Don’t log out!!!

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Just a heads up that a couple of members simply can’t get logged in including Dave (SOD) so if you what to use the site later may be best to stay logged in but keeping the browser tab open.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

Maybe there’s too many of us logged in here!

It’s the busiest day for a while

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

… and the handful of people who have paid heed to Jason’s advice can have a chat about the others !!

MichaelG.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Feel the power!

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Maybe it was all those complaints about being captured by the robot Dave can’t get in because his screen is blank where it should be so nowhere to tick!

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi JasonB, yes no tick box for not a robot is what I had this morning, which was only a short while after I’d made a reply. Luckily this tablet I used a day or so ago, was still logged in, as I can’t login on anything else, so will just have to keep it logged in for now.

Regards Nick.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Thanks Nick, I’ve passed that on.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Aye

The robots are running the world now

“Computer says No!”

[BountyboyParticipant @bountyboy]

Morning, just logged in on the iPad, no issues, straight in.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Morning usual problem of not being able to log in. I did get the Robot but that was when using the WordPress login not the usual forum one.

[Nicholas FarrParticipant @nicholasfarr14254]

Hi, the robot tick box is back, and I’ve now been able to login OK on my laptop.

Regards Nick.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Got a message from the backroom boys that the robot issue has been sorted but the login one is still ongoing.

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

Good to be back, spent yesterday logged out. Have to wonder if anyone at Mortons actually knows what they are doing. Strikes me that the software guys are well out of their depth. All these stupid faults should have been eliminated before the site went live. Looking at the HTML behind the pages reveals a complete dogs breakfast, some of the untidiest code ever. I still think down to a poor choice of software, WordPress was never really designed for this.

Oh well we can but live in hope that there might be another move to more appropriate software. At least the database should be in a more manageable format now. The InVision Community used on RCM&E looks quite good.

John

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Pleased to report I’m back!  The problem was that the “Human or Robot?” tick box had fallen off, probably due to a simple typo.

So far as I tell, login is working correctly for me this morning, but I’ve been caught by false dawns before.   Based on previous experience, now it works, now it doesn’t symptoms are characteristic of back-end resource problems.

Application Developers are trained not to obsess about micro-efficiency because – most of the time – resources are managed by system software.   In contrast, System software (operating system, databases, network services etc) is written to be performant, and is highly tuneable.   Linux can be deployed on anything from a single CPU microcontroller with tiny memory and no peripherals, up to a multi-CPU super-computer with Terabytes of memory and a warehouse full of peripherals.   Same Linux, but tiny and massive are configured very differently.   Server-Windows has a narrower range of performance options, specialising in desktop and big commercial server farms rather than embedded systems or super-computers.

Modern hardware is so powerful that there is often no need to worry about performance.   Reading up on WordPress, by default it is assumed that the customer is building a small web-site that will run off-the-shelf.  This approach is typical of most software, because it allows developers to deliver functionality and look and feel without having to understand how it works under the bonnet.

I think what’s happened to Mortons is that the old forum managed more data and accounts than off-the-shelf WordPress can cope with.  Failing to cope means sluggish performance and apparently random malfunctions due to time-outs, paging, insufficient storage for queues, and scale inefficiencies.   The behaviour of the application varies depending on the load, which depends on who is logged in and what they are doing, plus external influences such as backing-up. Random malfunctions very difficult to pin down, because testing works or fails depending on whatever else the system is doing at the time.

What we see of WordPress as users is an unsatisfactory look and feel, and it’s tempting to think that’s the big problem, and everything would be fixed simply by switching to another product such as InVision.  DANGER!!!  Before doing that, it’s necessary to make sure that the InVision, or any other products, backend won’t overload in the same way as WordPress.  I’ve read the WordPress documentation, but not InVision’s.   My guess is they both take much the same approach.

WordPress has plenty of scaleability options but choosing which are needed requires performance skills and a good understanding of what’s overloading.   That information is deep inside the system, and quite likely it will be necessary to turn logging on specially to get it, and maybe apply a load simulator to flush out the hot spots.  It is possible that InVision being more modern, has a Wizard, or better diagnostic tools that make it easier to pin down and fix problems.   I don’t know – anyone else?

Dave

 

[JourneymanParticipant @journeyman]

One advantage of InVision Community is that it is a complete package including the hosting in their cloud. So everything is designed to work together. Don’t know how the financial side of it works as you obviously have to pay for storage the basic package only includes 500Gb and I guess this forum needs more (lots more) than that. Again don’t know if Mortons outsources hosting or uses their own equipment I would guess outsource but either way there is a financial element to consider.

Purely on performance, having had a play with InVision and looked at the RCM&E site, I would think it a better option but definitely don’t class myself as having any great knowledge in this area. My little website is nothing compared to either this forum or the overall Mortons on-line presence.

John

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