Changes to Fusion 360 Terms

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Posted by blowlamp on 19/09/2020 11:41:31:

The other bad news is that the Steep & Shallow milling strategy appear to be for the chop in the free version come October.

It is already now classed as an "extension" and has been for a few months which means you have to pay to play, you can buy 1 day use or one month as needed. You can't even go back to edit something that used it in the past with out using up credits.

By playing with the stay down percentage and distances you can save a bit of time and as I said my rapids are set quite low and I often cut at 80% of those so not too much difference, that bit of pattern making I did recently was feeding at the same rate as my rapids as the wood cuts easily..

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Posted by Brian H on 19/09/2020 12:27:27:

I think you have some of us salivating Neil, when can you tell us?

Brian

I was saving up to buy Alibre, don't trust cloud only, especially after DrafSight pulled the plug. I'll never go for CNC, so should I just keep my powder dry?

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Duncan,

If you had invested a great deal of time learning Fusion 360 or had already purchased an Alibre license, then I could understand someone staying with that investment in time (and perhaps money).

For some years, there was an ongoing debate here about which 2D CAD package was the best. As a long time user of TurboCAD, I always suggested that people tried it out, although many thought it wasn't for them and suggested other products. However, I'd spent some time getting to know TC and it has served me very well for over 20 years. So clearly, people will support the product that they have some some sort of investment in – be that time, money or just pure emotion.

In your case, it seems that you have no pre-existing investment in any 3D CAD system at this time (and no need for CAM if you are not planning to use CNC). I was in a very similar situation last year and found that I could download the Community Edition of Solid Edge 2020 for free. This is a very powerful CAD system that like both Fusion & Alibre will need an investment in time to learn to use it well.

Since starting to use it I have found out a little more about it's technical background and there are many professional CAD users who believe that Solid Edge is the best 'mid-range' professional CAD system available. I was also surprised to find that Solid Works (another very popular high end CAD system) uses the same underlying CAD 'engine' as Solid Edge which they licensed from Siemens (who own SE).

So I would very strongly recommend that you download SE 2020 Community Edition and work through the online tutorials before parting with any money for another 3D CAD product. I don't think you will be disappointed and if you really don't like SE – you can always purchase an Alibra license later.

Just a thought.

Regards,

IanT

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Thanks Ian, I've been using SE 2-D for a while and am beginning to get used to its oddities, I'll bear the 3-D version in mind. When the Alibre offer via MEW was on I gave it a go and was surprised how well I got on with it. I managed to model a tapered fluted con rod and work out its mass and CG, so impressed myself at least. That was a while ago, so I'll be at the bottom of the learning curve again

Edited By duncan webster on 21/09/2020 00:01:35

[IanTParticipant @iant]

I was thinking about my first version of TurboCAD yesterday Duncan.

It was version 4 and came for free on the cover of one of the popular computer mags of the day (sometime in the 90's). Most of the software provided was either pretty useless or time limited. I think TurboCAD was the only 'serious' bit of software I ever installed and actually continued to use. I can't remember exactly but I probably had a '286' PC running Windows 3.1 at that time – it all seemed pretty state of the art back then.

So did WordPerfect, '2020' spreadsheets and Paradox databases…. It doesn't seem that long ago but then again neither do "mobile" phones the size of shoe boxes either.

I really am getting old!

Regards,

IanT

[Neil WyattModerator @neilwyatt]

Posted by Brian H on 19/09/2020 12:27:27:

I think you have some of us salivating Neil, when can you tell us?

Brian

'In due course'

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Some good news from Lars and the chief at Fusion 360 in a short video, now agreed step files can still be exported as are some other types.

Video here: **LINK**

Emgee

[Old SchoolParticipant @oldschool]

Having just watched the video posted by Emgee I am going to stick with 360. I have found it hard work to get to the level I am at, I have no intention of starting again with another package.

if my little cnc mill runs a little slower I can spare the time it can also do things that I cannot do on a manual mill. I was considering giving the machine to my son but he’s now going to have to wait a little longer.

Edited By Old School on 26/09/2020 07:53:29

[Andrew BinningParticipant @andrewbinning37010]

I have been using Fusion 360 for some time now and am now branching into the CAM or Manufacturing function. My CNC machine is a Sieg X3 upgraded with a 400Hz , 24,000RPM Inverter drive ( from CNC4you.co.uk) running under Mach 3. The basic Fusion 36 does not list a Post processor for Artsoft – Mach 3 but there is one on an AutoDesk website :- https://cam.autodesk.com/hsmposts I hope this is of use to anyone using Fusion 360.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Should do, I had no problem finding it the first time I wanted it and it comes up as that each time now

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Mach 3 mill was in the pp list but not Mach 3 Turn. I had to import the Mach 3 Turn post processor from the Mach 3 forum into the Fusion list, as Jason says once you've used the pp it remembers for the next time of use.

