Cleaning : Metho, Turps, Isopropyl Alcohol, Shellite, Kerosene

[BWParticipant @bw]

Hey,

Cleaning : Metho, Turps, Isopropyl Alcohol, Shellite, Kerosene

Have been trying to blue some chess pieces and was using kerosene to clean the grease off them prior to bluing.

In my googling I have seen people use any and all of the above listed fluids to clean metal prior to bluing, electrolysis,painting etc

Is there any rhyme reason or logic regarding which of these to use in any given situation ? In my mind, I see them all as being vaguely alcoholic fluids, popular myth has it that people used to drink metho so they put special; stuff in it to make it taste awful.

To clean up a greasy piece of metal prior to painting, bluing, welding, soldering ………. What do you use and why do you use it ?

Bill

[BWParticipant @bw]

What cleaning fluids for different jobs

[Bob Brown 1Participant @bobbrown1]

I use acetone to clean metal parts particularly when using Loctite on parts.

[SandgrounderParticipant @sandgrounder]

I also use acetone, but as a de-greaser it's also very good at removing oils from your skin so use gloves.

It's not an popular myth with regards to alcohol additives to prevent drinking,

from Wikipedia,

Pyridine is added to ethanol to make it unsuitable for drinking.

John

 

Edited By Sandgrounder on 15/12/2016 12:59:33

[roy entwistleParticipant @royentwistle24699]

What are your chess pieces made from ?

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Availability will depend on which country you are in.

White spirit / turps substitute / common household paint thinner is the cheapest and most available to start cleaning oil off things.

Diesel is not much good as it is very oily itself but can be used as stage 1 if you have some gash tank drainings available.

Petrol is too heavily taxed to consider but is fine if you are in the Gulf states.

You can consider degreasing with a bath/kitchen worksurface cleaner and water. Probably ammonia based so not for brass.

After initial degrease you may have a layer of water based dirt that needs plain soap and water which wouldn't be effective until the grease is removed.

For stage 2 cleaning cellulose paint thinners (ether), or carburetta cleaner will also shift some oils that white spirit won't touch. Acetone, and dichloroethylene or trichloroethylene are good but not so readily available in the UK.

Alcohol / meths is rather weak as a cleaner but that makes it better for delicates, like getting oil out of clothes that a powerful solvent melts or removes the dye from.

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Whilst the items listed by Bill are all capable of removing grease they have different properties that make them more or less suitable in particular circumstances.

• Turpentine. A mixture of turpines. Is a good oil paint thinner, smelly and may not be the real thing. Wouldn't be my first choice to clean metal but better than nothing.
• Kerosine/Paraffin. A light oil. Cheap. May contain undesirable additives. Slow evaporating, therefore best for cleaning up old engines and the like. Tends to leave an oily film that has to be removed by something else.
• Diesel. Oil similar to Paraffin but heavier. Contains additives. Not as effective as paraffin and much more likely to leave a greasy film. Waxes in very cold weather.
• Naptha. A very light oil. Good degreaser. Fast evaporating. The fumes may be objectionable and a fire hazard,
• Petrol. Mixture of very light oils and other substances. Properties similar to Naptha but the high percentage of extremely light oils makes it a dangerous fire hazard.
• Meths. Mostly Ethanol with additives to make it inedible. Dissolves many oils and greases, also inks and anything else that uses alcohol as a solvent. Quick evaporating.
• Acetone. A Ketone. Dissolves Wax, many glues, resins, some plastics and Nail Varnish. Quick evaporating. Useful.
• Isopropanol. An alcohol. Pure because it cannot be abused. A good alternative to Meths. Dissolves super-glue.
• In increasing power (and need to take care), inorganic chemicals: washing up liquid; soap, Washing Soda, Household Ammonia, and Caustic Soda. Don't use on Aluminium!
• Carbon Tetrachloride. Organic compound. Very good degreaser. Dangerous fumes.

