Drilling angled holes

[Chris ParsonsParticipant @chrisparsons64193]

I have decided to have a go at replacing my toolpost turret with one that doesn't require a spanner (after reading another post on here)

I have made a replacement, with a taper on the top and am struggling to work out how to drill the hole for the handle in the taper?

I have attached a (very) rough sketch – I have a bench drill where I can tilt the table so I thought if I clamped the body of the turret in a machine vice and tilted the table at the same angle as the taper, this would be horizontal?

My problem is how to square up the turret (so the axis is at right angles to the axis of the table tilt? The table has diagonal holes and it is proving a struggle to line up the centrepunch mark, level, while keeping the turret square! I could clamp a straight bar in the vice and try to find an appropriate straight edge to use a square against but wonder if there is a knack or clever trick to doing this?

The diagram show what I am trying to make (at the top), the vertical (birds eye) view of the table (middle)and the front view of the table (bottom)

Any ideas gratefully received!

Chris

[Chris ParsonsParticipant @chrisparsons64193]

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Chris,

If you put a 3-flute milling cutter in the drill chuck; you can "spot" the location.

Work very gently and stop&inspect frequently … you will easily see when the job is properly centred and level.

When youre happy: Pop the drill into the chuck, and away you go.

MichaelG.

[Ian PParticipant @ianp]

What you are trying to do might be easier if you do not tilt the table of the drilling machine.

You dont show how you are holding the part you want to drill but if you mount it at an angle (in the drilling vise or bolted to a jury rigged bracket) then that will sit flat on the drill table and not tend to slide down the slope whilst you are getting it centered.

Once the drill has started is best to stop several times whilst drilling is in progress to check the alignment visually. The precise angle is not important for a locking lever but it needs to look right with the levers spindle intersecting the bolting axis.

Ian P

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Hi Chris

I cut an appropriately wooden wedge on the bandsaw – thinner than the diameter of the body of the "nut" and put this in my vise and clamped it up. Take it easy – centre drill and tapping drill. No problems.! If you have your drill table level best not to disturb it I feel.

Cheers

Norman

[Sub MandrelParticipant @submandrel]

My pilar drillis 14 years old – I have never tilted the table! I always clamp things in the vice at an agle, using packing, or pack up one side of the vice. Somewhere I have a wooden block with a notch cut in it for drilling steam passages at a gentle angle. The end mill to make a flat suggestion from Michael is an excellent one and will virtually ensure success.

Neil

[mechman48Participant @mechman48]

Michaels suggestion is the way to go,keep your table flat at 'zero *' at all times, preferably use a tilting vice(or other methods mentioned) for any angular drilling.

George

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Hi Chris ,

This is a job that can easily be done on a lathe . With blank mounted on vertical slide using vice or angleplate or alternatively on cross slide using packing and possibly V block you will have a completely rigid controlled set up for drilling .

There are ways of finding the correct angle and height setting using a dial gauge but I think trial and error would probably give satisfactiry results for a simple job such as this .

If you are uncertain about the set up do a spotting with a small slot drill fist and just look at it – if the mark is in the wrong place it will be obvious and you can correct positioning .

Incidently it it worth while when getting a new lathe to establish some of the controlling dimensions for future reference . In this case if you knew the spindle centre to top of cross slide dimension in advance you could set your blank to exact height on cross slide using a calculated thickness packing piece .

Regards ,

Michael Williams .

[Chris ParsonsParticipant @chrisparsons64193]

Thanks for all the suggestions – the consensus seems to be leave the table alone and angle the work so this is what I will do! I have two machine vices both of which have a horizontal groove halfway down the faces presumably to grip round work – but I can mount at an angle with some support and keep the vice tightened up.

I do not possess an end mill (yet) I presume this is to give a flat on the angled face? I do have a spotting dril and was hoping that this would get the main drill started as well as giving me an idea of alignment?

The image shown by Norman is exactly what I am trying to achieve

Chris

[NJHParticipant @njh]

Chris

Just in case you missed another recent thread on this subject please note, in the image above, underneath the "nut" with the handle attached is a spacer (thick washer!). Make it all, screw it down, and then. by trial and error. reduce the thickness of this spacer until the handle is in the correct position ( away from the chuck!) when tightened.

Good luck!

Norman

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Chris Parsons on 09/04/2013 12:45:48:

I do not possess an end mill (yet) I presume this is to give a flat on the angled face? I do have a spotting dril and was hoping that this would get the main drill started as well as giving me an idea of alignment?

Chris

.

Chis,

The flat is useful; but that's only a small part of the story.

Please let me elaborate …

First; you should use either a 3-flute cutter, or a slot-drill, NOT an old style 4-flute end-mill. … The end-mill would leave a "pip" exactly where you don't want it. [if you are not aware of he differences; please PM me, and I will try to explain]

When the job is correctly centred and level under the chuck; the cutter will leave a symmetrical witness line. The two ends will be slightly curved, and the "line" will have constant width.