Emgee

[Nick HughesParticipant @nickhughes97026]

Posted by Neil Wyatt on 19/09/2020 10:40:23:

I have been told some very interesting news for anyone who wants an integrated 3D CAD/CAM solution but I can't say more… yet!

Neil

If you know where to look, the cat's out of the bag (I'll let Neil provide more information when he's ready).

Edited By Nick Hughes on 17/10/2020 10:16:41

[John RutzenParticipant @johnrutzen76569]

Hi, I was toying with the idea of trying out CAD only. I just want to try drawing, not cnc but may want to do 3D printing. I tried to download Fusion 360 but found my Macbook won't run it. I'm afraid I've got a very old but much modified Macbook – mid 2009. I was looking at the price of one that will run it and it's about £900 for a 2015 Macbook. Which of these programmes will run on an old Macbook? I used Turbocad about 10 yrs ago for a while but it was available on a CD for about £20 and it was on Windows. I found it ok but took longer than drawing on paper so I stopped using it.

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Posted by John Rutzen on 24/10/2020 08:56:32:

Hi, I was toying with the idea of trying out CAD only. I just want to try drawing, not cnc but may want to do 3D printing. I tried to download Fusion 360 but found my Macbook won't run it. I'm afraid I've got a very old but much modified Macbook – mid 2009. I was looking at the price of one that will run it and it's about £900 for a 2015 Macbook. Which of these programmes will run on an old Macbook? I used Turbocad about 10 yrs ago for a while but it was available on a CD for about £20 and it was on Windows. I found it ok but took longer than drawing on paper so I stopped using it.

Lower cost option would be purchasing a £300 laptop loaded with W10 OS, that would run Fusion 360 and any other FOC CAD program.

Emgee

[John RutzenParticipant @johnrutzen76569]

Hi Emgee, Thank you for the reply. Yes I would be prepared to buy a £3-400 laptop but which one? I would want the biggest screen possible.

[Brian HParticipant @brianh50089]

I can recommend this company for computers;

**LINK**

I recently bought an HP PC from them with a 12 month guarantee.

Brian

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Posted by Emgee on 24/10/2020 09:31:37

Lower cost option would be purchasing a £300 laptop loaded with W10 OS, that would run Fusion 360 and any other FOC CAD program.

Emgee

Emgee has it.

In old money terms think of it as £300 or whatever for a drawing board and all the bits. If you just run the CAD program and never connect the PC to the internet after the initial download all the "Windows is different" bits become part of "how to run my electronic drawing board".

Major, major advantage of having a second machine is that you can run a third party, you tube or whatever, tutorial on the Mac whilst learning to drive the program on the PC "drawing board".

I have an older Mac Pro and set up a Windows 10 Virtual Machine using VirtualBox to run the free version of SolidEdge. Its likely that your Mac can run VirtualBox but memory may be an issue. Frankly I'm unsure whether all the faffing about was worth it especially as, by the time all was done, it cost around £200.

But I had to buy Windows10 and made some desirable computer upgrades along the way. A KVM switch to share my big desktop monitor, second keyboard and compact PC might have been better overall.

Don't skimp on the program you choose. Even a simple one takes a fair bit of learning and its a pain to have to switch. Again.

SolidEdge is daunting but it has all the pro bells and whistles.

The 2D part can still be got at separately too. Which is where I shall start. Also verify that there are downloadable books to help you. I found a copyright free one for the 2D part of SolidEdge which is very respectable. Spent £60 on a book for the 3D side tho' as what could be found was old.

Not for the first time I found that trying to be too cheap costs more!

An older version of VectorWorks will run fine on your Mac, if you can find one for "££ not very much" but I don't know about installation. A proper professional program but the mechanical design side hasn't been updated for getting on for 10 years now. The 2D side is solid, 3D more arcane than i want to deal with and £1,000 to upgrade if I change my OS is a rip off. Great thing about the 2D is a very useful library of common bits.

Clive

Edited By Clive Foster on 24/10/2020 10:15:55

[John RutzenParticipant @johnrutzen76569]

Thank you, I've been looking at the speeds and the cheap ones are slower than this mac. It is 2.66GHz dual core with 8Gb ram and a 240Gb SSD. To get better than that I will have to spend over £800. And this won't run Fusion 360. Or does it run a lot better on windows?