[pgk pgkParticipant @pgkpgk17461]

For some small parts a quick burst of carb cleaner.. xylene is a brilliant solvent with it's own H&E arguments. It looks like you can buy 5L on ebay for not that much.. amazing that it can get delivered for that as a hazardous product. Less than £15 for 5L delivered makes it cheaper than meths???

[Gordon WParticipant @gordonw]

For small metal bits- very hot water and washing powder, as used in washing machines. Rinse well in hot water. I'm sure I've said this before.

[SpurryParticipant @spurry]

Posted by pgk pgk on 15/12/2016 13:52:04:

For some small parts a quick burst of carb cleaner.. xylene is a brilliant solvent with it's own H&E arguments. It looks like you can buy 5L on ebay for not that much.. amazing that it can get delivered for that as a hazardous product. Less than £15 for 5L delivered makes it cheaper than meths???

Thanks for the tip. I'll have some at that price too.

Pete

[Bob Brown 1Participant @bobbrown1]

Acetone is not expensive or difficult to get hold of e.g. around £13.79 delivered inc VAT UK

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Just for interest I have a book that recommends the following process for cleaning new Microscope Slides before critical work.

"Boil in tap water, then steep in Fuming Sulphuric Acid for no more than 3 minutes, soak in Bench Sulphuric Acid for a few hours, rinse in filtered running water for at least half an hour, rinse in distilled water, then either oven dry or store in filtered iso-propanol."

Now that's what I call degreasing!

[Richard S2Participant @richards2]

Looking at your Album Pics, it appears you're using Steel?. If so, then I presume you're planning to Blue using Heat?.

The parts I have done like this required very little effort and very few obnoxious fluids etc. I just clean them up with some new Wet or Dry Carbon Paper, then proceed to to treat with heat . I fix by quenching in Oil. I used this on some Throttle Plates I made-

Still clean after a few years, but for Chess Pieces, you may benefit from lacquering after for more protection..

Edit- I do however have obnoxious chemicals, and have an unopened bottle (Safely Bunded) of Carbon Tet. Had to sign the Poisons Log at my local Chemists over 30 years ago. This is for my T.Engine when ready to prep for paint. Familiar with it's use from when I was a Printer/Photo Stencil producer.  

 

 

Edited By Richard S2 on 15/12/2016 16:46:37

[JAParticipant @ja]

Turpentine and white spirit are not the same. Turpentine comes from the resin of a tree while white spirit, also called turps substitute, is an almost pure alkane with a density very close to paraffin/kerosene.

Good quality white spirit is my general cleaner of choice. It is cheap, far safer than petrol and unlike paraffin does not contain water (paraffin/kerosene can contain water which can lead to rust). Obviously white spirit will not remove some residues. Then meths, and other solvents, usually an aerosol degreaser, are used. I would not used cellulose thinners and xylene unless I really had to.

For cleaning steel prior to blueing I used white spirit followed by a degreaser, perhaps meths, and then washed in hot weak water/washing up liquid with a final rinse in very hot water. The final blueing results have been good. The greatest difficulty is not the cleaning but deciding when to remove the nut or screw from the bed of hot brass particles.

JA

[Richard MarksParticipant @richardmarks80868]

Toolstation Brake Cleaner works for me.

[the artfull-codgerParticipant @theartfull-codger]

My favourite is cellulose thinners, I use it for thinning various paints for spraying with of course,& cleaning all sorts of oily filth off machines, it dissolves some paint finishes so you've got to be carefull & there's nothing better for cleaning paint brushes out. turps sub & white spirit don't come anywhere near for cleaning paintbrushes.

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Water soluble oil-based degreasers such as Gunk and water soluble cutting fluid can be applied neat, brushed in and then washed off in hot water. Additional washing up liquid removes any residue and if you use blistering hot water, a quick shake and wipe down will be assisted by self drying – any traces of moisture will tend to evaporate. Isn't suitable for all situations but works for many parts such as engine and machine parts.

