D C Stirling/Hot Air Engine – Burner

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

I recently purchased a D C Hot Air engine but less the spirit (meths) burner. Restoration of the engine is now complete. I can only find rather poor quality photos of a burner which lack details. Making one from scratch with such little info has not been successful, so am wondering if anyone can help with a drawing or helpful info.

Ta Muchly!

David G

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Design Info Req’d

[Clive BarkerParticipant @clivebarker72854]

Hi Dave,

I too am looking for a suitable burner design, but for a Stirling hot air engine. I have made the Bruce Engineering kit and run the engine off an hoc temporary burner but would like to make something more satisfactory. So I too am looking for suitable designs – preferably with some kind of reservoir so the burner can run for a long time between fills.

Clive.

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Thanks folks.

The objective is to make a replica of the original burner as this is a restoration project. Indeed, it is a thin flat box with a wick at one end in some sort of holder. My replica is based on photographs and is about the correct size but there is insufficient detail in the photographs to establish exact detail. The difficulty is to get a correct burn without flaring and overspill of meths despite having the tiny reservoir only half filled.

A version of the D C engine was sold in the USA using a sort of tea light but this has a different cast base.

Davies Charlton on the Isle of Man made the famous DC diesel engines for model aircraft and were quality engineers so I have no doubt that the British version of the hot air engine worked well with the burner supplied.

A quick google will produce several photos, some of the engines being working.

David G

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Another quick look at the USA version on a website shows what appears to be a deeper base casting with a small removable round burner which has a wick. It has no handle but there are photos of one with a small handle on other sites.

The plot thickens.

David G

[Clive BarkerParticipant @clivebarker72854]

Thanks John for the helpful comments. Yes, now you mention it I can see that height was already a problem with my temporary burner. Will look into propane/butane alternatives.

Clive.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

David you may be better asking on one of the forums that cover "toy" steam engines like Bing, Marklin, Mercier, etc as there may well be some collectors there that have an original of your engine. There are also some Sterling engine forums.

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

August 1954 issue of "Model Maker" has a description of the J.E. Jane "Chicken hopper" feed system for a higher supply tank.

Regards Ian.

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Dave, a nice wee engine, good to see a box with it.
I would suggest making a plinth of wood for it, say an inch, inch and a half, and make a deeper tank, but your probably best not to use more than about 20ml of meths. I,d put a sheet of stainless, with a hole to put the wick through as a heat shield, or you will waste a lot of meths as the tank heats up. From the picture on the box it may have had something like that.
Ian S C

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Dave, further to last nights bit, instead of cotton(or asbestos)string for a wick, I use fine florists wire, it's about 26swg, and made of iron/steel. A wick made of a bundle of this will last almost for ever. I first got the idea from an article in volume 1 of Model Engineer, from 1898, so it not new.

Ian S C

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Ian, thanks. Not heard of that one so will give it a try. I guess few others know about it too.

I posted to a few other sites and am hoping for a drawing/sketch with dimensions of an original burner. A photo already posted looks promising. It appears there have been more than one type of spirit burner of the thin tray type which could be due to developmental issues.

I'll post back with more info in due course.

David G

[Andy HoldawayParticipant @andyholdaway]

David, I've just acquired one of these engines, fortunately complete with the burner, so if you still need any info to build a burner let me know and I'll get it drawn up.

Andy

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Thanks Andy – that would be useful. If you want my email then do get back to me.

Regards,

David

[Andy HoldawayParticipant @andyholdaway]

David, I'll have a measure and draw session at the weekend and get back to you once I'm done.

Andy

[Andy HoldawayParticipant @andyholdaway]

David, I've sketched and dimensioned the burner, and taken a few pictures as well. I've put them in an album **LINK**

If you need any more info, let me know. I was going to draw this up properly and my pc is playing up, then the scanner wouldn't communicate, so back to pencil, paper and camera!

Andy

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

Thanks Andy – useful data I did not have but I got close to the dimensions you give. I'll make another and try it as the current burner tends to flare after a few minutes. I think this is due to pressure building up in the burner tank as it heats up. But until that happens the engine works fine, meaning a little tweaking to your dimensions may sort that out.

Thanks again.

David G

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

David, you might find that you need a vent some where away from the flame area, on my burners I usually drill a 1/16" hole in the filler cap.

Ian S C

[Andy HoldawayParticipant @andyholdaway]

Ian, on this burner the filler cap is also the wick holder. Mine flares as well once it gets hot, but not disastrously.

I forgot to mention that in my burner there is a hard felt wadding in a horse shoe shape that retains the meths and stops it boiling up. There is a recess for the wick to sit in.

Andy

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

David, I hadn't looked at Andy's photos, I see now how it works, I think that as the meths heats up, the vapor ignites, and flares up, if it got to the right temperature you could get four little jets of flame from the 1 mm vent holes.

Ian S C

[David GosdenParticipant @davidgosden83033]

I think there have been 'challenges' with burners as it appears there are several different designs.

On the box that came with my engine there is a picture of a tank with a small vertical vent pipe from just to the right of the handle.

Until now I have not seen anything about a felt pad but I have seen glass spirit burners like the ones used in small oil lamps. I think these were with the last engines made.

It does seem that stopping the meths 'boiling over' and causing the flare up can be done with a felt pad.. I'll have a go at this as soon as poss but may be a while as I'm on a time deadline to build a 5" loco – test run possible in 2 weeks time so need to finish a rolling chassis. Also – the management's birthday !!!!! 'Nuff said?

If you have a go at a modification to your engine get back and let me know how successful it is please.

David G

[Author]

Posts