CBN Hones

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

We seem to have a tool-sharpening theme going, so I thought I would add another little Topic.

I spent some considerable [but strangely therapeutic] time recently, correcting the tip-shape of an old graver … using a little sharpening jig and a ‘credit card’ diamond hone.

The result was very good, but it still needs that final finish.

I would normally use an Arkansas stone for this, but decided to try a web-search and soon found this page:

https://woodturnerswonders.com/pages/search-results-page?q=cbn%20hone

… which has some very useful-looking products.

So, the inevitable question is: Does any one know of a UK equivalent ?

MichaelG.

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Ref.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/114489059499

Ref.

https://www.ezelap.co.uk/product/fine-grit-600-201/

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

RIKON PROseries CBN C/Card Stone 350/600 Grits Double Sided

[Charles LamontParticipant @charleslamont71117]

Eze-Lap and DMT diamond products are both available in the UK.

[Charles Lamont]

On Charles Lamont Said:

Eze-Lap and DMT diamond products are both available in the UK.

Thanks, Charles … but that is exactly what I am not looking-for

MichaelG.

[JasonB]

On JasonB Said:

https://www.tomaco.co.uk/product/rikon-proseries-cbn-c-card-stone-350-600-grits-double-sided/

Thanks for that, Jason

… shame about the [inevitable?] UK price uplift, but those are the ones.

MichaelG.

[Michael Gilligan]

On 14 June 2024 at 14:39 Michael Gilligan Said:

[…]

I spent some considerable [but strangely therapeutic] time recently, correcting the tip-shape of an old graver … using a little sharpening jig and a ‘credit card’ diamond hone.

The result was very good, but it still needs that final finish.

I would normally use an Arkansas stone for this […]

 

The scratches are from the ‘Fine’ 201 Diamond Hone:

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.

MichaelG.

 

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Michael, I use 3M micro polishing paper in various grits down to 3micron and it finishes to the degree that you can see clear reflections, this is presuming the graver is HSS. One of the good things with this micro paper is that the grit size is carefully managed so you should not get the gouge marks you are seeing. Best of luck but it makes your hand ache!

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

That’s interesting, Bernard … I had never considered using paper.

The graver is almost certainly a high-carbon steel and is, I think, of considerable age .. it is marked thusly:

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… which was a surprise to me.

 

MichaelG.

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

Michael, what would be the minimum size you’re after? –

Fallkniven make some excellent ‘ceramic’ hones but they are ‘pocket sized’ i.e. about 100x32mm.

I have a 15um sintered-sapphire one, which I see they now offer backed with a 9um ‘fine’ side..

https://heinnie.com/fallkniven-cc4-ceramic-whetstone

 

 

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

The ‘credit-card’ size would be more than adequate for my current needs, and I was particularly attracted by the very realistically-priced  ‘pocket’ ones in my original link.

MichaelG.

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Direct link:

https://woodturnerswonders.com/products/cbn-pocket-hand-hone?variant=9496352129068

 

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

I have a set of three DMT diamond laps of about 25 x 50 mm which I bought about 30 years ago, the finest one would give almost a polished finish, not far off crocus paper.

600 grit would not be anything like fine enough, you would need at least 2400 and also some coarser ones to save time getting the finish.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Interesting that some replies are still advocating the use of Diamond, when my reason for starting the Topic was the availability of CBN.

I am NOT saying that Diamond is totally unsuitable, but the received wisdom is that whilst Diamond is ideally-suited to Tungsten Carbide, CBN is better for Steel.

Please do keep the discussion going … We might all learn something !

Meanwhile, my next stop will be the traditional Arkansas stone.

[ please forgive me if this takes a while … life is complicated at the moment ]

MichaelG.

[old martParticipant @oldmart]

Diamond risks breaking down chemically if used on steel because carbon readily dissolves into iron. This is only likely if there is heat present, so hand laps are relatively safe to use. I do use diamond electroplated wheels on steel, but not frequently enough to wear them out, and not hard enough to generate sparks. CBN is hard enough to sharpen any steel easily without any degredation risk.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Further to Old Mart’s observation … This may be of interest:

https://youtu.be/a7TN6mUR414?feature=shared

MichaelG.

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[Mark EasingwoodParticipant @markeasingwood33578]

Well I know nothing about gravers, and as we know, sharp is a realative term, so I don’t know if this helps.

In the world of woodwork, the Arkansas stones are still a favourite, and it is the wood carvers who require the sharpest edge on their tools. They often sharpen on an Arkansas stone, and then strop the bevel to a mirror polish. When carving they frequently strop, and do not re-hone until the edge is damaged or the bevel is rounded over.

The strop is a piece of thin leather glued to a board, (rough side up), traditional recipes for stropping paste are based on tallow and ?? abrasive. Some people use valve grinding paste, but I have used “Autosol” to good effect.

If I remember correctly, the black stones were used by surgeons to sharpen their scalpels, in the days before 1 use only scalpels.

Arkansas stones are available HERE amongst other sources.

Mark.

Edit: Autosol Metal Polish, i should have written.

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

Michael, the finer grade of micro polishing paper is actually plastic with the abrasive embedded in, the larger grits are on some sort of composite paper that does not easily tear.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Thanks for the updates, Mark and Bernard

MichaelG.

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

https://heinnie.com/spyderco-cbn-benchstone/

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

One of the better pages about Arkansas stones:

https://www.bestsharpeningstones.com/articles/Arkansas-Stones-FAQ.php

I will be back later.

MichaelG.

[Diogenes]

On Diogenes Said:

https://heinnie.com/spyderco-cbn-benchstone/

Thanks for the link, but that one looks rather over-size for my little gravers

MichaelG.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Oh then this really is going to be a bit too big. It came up on my Youtube and shows the mirror finish that can be had with CBN milling cutters so may be of interest.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Wow, Jason ! … that’s “rather impressive”

I seem to recall the great Mr Stevenson remarking, more than once on this very forum, that it was totally impractical to work to microns.

MichaelG.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Just a note about my PICARD graver …

I should really have mentioned that, as manufactured, this one is clearly more suitable for engraving than turning.

The blank is, by no stretch of the imagination,  ‘square’ in cross-section !

From my experience of re-shaping the tip on a diamond hone, I feel quite sure that it is very high quality ‘crucible steel’ … like the very best plane-blades.

I plan to keep it for that purpose: The Swiss gravers being ‘square’ are much better-suited to lathe work.

MichaelG.

[VicParticipant @vic]

I’ve been looking for a small 100mm CBN wheel. Sadly when I do a search they use CBN and Diamond in the same sentence so I’m not exactly sure what I’d receive if I ordered one?

[DiogenesParticipant @diogenes]

When it comes to other abrasives, I have never once regretted any of the times I have spent a bit more money on a ‘better’ wheel from a ‘brand’ or established industry supplier over a cheaper alternative.

Races to the bottom in price do have a real effect on quality.

[Author]

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