For your piece: I would use a 3-flute cutter of about 6mm or 8mm diameter, and aim for a witness line about 2mm wide.

First roughly centre the work under the chuck [a pencil held in the chuck might help] … Then adjust the "tilt" until the cutter produces a good line. [if it's wrong, the high side will be cut first and the line will be tapered]

Then … adjust the "position" until the curved ends of the line are symmetrical.

When BOTH of these tests are satisfied; the drill chuck will be aligned with the centre of the witness line. … Just finally, check the "axial position" before you drill.

I hope that makes it a bit clearer.

MichaelG.

[Anonymous]

Here's what I'd do:

1. Line up the part at an angle in vice by eye, if one is worried about the part pivoting during drilling one can always clamp one side with a V-block on the parallel portion

2. Use a spot drill (or centre drill) to start hole

3. Enlarge hole to final size in one or more steps

4. Remove part from vice and tap by hand, if required

Should take about five minutes.

Regards,

Andrew

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Andrew Johnston on 09/04/2013 20:28:27:

Here's what I'd do:

1. Line up the part at an angle in vice by eye

Regards,

Andrew

.

Andrew,

I wish my eyesight was as good as yours.

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by Michael Gilligan on 09/04/2013 19:07:28

When BOTH of these tests are satisfied; the drill chuck will be aligned with the centre of the witness line. … Just finally, check the "axial position" before you drill.

.

For clarity, that should probably read:

When BOTH of these tests are satisfied; the job will be "centred and level", and the drill chuck will be aligned with the centre of the witness line. … Just finally, check the "axial position" before you drill.

MichaelG.

[MICHAEL WILLIAMSParticipant @michaelwilliams41215]

Hi Michael G

Lining up drill 90 deg to the taper surface by eye is easy enough and it doesn't really matter if you get this a tiny bit wrong .

The real problem for most people is in getting the drill centred on the bar so that drill goes through centre line leaving same amount of metal both sides .

Some people can do this reasonably well by eye but most people make a mess of it every time .

Personally I think that it is always better to use controlled methods which ensure a good result . My experience is that doing things in a controlled way usually takes little more time than improvising .

Regards ,

Michael W

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Posted by MICHAEL WILLIAMS on 10/04/2013 10:30:08:

Personally I think that it is always better to use controlled methods which ensure a good result . My experience is that doing things in a controlled way usually takes little more time than improvising .

.

Agreed !!

MichaelG.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Chris, about the end mill, for this job you can make your own, sort out a blunt drill, say 6 mm, it does'nt matter, and regrind itso that the end is flat instead of pointed (use a square), and even if the center is a few thou below the outer ends of the cutting edges that may be even better, unless you have a collet to hold it, don't try milling. This will put a very small flat on the round piece so you can locate the spot to start drilling. Ian S C

[Chris ParsonsParticipant @chrisparsons64193]

How would this be any different from using a spotting drill? My main concern (it has been mentioned before) is getting the hole through the centre line of the turret (confession, this will not be my first attempt to make this <g&gt

Is this is a bit more obvious with a small 'flat' as opposed to a 'dip'?

I have actually just broken a 6mm drill bit so might try grinding this flat and doing some experimenting…

Chris

[Anonymous]

Well I disagree; here's a quick test handle I've just knocked up. Not a single measurement made, not even with a ruler:

It certainly isn't within 0.01mm, or even 0.1mm, but it is perfectly adequate. The angled hole was started with a 3mm carbide spot drill, opened up with a 5.6mm drill and tapped 1/4" BSF.

I have my eyes tested every year for my aviation medical, and I'm pleased to say that both eyes are significantly better than 20/20.

Regards,

Andrew

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Andrew,

As I said before …

I wish my eyesight was as good as yours.

MichaelG.

[chris stephensParticipant @chrisstephens63393]

Hi Chris,

If you want to watch someone work through a similar problem take a look at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ncPuthkqbI

The video is a little slow but he is a lovely chap with a "go to it" attitude.

chriStephens

[Anonymous]

MichaelG: No malice aforethought, sorry if I got it wrong. After a major eye operation a few years back, which saved my sight, I consider myself extremely lucky to be able to see, let alone for it to be as clear as it is. I visit an optician every year for the full works, including field of vision tests and examination of the retina, as a precaution.

Regards,

Andrew

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Andrew,

No offence taken

… I will send you a PM tomorrow.

MichaelG.

[Chris ParsonsParticipant @chrisparsons64193]

Final episode!

Here are the results of my toolpost handle project and thanks for all that helped!

I even managed to make it carefully enough so I didn't need a spacing washer – the arm is off my tapping tool, as my 10mm die is now too blunt to cut, and I don't know (yet) where to buy the ball ends (although suitably encouraged, now I might think about making a ball turning attachment tool…)

Chris

[KWILParticipant @kwil]

Chris

Found this person on the "other" ME site, he supplies all sizes and colours of knobs. Have bought several from him for different projects. Give him a email.

K

ken@kenbrett.wanadoo.co.uk

[Author]

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