CCleaner

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

I’ve just run CCleaner free on my machine to get rid of junk. It comes up with a message saying I have 9 out of date drivers, some of which are important. It wants me to pay £1.19 per month, or £1.99 for the Professional Plus version to resolve this. Not a lot of money, and I’m happy to pay to avoid the hassle and potential pitfalls of trying to do it longhand. Anyone got any experience of this software

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

Don’t most OS’s have that stuff built in?

[David JuppParticipant @davidjupp51506]

I’ve used the free version for years, mainly to occasionally clean out the registry.  It has been good for that.

Windows or apps associated with hardware generally do an OK job of alerting me to driver updates.

I’ve recently been cautioned that the optimiser CCleaner can run in the background can conflict with some software.

[Ian PParticipant @ianp]

I have used the free version CC for more or less since it came out (it was called Crap Cleaner then) and I still regularly use it to tidy up the registry, remove duplicate files and uninstall software I no longer use. (Windows 10)

I too have let CC look for ‘drivers that need updating etc’ but have never felt the need to buy the ‘Professional’ version.

I close CC after using it and also have disabled it from running in the background (which I think it does by default)

 

Ian P

[David Jupp]

On David Jupp Said:

I’ve used the free version for years, mainly to occasionally clean out the registry.  It has been good for that.

David, like you I have also been using CCleaner for a few years, the latest version has changed with the Registry Cleaner function now not directly available from the menu so I am not sure it still cleans the registry, can you advise on this point please ?

Emgee

[Ches Green UKParticipant @chesgreenuk]

I’ve used the older (free) versions of CCleaner for years without (AFAIK) any issues.

I don’t let it anywhere near the Registry or update Drivers.

I recently (by mistake) let Windows update my mouse driver …. the mouse immediately started misbehaving. Seems Logitech has removed most mouse drivers from their Support page and rely on Windows to supply legacy drivers. Not good.

I use CC to clean Browsers’ caches (even the Browsers that apparently shouldn’t be running). I run Firefox which clears it’s cache when it closes, but belts and braces.

CC also cleans junk from Applications I select in the CC list.

I know that most of this stuff is doable manually, but CC is a one-click solution so saves a lot of time and hassle.

Sadly, Avast acquired CC in 2017, so who knows what ‘extra’ telemetry is now going on behind the scenes.

Ches

[David JuppParticipant @davidjupp51506]

I haven’t updated for a while, so can’t comment on latest version.

[Emgee]

On Emgee Said:

On David Jupp Said:

I’ve used the free version for years, mainly to occasionally clean out the registry.  It has been good for that.

David, like you I have also been using CCleaner for a few years, the latest version has changed with the Registry Cleaner function now not directly available from the menu so I am not sure it still cleans the registry, can you advise on this point please ?

Emgee

I’ve not had any issues thus far using it to clean the registry, and usefully it still offers a backup option
Now located under Tools

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Behind the scenes computers do a mass of admin.  Accounts, passwords, firewalls, hardware configuration, application set-ups, user preferences, version management, dependencies, and much else.     It can go wrong, possibly deliberately mangled by a cyber attack.  Although fixing a problem might be simple, configuration can get horribly complicated, and, though you can, it’s best not for amateurs to fiddle with it manually.

Back in the good old days computers weren’t as well organised as now and the admin often got into a tangle, filling the system with crud that caused the whole system to slow down or worse.   That created a need for software, written by an expert, that could identify and fix admin problems for users without them having to understand details.

Time flies! Since then many bugs, omissions, issues and general b*ggerances have been fixed, making it less necessary for users to run products like CCleaner.   Need for them reduced not eliminated, but mostly the system keeps itself in order.

In Duncan’s case:

• CCleaner has identified that some later drivers are available.  Look them up – like as not they contain non-critical changes such as performance tweaks, or support for an additional device.  The OS won’t update for an additional device until it detects Duncan adds one.  No harm done by updating, but no good either!  Proceed to the next step if something is wrong.
• I’d leave upgrading drivers to the OS, which usually gets it right.  In the event there’s a problem that the OS misses, try installing from the vendors website.
• If the OS and vendor fail, then try ccleaner or similar.

The advice given above isn’t a universal truth.  Admin can still go wrong on new computers, and older machines still have old problems!

