Compressed air on lathe

[Allen PaddockParticipant @allenpaddock42703]

Hi as i am still new to this i was wondering if any body has put a small air tube from a compressor  say just a low poundage to the rear of chuck to cool the cutting tool and to gently help  blow the swarf away as i say just a thought if you all think its a stupid idea then i wont bother doing it,

[Allen PaddockParticipant @allenpaddock42703]

[Frank DolmanParticipant @frankdolman72357]

     Part of the conglomerate for which I was at that time (mid fifties) working,

 introduced a set of kit which pumped liquid carbon dioxide down bored-out

 cutters on lathes and mills.  They called the idea Ceedeecut.  It was said to

 give better finish and to allow much faster cutting than suds.  I suspect that

 blown air will give inferior finish and demand slower feed rates than suds.

 

     Nevertheless, experimentation is the spice of life.  There can be no harm

  in trying!

[Eric CoxParticipant @ericcox50497]

When I worked in the food industry the filling machines had a 3 foot diameter PTFE seal that had to be lapped in. To achieve this the machine was run without lubrication on the seal. We used compressed air at 80 PSI to help cooling so a few pounds on a lathe wouldn’t have much effect. I would never combine swarf with compressed air because at some point eyes would enter the equation.

[Peter GainParticipant @petergain89847]

Eric Cox rightly draws attention to the danger of eye injury. Also, compressed air can force swarf under & into slideways etc. not a good diet for precision machines!

Peter Gain.

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Some of the “Re-invented” technology uses a combination of compressed air and atomised cutting fluid fed to the cutter/workpiece interface for “Mist” spray cooling.

 

 Thought to be the best thing since sliced by some, “Duplex” did an article on it in 1957. Sadly only have pages 1,2 and 5 of it. (Hint David and s*d the subscription &nbsp

 

   Regards Ian.

Edited By Circlip on 06/11/2009 11:40:51

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Hi Circlip,I think there was another article on mist cooling,maybe in the 80s,I may be wronge,I may have seen it in one of my older copies,I’ll check it out,I was going to try it a few yrs back.IAN S C

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

There are 2 points about all these mist spray cooling systems.

 

1. The liquid in whatever form provides some form of lubrication, which assists finish.

2. The cooling depends not simply on the passage of the mist at a lower temperature, but  mostly in fact on the latent heat of evaporation of  the liquid, even in droplet form.

 

So they are not dependent solely on temperature difference, and the latent heat bit dramatically imporves energy absorbtion.

[Michael Webb 1Participant @michaelwebb1]

Bridgeport milling machines used to use a spray mist system in their industrial interact milling machines,but unless you have an efficient extraction system,it was considered beneficial to tool life and surface finish but not to your health.It was  abandoned due to health and safety requirements.

Edited By Michael Webb 1 on 06/11/2009 21:00:01

[David ColwillParticipant @davidcolwill19261]

I made a spray mist for my Denford Triac Milling machine which worked very well but very quickly filled the workshop with a choking mist. I have no doubts having breathed the stuff that it is very bad for you!!! I did find though that disconecting the coolant and just using the diaphragm compressor to blow on the cutter was suprisingly effective.

[mgjParticipant @mgj]

there is in all this perhaps, just one question.

 

What advantage does this offer the model engineer?

 

Ordinary coolant does the job, washes chips away, suppresses dust, lubricates, cools and drains away with a minimum of fuss. Its not even very messy and one can run the same coolant round and round the system  for ages so its pretty cheap.

 

Now we are looking at compressors (small), spray units, extractor systems, one shot lubrication, and we are not getting rid of the chips.(for milling)

 

I’m sure its a great idea for some workshops, but I’m afraid that I’m a little underwhelmed.

 

 

[David ColwillParticipant @davidcolwill19261]

My Triac has no facility for coolant. The base of the machine is flat so any coolant just runs onto the floor! My first thought was to implement a normal coolant system but it was too much work, also all the electronics for the CNC are in the base so coolant leaks could be disastrous. The compressor does clear chips away quite nicely and I happened to have it lying around, so it did seem to be the logical way forward all be it not ideal.

[David Clark 13Participant @davidclark13]

Hi There

An alternative idea.

 

In industry a method sometimes used to keep a machine clean is to use a vacumn cleaner to suck the swarf of the machine. Clamp the hose as close to the cutter as possible.

 

This removes the swarf and also keeps the cutter cool by drawing air past it.

No problems with swarf blowing around either.

regards David

 

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Need to be careful with a vac David, spray swarf like Brass is ideal for letting the magic smoke out of electrics.

 

  You COULD always try this :-  http://www.cgallery.com/jpthien/cy.htm

 

  Oh Bu**er, sumat else to make.

 

  Regards  Ian.

 

 OOOPS, forgot the baby version :-  here

Edited By Circlip on 07/11/2009 10:51:21

Edited By David Clark 1 on 07/11/2009 17:58:29

[Ian S CParticipant @iansc]

Had good illustration of the effect of metal(swafe from bandsaw)on a domestic vacuum cleaner,bosses grandson helping to clean up the workshop–BANG-silence.Many years ago saw another one accidently sucking up petrol soaked rubbish–whoosh-silence,so just watch what you use the vacuum cleaner for,unless it is effectivly isolated from the motor it would not be good using it when cutting cast iron or brass where you have fine particals that could go through the bag and into the motor.IAN S C

[Lawrie Alush-JaggsParticipant @lawriealush-jaggs50843]

I can’t add much to the discussion other than to say to Circlip that i built a cyclone for my woodworking machinery a couple of years ago.  It is designed to run with a standard vacuum cleaner rather than a dust extractor.  The plans came from an aeronautical engineer who teaches at a polytechnic in your country and who had the recipe printed in Router magazine.

It is very simple to make apart from the 1600 odd 3/64 holes that have to be drilled.

I have found that the only thing that it cannot remove is brick dust and fine redgum was dust.  No, it removes all but the finest stuff and that finest stuff gets caught by the filter in the vacuum cleaner. I will see if I can find the article and approach Router or their publishers for permission to post it here or to reprint in MEW.

[Jim WhetrenParticipant @jimwhetren72358]

Here’s my twopenn’orth,

I agree with David regarding the use of a vacuum cleaner; but….there are cleaners and cleaners.

I have used for some time a Workshop Cleaner, the type which is wet or dry, with the facility to plug in power tools allowing the cleaner to start up when the tool is switched on.

Although this comes into its own when connected to woodworking tools; routers, planers etc. keeping everything clean and dust free, I use it a lot with the metalworking machines during machining and when doing a clean up.

It is a boon when working on cast iron and brass and also getting the fine splinters from some milling operations.

Because it doesn’t have a bag, swarf contaminated with coolant isn’t really a problem and it removes bits from all the hard to get at places.

The only thing to watch is to clean the end of the nozzle as it also used in the car.

Suck it up

Jim

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