Did the British Invent EVERYTHING!

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Obviously the British didn’t invent everything, though the patriot in me is delighted to say we can claim to have invented almost everything.

The whole modern world is based on the Industrial Revolution, which, apart from the technology demanded impressive original thinking about organising and funding projects too big for an individual to tackle, leading to stock markets, futures,  leveraging money, and overcoming the overwhelming traditional belief that the world was a tiny cake, in which people could only prosper by nicking land off the neighbours!  Instead, money was made by trade, not necessarily of physical things.  Ideas, economics, literature, insurance, patents and much else.

Rather than list everything British, I invite members to suggest things that aren’t British, so we can have fun seeing if they really might be one of ours!

My starter for ten: light bulbs, which many believe were invented by Edison.

🙂

Dave

 

 

[David JuppParticipant @davidjupp51506]

Joseph Swan – arguably, but not such a good publicist as Edison.

[norm nortonParticipant @normnorton75434]

Well, the internal combustion engine wasn’t home brewed. I thought that it was German, or am I wrong. Britain was then very behind in the development of motor vehicles because of repressive road laws.

Similarly aircraft? The Wright brothers? and then we were never at the front in aircraft development, with the exception of the Merlin and the glorious set of 1950s jet aircraft.

Perhaps after being ahead in initial railway development, we were all burnt out of creativity after around 1860?

Norm

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

The “Gray Code”

MichaelG.

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Ref. __ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_code#Position_encoders

[Frank GorseParticipant @frankgorse]

Although the Wright brothers made the first powered flight there is a case for saying that Sir George Cayley had ‘invented’ the aeroplane early in the previous century.

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Gunpowder.

Mathematics.

Geometry.

The lever.

Gears

Irrigation

The Aquaduct

Astronomy

regards Martin

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Central Heating

Cities

Ritual burial

Cheese

Metal working

 

[Michael Gilligan]

On Michael Gilligan Said:

The “Gray Code”

MichaelG.

.

Ref. __ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_code#Position_encoders

.. and do we feel these had a great impact upon history? 🙂

[David Jupp]

On David Jupp Said:

Joseph Swan?

Didn’t he invent the Vesta match?

Just don’t mention what the Romans did for us.

[Frank GorseParticipant @frankgorse]

That’s all very well Martin but apart from gunpowder,mathematics, geometry…..metalworking,what has the rest of the world ever done for us ?

Edit:sorry Bo’sun,I was a bit late there!

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Well the Bushell’s of Little Snoring invented the world first Double Dresser Threshing machine. Numbers Patent 110 I think. I saw the actual document which had the Great Seal of England attached and a great proclamation on behalf of Queen Victoria.

regards Martin

[norm norton]

On norm norton Said:

On Michael Gilligan Said:

The “Gray Code”

MichaelG.

.

Ref. __ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_code#Position_encoders

.. and do we feel these had a great impact upon history? 🙂

Well I do … but you may not 

… Was that part of Dave’s question ?

MichaelG.

[Dod MoleParticipant @georgeclarihew]

My contribution is a Lunar Panel, just not got it generating letric yet.

[norm norton]

On norm norton Said:

Well, the internal combustion engine wasn’t home brewed.

Yup. Nicéphore Niépce, France, 1807.  First practical engine was Étienne Lenoir, Belgium, 1860, a two stroke that ran on coal gas, which is British!

 

I thought that it was German, or am I wrong. Britain was then very behind in the development of motor vehicles because of repressive road laws.

No, some excellent cars despite the damage caused by Red Flag legislation.  Rolls Royce started by selling the most reliable car in the world.

Similarly aircraft?

1842: The Aerial Steam Carriage of William Samuel Henson and John Stringfellow was patented, but was never successful, although a steam-powered model was flown in 1848.

… we were never at the front in aircraft development, with the exception of the Merlin and the glorious set of 1950s jet aircraft.

Not sure about that, British aircraft were big hitters during WW1, with the Sopwith Camel and Bristol SE 5 both dominating the skies.  The Vimy Bomber was impressive too.   And although the Merlin was an excellent engine, RR made plenty of other excellent aero engines.   As did Bristol, whose 1,294 kW Hercules XVII made the early Merlins look a little weedy!  But comparing engines is tricky, because they were developed to do a particular job, and engines designed to deliver high power at low altitudes tended to flag out a high altitudes and vice versa.  Some sad failures too – the propeller driven Brabazon was designed to fly a few rich toffs in slow luxury, and completely missed the market for fast jets packed with passengers able to fly more economically and in less turbulence at high altitude.  The Comet would have dominated the jet market except they fell out of the sky due engineers missing metal fatigue.  Claimed at the time this was because metal fatigue was a new phenomenon, but I don’t believe it.  Metal fatigue caused considerable problems in ships ten years before, and all the warnings were there.

Perhaps after being ahead in initial railway development, we were all burnt out of creativity after around 1860?

Norm

Far from it!  First power stations, first turbines, world wide telegraph system, first refrigerated ships and many other maritime innovations.  First transatlantic wireless, followed by the Empire Chain which was global.  First television broadcast…

But it’s true momentum was lost.  Too many working in industry at all levels, having got jobs they understood, hated change and did everything in their power to stop it.   So many British ideas and designs were sold overseas and products manufactured abroad.  Allowed Pops to stay happy with Whitworth, blissfully unaware that the world wanted Metric, apart from the US, who didn’t need to buy British.

