Book on lathe operation ?

[Rich2502Participant @rich2502]

Looking for a book on operating a basic lathe, I need a complete refresher course since the last lathe I used was during my apprenticeship in the 1990's.

Got an Atlas 12 " or 6" coming my way soon.

[Rich2502Participant @rich2502]

[bernard towersParticipant @bernardtowers37738]

The amateurs lathe by Sparey for one but google gives you plenty of choice .

[Paul LousickParticipant @paullousick59116]

Lots of excellent videos about setting up and using a lathe on Youtube, especially those presented by Joe Pieczynski.

Edited By Paul Lousick on 18/06/2022 23:01:20

[Yngvar FParticipant @yngvarf]

This one is the Atlas version of how to run a lathe.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

+1 on both LH Sparey's The Amateurs Lathe and any version of How to Run a Lathe. Both classics from the same era as your Atlas.

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

I have used this guide quite a bit.

https://archive.org/details/how_to_run_a_lathe_1934/page/n51/mode/2up

Edited By PatJ on 19/06/2022 00:57:55

[Speedy Builder5Participant @speedybuilder5]

It just shows the power of flashing adverts as per the ones on the Top right hand side of the home page !!

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Rich

Start by rooting around the internet and downloading one, or more of the books from older lathe makers who made smaller lathes for the training market. "How to Run a Lathe" is from SouthBend but similar from Atlas, Boxford, Hercus and others are all pretty much equivalent. Fundamentally a question of what style reads best for you.

If you expect to grind your own tools then grab SouthBend Bulletin Number 35, How to Grind Lathe Tool Cutter Bits, which is the best and most comprehensively consistent introduction to things I've yet found. Only 16 pages so its viable to print your own. Can be found on the 'net. Mine came via Scribd, a site I subscribe to.

The SouthBend Cutting tools data sheet is as good an introduction to angles an speed et al as can be found on one piece of paper. Only source I can find is **LINK**

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=4834

Although the tools are shown mounted in Armstrong posts with built in rake the angles are correct for flat mount with the tip on centre height.

Bulletin 5910A on the use of the cutter bit grinding block is also interesting. Again Vintage machinery is the only source I can find **LINK**

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=4831

Internet search will find various descriptions of how to make the beast and lists of dimensions should you fancy one as an early project. Its been on my "I really should" list for, um, er , 40 years!".

A cuttings speed graph, chart or nomogram is very useful. Especially for beginners. I've had the American Machinist Cutting Speed Chart no 30 stuck on the wall pretty much forever. Somewhat obsolete but being a nomogram its easy to see relative variations for different materials. Calculators are fine but they only give one data point so its hard to see how things fit together.

Downloads are great for basic reading and for printing out specific advice. Get a ring binder and a box of transparent wallets so you can keep printouts of useful "stuff" in the workshop in oily finger proof condition. But nothing beats a good book for reference. I've got "lots" but there are a few I always return to and know my way round. Style, presentation and having things explained in a way that suits you are important. I have a few that are frankly a waste of space for me yet others love them. I can see why opinions differ. For me the Sparey book suggested above has about 3 marginally useful pages!

When looking for a book its worth rooting around sites like Scribd to electronically have a quick flip through and short read before buying just as you would in a bookshop. I appreciate the potential copyright issues but its been very useful to me in spending my £30 or so on the right book for me. Hoovering up from recommendations and catalogues back in the day means I have hundreds of pounds worth of paper (in todays money) that, in retrospect, I didn't get value out of.

Abe books is a good resource for hard to find / used / cheaper as can be E-Bay if you wait and can stand wading through lists with lots of repeats.

Clive

 

Edited By Clive Foster on 19/06/2022 09:45:35

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Posted by Speedy Builder5 on 19/06/2022 06:49:32:

It just shows the power of flashing adverts as per the ones on the Top right hand side of the home page !!

The advert has a reasonable return on investment – conversion rate.

Thank you.

Ketan at ARC

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

And to be fair, Neil's book is more about modern lathes, not the vintage Atlas the OP has, hence the recommendations for equally ancient books that address the foibles/needs of machines past.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Just a pity it's not so easy to get the whale oil these days that Sparey mentions

I'd agree with hopper that Sparey's book is probably more suited to users of an Atlas.

