buying machine tools from aliexpress experiences?

[Jake Middleton-MetcalfeParticipant @jakemiddleton-metcalfe]

Hello I am a UK based maker of things and generally have a mixture of old English made machine tools and some new Chinese made tools in my home workshop.

I have long noticed on the various offerings from aliexpress.com

For example I am quite interested by some of the surface grinders available such as this:

aliexpress surface grinder

well it looks virtually identical to the manual surface grinder offered by warco:

https://warco.co.uk/metal-grinders/66-surface-grinder.html?search_query=grinder&results=50

which is itself also identical seemingly to that from Chester machine tools:

https://www.chesterhobbystore.com/shop/workshop-equipment/6×12-surface-grinder/

 

Ok so these are probably all coming from the same factory initially but aha! One could seemingly cut out the middleman by buying from aliexpress, or indeed the seller on aliexpress is merely a cheaper middleman BUT…

Of course my gut tells me this is probably going to work out very poorly for me if I were to buy that grinder from aliexpress and that I would potentially waste a lot of time or money. It looks somehow dodgy as heck.

Or does anyone here have an experience to the contrary? It is a lot of money to gamble with after all.

 

I would appreciate the thoughts or experiences of anyone who has ever had a go at dealing with this aliexpress..

Best wishes

Jake

 

[Nigel Graham 2Participant @nigelgraham2]

Aliexpress is only a sort of mail-order supermarket.

I would ask:

1) Does anyone have experience of the specific machines?

2) Does anyone have any experience of purchasing anything from Aliexpress?

If you buy through it:

3) If fault develops is the machine a) covered by warrantee and b) can and will be repaired under warrantee?

4) Is there any sort of after-sales service at all, including a reasonably secure, straightforwards future supply of ancilliary fittings and spares?

5) If you buy an expensive item from a foreign agent like this, are you liable to any import tariffs on it?

 

I would opt for the Warco or Chester option. They are the importers so deal with any Customs bureaucracy (they’d presumably put any tariff or duty on the invoice but save you the admin. trouble), are well-established specialist dealers, and can offer the after-sales service.

 

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Ali will add any taxes at checkout stage so that would be the first thing to do so you know exactly what you are likely to be paying. Compare that with the Warcpo cost less the 15% discount they are currently offering. You will then know what teh actual cost difference is likely to be.

Then it comes down to how much of a gambling man you are.

Machine could have come from the same factory or another one, in either case machines can be spec’d differently which could be things like bearing quality, motor, any control electronics. Almost impossible to know if you are getting like for like.

What to do if there is a problem, is it easy to contact the supplier, get any parts even if sent FOC. What if it needs to go back? Even if it is working what are the chances if you need spares in the future, different specs mentioned above may mean a warco part won’t match yours.

Yes you may get a good one but equally you may not. As an example I got an M2 spiral flute tap along with a couple of other bits a month or so ago. I can’t get it to start a thread let alone cut one but at a couple of quid I can live with it. Not sure I would be so happy with a couple of thousand pounds of machine. The other bits were OK.

Also worth looking at other products that the particular supplier (moon bus) sells to get an idea of who you will be dealing with. If you are happy buying machines from a company that also sells radio control toys and bouncy castles then that’s fine! But they are just box shifters and unlikely to have any real knowledge of what they are selling should there be an issue.

[Bo’sunParticipant @bosun58570]

Good morning Jake,

If you’re looking towards a Far Eastern made machine, I’d be inclined to look seriously at Warco with their current (to the end of April) 15% discount.

I’ve had nothing but excellent after sales service from Warco on three machines purchased from them in the last four years.  The machines have all been fine, accepting the usual fettling required on many Far Eastern made machines.

[Jake Middleton-Metcalfe]

On 8 April 2024 at 20:48 Jake Middleton-Metcalfe Said:

I have long noticed on the various offerings from aliexpress.com

For example I am quite interested by some of the surface grinders available such as this:

aliexpress surface grinder

Once you add delivery, import duty and VAT the Aliexpress grinder comes to £2731.80 (delivery sometime in May).

(Aliexpress won’t add tax/duty to the checkout as the machine is above the £135(?) threshold where they are required to do this – you would need to pay duty (2%) + vat to the shipping company when it lands in the UK)

The Warco one, with the ‘SPRING15’ discount comes to £2758.25

Saving £26.45 for buying direct.

I’d also caution you that the quality standards for manufacture in China are often tailored to the customer – where a manufacturer has a relationship with an importer, there will often be an understanding that a certain level of quality / finish is required at a certain price point, often based on previous issues. Buying as an individual there is no relationship, and the route to getting anything rectified or returning the machine will be torturous and possibly expensive.

[HowiParticipant @howi]

main problem with buying anything large or expensive from the likes of Aliexpress is that the goods are shipped from China, large goods could take months to arrive!.

If anything goes wrong you will have to return the goods to China and that will cost you an arm and a leg, Cheap China post ONLY works one way.