Dave

[Ian PParticipant @ianp]

 

Dave said

• CCleaner has identified that some later drivers are available.  Look them up – like as not they contain non-critical changes such as performance tweaks, or support for an additional device.  The OS won’t update for an additional device until it detects Duncan adds one.  No harm done by updating, but no good either!  Proceed to the next step if something is wrong.
• I’d leave upgrading drivers to the OS, which usually gets it right.  In the event there’s a problem that the OS misses, try installing from the vendors website.
• If the OS and vendor fail, then try ccleaner or similar.

One slight correction, CC tells you some drivers are out of date, but not which ones!

So its bait to get the user to upgrade.

Ian P (still missing XTGold)

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Thanks to peak4 for the info re registry. never had a problem when used in the past.

Emgee

[CirclipParticipant @circlip]

Another one used for years. Only parts I use are “Custom Clean” and “Registry” shown by peak4. Forget the ‘Hooks’ and stay with the freebee.

Regards, T’other Ian.

[Alan JacksonParticipant @alanjackson47790]

Computer Active mag suggest that CC cleaner is not as good as it used to be, and recommended Wise regitory cleaner , disk cleaner, and System Ninja.

Alan

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

What are you chaps doing with your computers that necessitates using these tools?   They’re almost unknown on Apple,  Linux, and Android.   Though my main operating system is Ubuntu (a Linux), I have 3 Windows 10 machines.  None of them have required the attentions of a ccleaner type product, possibly because what I use Windows for is tightly disciplined.    Whilst ye olde Windows tended to disorganise itself, recent versions are far better.  Is the need to clean up a folk memory, or are people doing stuff that causes a mess?   Or maybe own an older, not updated, too small computer that’s kept busy and still has classic shortcomings?   If so, consider buying a new one!

Last time I had to deep clean a Windows machine was 15 years ago when my daughter returned from university.  As young people of all ages are prone to do, she had cruised the net and downloaded all manner of programs, many unhygienic.  Fair bit of malware, and many honest programs left a mess in the registry after being deleted, with several that couldn’t be deleted without a forensic examination.   If playing with random downloads is your game I recommend exploring the web with a copy Windows running in a Virtual Machine, which will protect the day-job operating system from a multitude of hazards.   If necessary a besmirched virtual Windows can be deleted entirely and replaced with a clean install done from scratch.  The principle is simple: don’t mix business with pleasure!  Using same environment to manage your bank account and to have Jack the Lad fun is risky.

Daughters hard-drive was badly fragmented, but Microsoft have mostly fixed that now.  It was a technical omission, long overcome on other operating systems, that took Microsoft a while to correct.   Now I believe all operating systems, limit and correct fragmentation on the fly, making it unnecessary for users to defragment hard drives themselves.  Rarely that is, unless something odd is going on.

More.  The availability of cheap RAM takes most of the sting out of a fragmented hard drive.   When a modern disc controller gets a read request for the first block of a file, it assumes the file is being scanned, and reads ahead, often copying the whole file into a fast memory buffer.  Thus, even if the disc is fragmented, the operating system runs at memory speed, and doesn’t wait for the mechanical drive.   And, if the operating system has plenty of memory, it too will  chomp whole files, again making fragmentation of the hard drive irrelevant!   Buying a computer today go for at least 16Gb RAM, ideally 32Gb, or even more.   The OS will use it to speed everything up, including file operations.

Defragging was once important, now far less so, and defragging an SSD is positively asking for trouble,   SSDs are semiconductor memory of a type that only supports a few million writes before wearing out.  Therefore, data is deliberately written preferentially into little used blocks, not necessarily consecutive.  The goal is to spread writes evenly over the whole.  As an SSD doesn’t physically move a read head over a spinning platter, there’s no speed advantage in defragging an SSD.  Blocks are retrieved with row-column addresses, and it doesn’t matter if blocks are fragmented.   Worse, defragging reduces the life of an SSD by forcing it to do unnecessary extra writes, and it also concentrates read-write activity on to a small number of blocks that get hammered.  Fortunately most utilities make it hard to defrag an SSD.  Unfortunately, sometimes needed, and nothing stops an insistent amateur from finding out how and blundering in.  My advice – don’t.  Not unless you understand SSDs and why a defrag is really necessary.   Remember experience with hard drives is unhelpful – they’re different.