It could also be a good example of the power of Ad blocking software that means users may miss out or not see things that could be of use to them.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Ian Bradley's "The Amateur's Workshop" although dealing with the workshop in general, also covers some information on setting up a lathe that Sparey does not cover.

Both books will be of great help.

Howard

[SillyOldDufferModerator @sillyoldduffer]

Sparey is hard to beat, though there are alternatives; I recall being impressed by a well-written South Bend booklet in my youth. The only problem with Sparey is he predates later developments like carbide inserts & Digital Calipers etc, and he sometimes recommends stuff common in 1948 that's impossible to find now. Nothing dreadful, buy it's probably worth complementing Sparey with a more modern book, perhaps Neil Wyatt's 'The Mini-Lathe'. (Not so much for the machine the book is based on, more what it's used for and how, accessories, workshop methods etc.)

Dave

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Posted by Hopper on 19/06/2022 10:00:45:

And to be fair, Neil's book is more about modern lathes, not the vintage Atlas the OP has, hence the recommendations for equally ancient books that address the foibles/needs of machines past.

You are correct up to a certain point Hopper.

The observations we have made resulted in the books for beginners. I will explain:

The old books for the older machines have their place. They were written by engineers, for engineers – many of whom had full time engineering jobs – training / apprenticeships, and who were thought metalwork on mills and lathes in school. So most of the readers of such books had a good chance of understanding what they were reading, especially the terminology.

As metalwork started to get phased out of schools, new people wishing to use a lathe or mill started to have problems. You only have to stand and observe such people at shows watching a demonstration on a lathe or mill on the SMEE demo stand, to see the puzzlement in their eyes, desire to ask questions but failing to do so for fear of looking stupid. You could also see that a lot of the terminology spoken by the demonstrators going over their viewers head.

Many of these new people buy the old second hand lathes, along with the well respected old school books mentioned above, or watch You Tube. Some get on great, and some don't. A good percentage of these new people have a lot of enthusiasm, but have yet to figure out what is a headstock, tailstock, centre – dead/live/revolving/rolling tailstock arbor and so on. We know this based on the telephone calls we get – especially from new buyers who have very limited ideas about the tools they are buying…. at last one call a day!

Such new people have had zero training at school/collage. They are unable to join a club for various personal reasons, but they want to make something. The titles sold by ARC, written by Neil and Jason specifically Lathework for Beginners and Milling for Beginners are directed at such an audience. A good percentage of the people who have purchased these books from us have old lathes, along with the old books. After understanding the basics in the beginner books we sell, it helps them understand the older books better.

In the U.S., we successfully distribute these two titles through Little Machine Shop. A good percentage of their customers have old mills and lathes too, and they too found the same results as we did. Like Jason, they mentioned that the modern books suggest alternative products or updated tooling/terminology to what is suggested in the old books.

In my opinion, the new books complement the old.

Ketan at ARC.

 

Edited By Ketan Swali on 19/06/2022 11:15:39

[Bo’sunParticipant @bosun58570]

Sparey's book is OK, but the quality of some of the photographs in the later editions leave a little to be desired. Presumably where they are a copy of a copy of a copy.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Yes indeed, Ketan. Although, the OP mentions he used a lathe in his apprenticeship in the last century so I think he will relate to the 1935 South Bend/Atlas book OK!

But certainly the best shot is both old and new books. Best of both worlds. I have been fiddling with lathes since 1967 and have a shelf full of books on the topic acquired over the years. You can never have too many. There is something to learn in each one. And I reckon I have learned at least as much from the model engineering books as I did from an apprenticeship. They take it all one step further as necessity is the mother of invention in the cash-strapped home workshop.

I am sure you see an interesting perspective at the shows and in your business. The rest of us tend to take a lot of this stuff for granted. Especially as you say in this world where high-school lads are no longer schooled on lathes and welders etc as a matter of course. But ask them anything about digital technology and it is a different matter!