I have found Aliexpress, Temu, Hobbyking, BangGood and others to be reliable and fast and have had no problems, any goods that I consider expensive (over £100 I will only buy if they have a UK oe EU warehouse.

Try and return stuff to China will usually cost more than the item cost in the first place.

While the pricing may look good there are many pitfalls.

For big/pricey goods stick to the UK or EU or you could get badly bitten.

[BazyleParticipant @bazyle]

Not sure whether Andy’s advice above includes all teh shipping. Often it is just to the UK warehouse. Your responsibility to get it from there and the warhouse might also have a handling and storage fee.

For the small stuff it seems to work well. I know several people buying little electrical bits almost every week.

[EmgeeParticipant @emgee]

Aliexpress is the name under which countless sellers provide their services.

I regularly buy items of small tooling such as milling cutters and lathe tooling inserts and have had no problems with quality or late delivery, I always try to use the same dealer.
However I would not be brave enough to spend such a large sum for a machine tool, IMO best follow advice by others who suggest buying from a UK supplier.

Emgee

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Wot Jason said, it’s a gamble!

AliExpress is a marketplace, not a vendor.  They facilitate trade between buyers and sellers, and have little interest in products, good or bad.   A machine tool might be offered cheap by a decent manufacturer who has over produced, or  someone might be selling factory rejects or returns.   Genuine bargain, or horrid disappointment, the customer finds out when he opens the box!

Asking about AliExpress experiences on the forum isn’t much use because the sample is far too small to be meaningful.   A few chaps saying it went well or badly for them doesn’t prove anything.  A better source is TrustPilot, who, based on 140,000 reports, rate AliExpress 2.5 stars out of 5 (poor).

The reason isn’t black and white.   75% of reviews give AliExpress 5 stars, that is a high proportion of customers get what they wanted, hurrah!  But look closer.  The worry is the 17% of customers who only gave AliExpress 1 star: they represent transactions that went wrong and failure to sort the problem out.  If anything goes wrong, the deal can turn nasty.  Unfortunately, UK consumer protection doesn’t apply when buying from abroad, leading to many potential problems.  For example, not unusual to find refunds are only given after faulty items have been shipped back to the seller, purchaser pays.  Therefore read the small-print carefully, and understand the extent to which it will be difficult or costly to get restitution.

As a gamble, TrustPilot suggests there’s a 75% chance of winning and a 17% chance of losing.   (Coincidentally, these odds are slightly worse than playing Russian Roulette!)   Nonetheless, up to a certain size of stake, I’m happy to risk buying from AliExpress and similar, eyes wide open to the possibility I might lose my money.  I generally stay below £100, but it depends on how badly I want the item!   Others would risk less, and some much more.

In principle, I suggest gambling isn’t a good way of saving money, though it depends on the odds and one’s risk appetite!  In this case, a 17% chance of losing £2000 versus a 75% chance of saving a few hundreds doesn’t appeal to me, especially if I was already scraping the barrel to pay for it.  I’d rather pay extra to a UK supplier, who will sort it without too much hassle in the event I get a dud.

Dave

 

 

 

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

There is another issue with buying direct. You as the importer are responsible for CE / UKCA compliance. I know most people don’t bother and enforcement is patchy to say the least, but that’s the law even for pesonal use.

You could get caught at import e.g. if Customs / Trading Standards happen to have a check going on the thing could be rejected at the border for something as simple as the wrong mains plug. You are then out what you paid because shipping it back would likely cost more. They did this with Vevor basically rejecting every electrical item. This is why Vevor UK now don’t sell electrical items.

Much less likely you could be caught in use. Highly unlikely unless you cause interference os somone is seriously hurt or killed. The consiquences could be higher though.

Robert.

[Bazyle]

On Bazyle Said:

Not sure whether Andy’s advice above includes all teh shipping. Often it is just to the UK warehouse. Your responsibility to get it from there and the warhouse might also have a handling and storage fee.

I just used the cheapest shipping option on the Aliexpress listing (£83.63+duty+VAT). I *believe* that this would be delivered to your door, but not certain. There would almost certainly be a handling fee added to the duty / VAT bill by the shipper that would actually make it cheaper to buy from Warco (in addition to the other benefits).

“Better” shipping options go up to over £300+duty+VAT if you want tracking, etc.

[Jake Middleton-MetcalfeParticipant @jakemiddleton-metcalfe]

Right.

You have all made some very good points. I have read every post and considered it.

Probably in this case it makes most sense to buy direct from warco and I was actually not aware of the current discount they are offering. But now on the website it is rather obviously displayed. Well that is quite nice!

It sounds like it’s best to let the UK supplier sort the wheat from the chaff when it comes to far eastern manufacturers.

I did not mention earlier but my lathe and mill are also warco and they have been most adequate for my needs.

 

Best wishes to you all and thank you once again for your thoughts.

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