Dave

 

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

Having read and not understood most of the replies, I’ve decided that it ain’t broke, so I won’t attempt to fix it.

As I used to say at work, if you don’t know what you’re doing, don’t do it

 

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Whilst having NO justification for speaking after Dave’s expert advice … May I just put-in a good word for Revo Uninstaller

https://www.revouninstaller.com/

I have only ever used the free version but, having just seen the Black Friday discount offer, I shall probably upgrade to Pro 2.5.0 this afternoon

MichaelG.

[ChrisLHParticipant @chrislh]

So how long will my newly acquired SSD last ? Should I keep a hard drive as stand by ?

[ChrisLH]

On ChrisLH Said:

So how long will my newly acquired SSD last ? Should I keep a hard drive as stand by ?

Early days yet!  Thus far though, SSDs have proved at least as reliable as top-end hard-drives, and they may well turn out much better.   The way they fail is different though:

• hard-drives fail mechanically, bearings, arms, springs, and dirt in the works crashing the heads etc.  So failure mostly depends on how hard and long the drive is driven, and if they are vibrated or shocked.
• SSDs have no moving parts so failure is time related.  A hot SSD will start to fail before the same device kept cool.  The purity of the semi-conductor base matters too; this has improved over time, making recent SSDs more reliable than the first.   The limited number of writes, which worried many, hasn’t caused trouble.

Both HDD and SSD can and do fail though!   Always wise to take backups!

Dave

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Have always used the free version of CCleaner, Too tight to buy the upgrade versions, so live with the apparently outdated drivers, and supposed junk that would cost to update/ delete.

Every week, I deep scan, defragment and back up to an external hard drive, so hopefilly the PC is in reasonable health.

Howard

[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

CCleaner is OK for clearing duplicate files etc. If you use it to update drivers it is not so good. You will find at the next windows update that the drivers you install with it will disappear and the default windows drivers will be reinstalled.  I would not pay for it to update drivers.  Many manufactures drivers are no longer supported in Windows.

[Howard Lewis]

On Howard Lewis Said:

…

 

Every week, I deep scan, defragment and back up to an external hard drive, so hopefilly the PC is in reasonable health.

…

As I asked two posts above in #767451, what requires folk to defrag?  Weekly backup to an external drive is sensible, deep scanning less so, and defrag is dubious.  Checked to see what Windows already does automatically.  By default my Win10 checks weekly and optimises if, and only if, it finds excessive fragmentation.   Is that not ‘good-enough’?

Excessive defragmenting might even be dangerous.  Defrag moves blocks about on the disc at low-level and there will be trouble if it goes wrong – like a power-cut.   My advice, only manually defrag when there’s a performance problem has been clearly identified.  If it ain’t bust, don’t fix it!

The laptop I’m using at the moment was bought new in 2015 and has never been defragged by me – no need.  Just checked to make sure I’m not living in a fools paradise, and its disc is only mildly disorganised – no action required.  Are you doing something special though Howard? A hard-drive would have to be seriously thrashed to fragment a disc significantly in a week; not impossible, but unusual.   Something like a malfunctioning program continually growing and shrinking a file?

Dave

 

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Dave

Back in the ‘olden days’ I used to be fascinated by the live visual presentation of defrag in progress … one really got an impression of something happening !

All smoke & mirrors 🙂

MichaelG.

.

Edit: __ Thanks to the magic of the Internet, I’ve just found this !

https://youtu.be/lxZyxxHOw3Y?feature=shared

.

[Mark EasingwoodParticipant @markeasingwood33578]

One of our local computer repair men writes a column in the local paper. His advice is not to use C-Cleaner, or similar, and not to let anything access the Registry.

I used to use it in ther days of XP-Pro, as I was advised to do so, but I don’t use it on Windows 10/11 machines.

He also advises not to download/use any programmes that claim to speed up your computer, as they will only slow it down.

Similarly he advises to only use the built in Microsoft Defender software, as it is designed to integrate with the OS, and not to install any third party anti-virus software, as they will slow down your computer, and cost you money. His view is that you only need extra protection if you are using parts of the web you probably shouldn’t be!!

The only exception, he suggests, is the free Malwarebytes programme, but don’t install any “bloatware” that may be bundled with it.

If you are using an out of date OS to surf the web, then it may be a different story.

 

 

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