All the best

Pete

[Ketan SwaliParticipant @ketanswali79440]

Hi Pete,

You mentioned " Although, the OP mentions he used a lathe in his apprenticeship in the last century so I think he will relate to the 1935 South Bend/Atlas book OK! "

I hope you weren't offended by my earlier response, as no offence was intended. I should have clarified that old machine specific books should always be considered, and as you said, all new and old books improve our knowledge. 1967 was a particularly good year as it happens to be the year in which I was born.

You mentioned "The rest of us tend to take a lot of this stuff for granted", and that is the real issue I am trying to address on a daily basis. Believe me when I tell you that a high percentage of the people who ask the question as the OP did (with respect to the OP), still have limited knowledge, even though they did an apprenticeship in the last century. But they will only admit to this during a phone conversation… when they are about to order the wrong thing.

I am trying to change the forum culture to start getting away from just recommending the old traditional books, to include old and new books. Yes this improves sales of new books, but my motives are more educational than profit. It makes the new people understand and order products correctly when they call or place an order over the website, be it from ARC or anyone else, and in turn makes the hobby experience better for all concerned.

I think I said enough about what I wanted to put across. Having read another thread on Tormach CNC, I wanted to avoid coming across over pushy wanting to sell the beginners titles, as this is really not the case. I also believe that the Tormach CNC book thread was trying to be helpful for anyone considering CNC, but each person forms their own opinion.

Sadly I have found that some new people find it difficult to respect comments made by vendors like me, viewing such comments as just another comment made by a box shifter, especially as they don't know me, and some of them know better from YouTube.

Again, no offence intended to anyone who mentioned YouTube channels earlier. There are good and bad channels. Good channels improve knowledge. It is the bad ones which create problems when the viewer starts respecting and following the wrong ideas being presented by a person who doesn't really know what they are talking about, making a presentation without understanding, for others to follow. Reading some of the subscribers comments is like read comments made by the blind following and worshiping the blind.

Take care care Pete.

Ketan at ARC.

Edited By Ketan Swali on 19/06/2022 12:52:53

[egaParticipant @ega]

A delightful little old-school book is Len Mason's "Using the Small Lathe, from about £8 on eBay but my copy, new, was £1.25!

[john fletcher 1Participant @johnfletcher1]

Having read quite a lot engineering books and having a shelf full, mostly second hand from charity shops, I would still recommend Neil's Wyatt's (editor) book, the excellent picture are self explanatory. The book maybe about modern lathes but the principles are just the same, old or new. John

[GreensandsParticipant @greensands]

If it is just the one book then it has to the Sparey. It will tell you all you need to know.

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Ketan, no offence taken mate. It's all good.

I was 10 years old in 1967 and the old man had me using the Drummond to make wooden bowls and fireplace pokers as Christmas gifts for mum and the grandparents. No belt guards no safety switches other than the wall outlet no nothing. Haha. Would be called child abuse today.

 

Pete

Edited By Hopper on 19/06/2022 22:57:46

[duncan webster 1Participant @duncanwebster1]

You need to be careful with utube, some of it is good, some of it is frankly rubbish. Lots of it takes 30 minutes to tell you what you could read in a book in 5 minutes, and of course you can take the book into the workshop

[SteviegtrParticipant @steviegtr]

Yes read books. Yes watch youtube etc. But put a piece of soft material in the chuck & take gentle cuts.

By all means before this, look at videos of operations of a lathe. But with a little & gentle trial & error you will find out how easy it is to turn a piece of metal.

It is a great hobby to delve into & as long as you take care with the safety side of things, you will get a feeling of satisfaction from your efforts.

I would recommend you look up things like using a lathe on youtube. You will soon see what you need to do without buying books from folk hoping to sell a product.

This in no way is knocking any of the editors on this site. I am sure their books are great. Never read any, so do not know. Just take it easy & you will reap the benefits from it.

If you want to see some good youtube video's then look up Jason B. He has some great vids on turning metal.

Just don't look up my steviegtr channel as it gets a mediocre response from this forum.

Regards.

Steve.

[DMBParticipant @dmb]

There is some good stuff on tube, e.g., Joe Pieczinsnsky. However, at least one channel repeatedly shows videos of the author using his hands as brake pads to stop both lathe and drilling machine chucks from turning after switching off. Potential for serious injuries.

Just be careful with copying what you see or are told.

[Author]

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