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Posted by John Rutzen on 24/10/2020 09:57:09:

Hi Emgee, Thank you for the reply. Yes I would be prepared to buy a £3-400 laptop but which one? I would want the biggest screen possible.

Sorry about the price John the prices have gone up since I last searched. Found this HP 15-dw1509na 15.6" Laptop – Intel® Pentium™, 1 TB HDD, Black at Currys costing £399

**LINK**

Perhaps smaller screen size than required but it's the size I use with Alibre and Fusion 360 programs, bigger is always better for CAD but surprising how quickly you adjust to the smaller view.

Emgee

[John RutzenParticipant @johnrutzen76569]

Thank you Clive. I was thinking a second laptop would make learning so much easier. So what £300 laptop is definitely going to run Fusion 360? I've found that the issue with my mac isn't the speed it's that Fusion doesn't support my operating system which is OSX 10.11.6 and Apple won't let me upgrade it anymore. My son who is into these things says it's the motherboard. I hadn't looked at Solidedge except to find out it wasn't free.

[John RutzenParticipant @johnrutzen76569]

Thanks Emgee, I hadn't read your post. I was looking at the HP from Currys. Would that run Fusion ok?

[Roderick JenkinsParticipant @roderickjenkins93242]

According to NYC CNC processing speed is more important than multicores for slick running of Fusion 360. So a higher speed i3 is better than a slower i5.

HTH,

Rod

[IanTParticipant @iant]

Posted by John Rutzen on 24/10/2020 10:54:50:

I hadn't looked at Solidedge except to find out it wasn't free.

Maybe Solid Edge wasn't free at one time John but there is certainly a free version available now.

Solid Edge 2020 (Community Edition) is a free 'lifetime' licence for the Siemens 3D CAD system that installs and runs 'locally'.

There is no 'Cloud' run-time or storage involved and it has all the bells and whistles of the full 'paid-for' versions (which are about £3K per seat I believe). The only limitation that I'm aware of, is that any designs developed on the Community Edition cannot be opened on the Commercial User versions. Not a limitation for me – or most here I would guess.

Personally, I'm delighted with SE and I'm now making good progress with 3D CAD using it.

Regards,

 

IanT

Edited By IanT on 24/10/2020 11:53:31

[David JuppParticipant @davidjupp51506]

3D CAD is generally fairly demanding on the graphics hardware – don't expect really good performance from a basic integrated graphics system.

Display size (pixel count) can make a big difference too – more pixels to manage will demand more of graphics and processor.

Larger and more complex models make more demands on the hardware.

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Hi John

SolidEdge community edition is a free download and essentially the full commercial version with crippled export capabilities to make commercial use impractical.

My view is that this sort of thing is a job for a decent used computer. KVM switch and MacMini on permanent BootCamp into Windows or one of the similar size PC bricks was what I ought to have done rather than going the virtual machine route.

I always found laptop screens too small for CNC. Tool menu bars get in the way. My Mac laptops have always been 17" but that was never enough for easy working. I use a 24" desktop monitor. With VectorWorks that lets me work on a basic A4 size drawing area with all necessary toolbars and menu items visible. Everything I do prints A4 or A3.

I suspect that when I get to grips with SolidEdge I shall end up going bigger. Got several stuck pixels so monitor is getting past it anyway.

Life is too short for working around undersize screens. My first CAD (sort of) was MacDraw on a Mac SE. CAD on a 9" screen was "challenging". But we used what we had.

Do verify that whatever CAD program you settle on has decent active drawing blow up and fit to screen capability. I've had VectorWorks up past 5,000 times enlargement, and needed it! Also make sure the line joining and object alignment tools are rock solid. If they are not getting things in just the right place is a monumental frustration.

I've always used a trackball. Bigger ball type. Kensington Expert suits me just fine. Silly expensive compared to a mouse but equivalent resolution with a mouse would probably need a yard square mouse pad! The ball just spins for longer moves.

Bottom line is "If you are not comfortable you won't use it.". Better to spend £500 to be a happy driver than £250 to give up in frustration. Or, worse, waste a couple of months trying to get "free" to work and have nothing to show for it. 20/20 hindsight shows I've probably written the book on that.

At least 500 hours to get fully comfortable with exploiting a usefully good program.

Getting to the manage the bits I want to do now stage is much quicker but "Can manage with what I've found out so far. Don't need to know all the clever stuff." Is not a good way to work, Did that for years with VectorWorks and, in retrospect, wasted a colossal amount of time and frustration.

Clive

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