[BWParticipant @bw]

Thanks for your collective wisdom and responses. Will try some of the different suggestions given.

My chess pieces are made from low carbon steel (black bar) and stainless steel there are a couple of photos in my only album. Haven't made a full set yet, am experimenting with how to do it.

Following a suggestion given on another forum, am chasing the spectacular and vivid purple/blue ("peacock colours&quot transition and it has been very difficult. Gotta keep practicing.

Couple of surprises along the way

1. You can use a paint stripping hot air gun to blue metal – think I discovered that in a post somewhere on this forum – and I've used this idea successfully.

2. You can use those relatively small "cigarette lighter" gas torches to blue metal

3. Best richest colours are achievable on very well finished and polished workpieces but ironically these colours may rub off very easily – I have yet to verify this.

Yellow, black and blue all seem relatively easy to achieve compared to the rich and vivid blue/purple often seen on welded work.

Clickspring has a terrific video showing how he prepared the hands of a clock for bluing. Would take me aaaages doing that for all 36 chessmen. Clockmakers in general use the same bluing technique on very fine screws and get magnificent results.

There's another video out there with a bloke making 20 sided dice that he colours by hand with flame. He makes the comment that things have to be "stupid clean".

Bill

[Nick WheelerParticipant @nickwheeler]

I use aerosol brake cleaner for degreasing small parts of the lathe/mill because it's effective and quick. Even £2 a can soon adds up, so large or really dirty parts get cleaned in cellulose thinners in an old washing up bowl because it's even more effective and cheap. I do this outside!

Petrol, paraffin, kerosene, white-spirit, avgas etc aren't good for paint prep in my experience, as they leave their own greasy film on the parts.

[BWParticipant @bw]

Posted by Richard S2 on 15/12/2016 16:40:06:

Looking at your Album Pics, it appears you're using Steel?. If so, then I presume you're planning to Blue using Heat?.

The parts I have done like this required very little effort and very few obnoxious fluids etc. I just clean them up with some new Wet or Dry Carbon Paper, then proceed to to treat with heat . I fix by quenching in Oil. I used this on some Throttle Plates I made-

Still clean after a few years, but for Chess Pieces, you may benefit from lacquering after for more protection..

Edit- I do however have obnoxious chemicals, and have an unopened bottle (Safely Bunded) of Carbon Tet. Had to sign the Poisons Log at my local Chemists over 30 years ago. This is for my T.Engine when ready to prep for paint. Familiar with it's use from when I was a Printer/Photo Stencil producer.

Edited By Richard S2 on 15/12/2016 16:46:37

When I tried quenching in oil it masked the pretty colours and gave an overall much darker appearance with the blues and purples seen as subdued shadows underneath the outer darker layer.

[Anthony KnightsParticipant @anthonyknights16741]

I use Brake and Clutch cleaning fluid for de-greasing just about everything. I costs just over £10 for 5 litres from the local car spares shop.

[Old SchoolParticipant @oldschool]

I also use brake cleaner in 5 litre cans it also comes with a spray dispenser but it's a few pounds more than the basic cleaner.

[john fletcher 1Participant @johnfletcher1]

I have a small motor bike with a rusty petrol tank. I put in some paraffin and some screw shook the lot about and got rid of lots of rusty particles. I bought some resin tank sealer, I think the tank needs more cleaning before applying the resins. After looking on you tube but not sure what to use, bit confused. I'm sure a reader will have successfully done the same job. Advice please here or via a PM. John

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Adding coarse gravel will help to descale it. Never had much faith with resin coating the insides due to non chemical bonding of it to metal. Welding or brazing much more reliable.

Regards Ian.

[Matt CParticipant @mattc]

This utube video by Dan Gelbart on Coatings has some pertinent information on degreasing/preparing surfaces for painting etc. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7onZGqrYyY

Edited By Matt C on 16/12/2016 10:54:48

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