connection other than satisfied customer etc etc!

Was amused when I posted the Display back, the lady at the post office counter asked what was in the parcel "for security" – I said "an LCD Display", she smiled and thanked me and I thought 'she hasn't a clue what I was saying, it could have been anything!'

Chris

[BaldricParticipant @baldric]

I have fitted similar remote display to several others, mine was from Warco, I used simple aluminium u-channel to protect them from coolant and swarf. I don't think I have had to replace the battery in the scales often, but I know when I need to as the display will jump 0.200". If I was fitting scales again and could afford it I would go for a more up-market option with more facilities, in particular the PCD and half/centre options.

Baldric

[Brian AbbottParticipant @brianabbott67793]

Thanks all for your reply's, very interesting read and most helpful.

Trying to prevent the fitting of these becoming more of a hindrance than a help so thank you.

Have ordered a set from gt precision,

Nick, must say those you fitted looked the business, but may have raised a few eyebrows.

will report back on progress.

Thanks again,

[Brian AbbottParticipant @brianabbott67793]

Hello all,

in the process of fitting the new dro,

has anyone any experience of fitting the y axis, and how they shimmed the scale vertical ?

thanks in advance.

Brian

[CrocadillopigParticipant @crocadillopig]

Hi Brian

Not sure what system you finally decided on but this was my solution to fitting a DRO system to the Y axis on my WM18. I used jacking grub screws to position the mounting rail in the vertical plane. However this leaves a tapered gap that collects fine swarf, therefore I intend to fill it with some type of filler and paint it to match the machine.

Best of luck

Russ

[Brian AbbottParticipant @brianabbott67793]

Hello Russ, thank you for the reply.

Looks like a similar system, i have a backing plate on the sensor which i fit first before screwing the sensor bar to this.

I could drill and tap jacking screws into the backing plate then attach a level.

Good idea, thank you.

Brian

[CrocadillopigParticipant @crocadillopig]

Brian

My backing plate has tapped holes at each end, one at the top and one at the bottom. I needed to jack the bottom away from the casting as well to ensure clearance of the actual encoder when it travels. I don't think a level is accurate enough, I used a DTI. and got it to within 0.001" although it states in my installation guide 0.006"  or less.

Russ

Edited By Crocadillopig on 06/02/2015 12:39:56

Edited By Crocadillopig on 06/02/2015 12:41:21

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