Dave

[Martin Kyte]

On Martin Kyte Said:

Gunpowder.

True, China.   But the British became extremely adept at using gunpowder as a way of making friends and influencing people.

Mathematics.

Many British advances in the 19th century.   Many SI units celebrate British scientists; Watt, Kelvin, Joule, Newton, Farad. and I think Siemens too.  Bit cheeky to claim the Henry as well, because he was born in the US.  Clerk-Maxwell identified that radio must exist, whilst Rayleigh nailed ‘the telegraphers equations’, from which modern communications were developed.

Geometry.

The lever.

Gears

Irrigation

All a fair cop guv!

The Aquaduct

True but it was the British who developed the canal network as a way of cheaply moving goods on an industrial scale.  Canals did an excellent job, but were limited by geography, and slow moving.   They led straight to the idea of a railway network, leading to the development of the steam locomotive.

Astronomy

Too cloudy for astronomers here, but Lockyer first identified Helium in 1868 (in the Sun, it wasn’t found on earth until later), and John Couch Adams predicted Neptune mathematically.   William Parsons was the first to identify spiral galaxies.  Many other examples.

regards Martin

Dave

[WearyParticipant @weary]

At the risk of ‘lowering the tone’ of the discussion ->

Toilet paper!

(US invention: J Gayetty)

& ref Norm Norton’s question (way) above:

Perhaps not a great influence on ‘history’ but a significant affect on public health.

Phil

[SillyOldDuffer]

On SillyOldDuffer Said:

…

The Comet would have dominated the jet market except they fell out of the sky due engineers missing metal fatigue.  Claimed at the time this was because metal fatigue was a new phenomenon, but I don’t believe it.  Metal fatigue caused considerable problems in ships ten years before, and all the warnings were there.

…

 

The phenomenon of metal fatigue was very well known at the time.

However, in order to assess the fatigue properties of structures, it was usual, in fact considered standard practise, to do the calculations for each part of the structure separately – this was in line with the scientific principal of only changing one variable at a time.

What wasn’t fully realised was that the complexity of the stresses and strains in a jet airliner* meant that the structure as a whole had to be analysed, which is what they did using the water tank test rig to track down the cause of the crashes (though I believe the Comet was said to have undergone more extensive fatigue testing then any previous aircraft, including tests of complete sections of the structure, so the engineers certainly weren’t unaware of the potential problems).

One of the chiefs of Boeing remarked that had they been first with a jet airliner, they would have made exactly the same mistake.

*Other large pressurised aircraft had been built, notably the B-29, but the B-29 had a service ceiling about 10,000 ft lower, a cruise speed about half that of the Comet, and it was a military aircraft, and therefore much more robust – the Comet 1 used quite remarkably thin skin panels.

[Weary]

I would add radio, nuclear reactor, the submarine, transistor, the fountain pen and obviously metric system

 

On Weary Said:

At the risk of ‘lowering the tone’ of the discussion ->

Toilet paper!

(US invention: J Gayetty)

& ref Norm Norton’s question (way) above:

Perhaps not a great influence on ‘history’ but a significant affect on public health.

Phil

This might look like a small feat. But one big superpower was incapable to manufacture it until 8 years after they went to space 🙂

 

[speelwerkParticipant @speelwerk]

Judging by the replies The Brits did not invent modesty.

[speelwerk]

On speelwerk Said:

Judging by the replies The Brits did not invent modesty.

May I modestly dis-associate myself from that remark ?

MichaelG.

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#767505   https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/topic/did-the-british-invent-everything/#post-767505

[Martin KyteParticipant @martinkyte99762]

Canals were an import

 

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Sadly, I think that water borne transport was used by the Romans. They certainly used Carr Dyke around here.

The problem now, is that Britons are afraid of being proud of their achievements. “Not the done thing, old chap” And we are being brainwashed into believing the nonsense that Britain is useless, so that the prophesy becomes self fulfilling.

MANY MANY things were invented in Britain, (Without our innovators, Steam engines, steam powered boats tarmac, the jet engine, iron ships, lawn mowers, etc, would not have happened until much later)  its just that we we were prepared to let others develop them into volume production. And, sadly, we still are for many things.

Britain was great when it was the centre of the industrial revolution, and made things.

Howard

[southernchapParticipant @southernchap]

The Morse Taper, in fact, the capabilities and design patterns of the machine tools we use today had their genesis in the USA.

If Deckel consider the Morse Taper/40INT/50INT taper as a worthwhile thing for their universal milling machines I guess they may have done something right.

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

The British problem seems to me to be a distaste among the upper echelons for anything involving manufacture. They just want to be involved in finance, property dealing, insurance etc. I read recently that the bankers of Liverpool made more money out of shipping than either the ship owners or the merchants. Trouble is that if you don’t have the activity that creates the wealth, no-one makes any money. Don’t get me wrong, we need bankers, if I have a whizz bang invention I need capital to set up and make it, but buying and selling shares, money etc is a different issue.

The chap who designed Bristol aero engines (Roy Fedden) was bemoaning the lack of qualified engineers in the 1930s, and even Prince Albert could see that Germany was educating more engineers than us back in the 1860s

[speelwerk]

On speelwerk Said:

Judging by the replies The Brits did not invent modesty.

No, we invented understatement, self-effacement and reticence too.   The story is told of two Englishmen who found themselves sharing a railway compartment in Uzbekistan; they didn’t speak.

🙂

Dave

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