Attached Cables

[VicParticipant @vic]

Anyone else on here get a bit fed up with attached cables? I find it often makes some items more difficult to move around than necessary and also takes up storage space. Over the years I collected quite a number of cables with moulded mains and IEC plugs. As a result I sometimes remove attached cables and fit an IEC socket. This was one of the first things I did for my new grinder.

 

[MikeKParticipant @mikek40713]

Great idea.  I hate having to wrap the cord around the tool.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

Must be a personal thing, any items that I have with a plug in lead tend to have the lead plugged in when I get them and then I never unplug it again so might as well be attached. I’ve enough sockets in the workshop so any tooling like that can stay plugged into the wall socket too.

Maybe it is due to using power tools for a living. having to plug in leads costs time, same with packing tools away in fancy stacking “system” boxes and having to get them all out when you want to use them.

[Bo’sunParticipant @bosun58570]

Yes, indeed a great idea.  One of my pet hates on new appliances, is when the cables are bound-up with a twist tie, only to become a coiled spring once released.  A single cable that can be straightened, and stored without constraint, has to be a winner.  I’m assuming these IEC plugs and sockets can be obtained with different ratings depending on the application?

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

I like IEC sockets and often retrofit thaem to corded devices. If there is no room you can use an inline male on a short flylead.

However there is one serious shortfall with the specific example pictured. It is a grinder and the IEC inlet is facing upwards.
This means that dust and swarf can collect in the bottom of the inlet. This will eventually short out the pins and cause a big flash and bang.
Any IEC inlet should be level or ideally in a workshop with the opening facing down.

Robert.

[Bo’sun]

On Bo’sun Said:

Yes, indeed a great idea.  One of my pet hates on new appliances, is when the cables are bound-up with a twist tie, only to become a coiled spring once released.  A single cable that can be straightened, and stored without constraint, has to be a winner.  I’m assuming these IEC plugs and sockets can be obtained with different ratings depending on the application?

As far as I know they are 10A.

[Robert Atkinson 2]

On Robert Atkinson 2 Said:

 

However there is one serious shortfall with the specific example pictured. It is a grinder and the IEC inlet is facing upwards.
This means that dust and swarf can collect in the bottom of the inlet. This will eventually short out the pins and cause a big flash and bang.
Any IEC inlet should be level or ideally in a workshop with the opening facing down.

Robert.

Highly unlikely I believe, I think you’re being over pessimistic. If you look a bit more closely you might also notice the direction of rotation. I’ll also be using guards and extraction as I don’t want to be breathing in any particles.

[MikeKParticipant @mikek40713]

I wish we could buy nice supple silicone-sheathed cords in bulk at a good price.

[egaParticipant @ega]

Vic:

That’s a very neat little grinder. I like to “improve” things, too, and some years ago fitted my Tormek wet grinder with a detachable lead connected via a waterproof plug and socket:

All my *portable* corded power tools are equipped either with a short lead/connector or have a plug in cord as standard equipment. As an amateur with limited workshop space I am resigned to getting tools out of storage to use them and the boxes have the additional advantage of providing a home for accessories.

[peak4Participant @peak4]

Yes, I’ve done similar with several tools and appliances.
I found it easier when working under the Landrover or similar, just to have one mains lead and swap it between tools.
My strong caution; beware with any hand tools which have a locking power on switch, such as some older small angle grinders etc.
It’s a bit dangerous when you plug it in and it flies out of your hand as it was left turned on.
Similarly I’d be a bit careful with that double ended bench grinder if you move it about.
Works well with gizmos which feature an NVR relay though.

Bill

[ega]

On ega Said:

Vic:

That’s a very neat little grinder. I like to “improve” things, too, and some years ago fitted my Tormek wet grinder with a detachable lead connected via a waterproof plug and socket:

All my *portable* corded power tools are equipped either with a short lead/connector or have a plug in cord as standard equipment. As an amateur with limited workshop space I am resigned to getting tools out of storage to use them and the boxes have the additional advantage of providing a home for accessories.

On MikeK Said:

I wish we could buy nice supple silicone-sheathed cords in bulk at a good price.

I’d happily pay a little extra for the convenience.  Especially for relatively lightweight tools where the permanent set in the lead can be a nuisance.

[Vic]

On Vic Said:

On Robert Atkinson 2 Said:

 

However there is one serious shortfall with the specific example pictured. It is a grinder and the IEC inlet is facing upwards.
This means that dust and swarf can collect in the bottom of the inlet. This will eventually short out the pins and cause a big flash and bang.
Any IEC inlet should be level or ideally in a workshop with the opening facing down.

Robert.

Highly unlikely I believe, I think you’re being over pessimistic. If you look a bit more closely you might also notice the direction of rotation. I’ll also be using guards and extraction as I don’t want to be breathing in any particles.

Why defend an arrangement that’s clearly inferior Vic?

Robert points out that the position of the socket means it will collect dirt.   He’s not making the issue up!  The need to stop dirt collecting in electric systems was recognised in the 19th century.

Evidence and experience both support Robert’s warning.  Dare I suggest that it’s unwise for an individual in 2024 to believe this well-known problem is ‘highly unlikely’  and to think Robert’s warning is  ‘over pessimistic’.

Use of the word ‘believe’ should set alarm bells ringing.   Beliefs are often based on ignorance, whilst engineering is based on knowledge.

Socketing tools is a good idea, but before retrofitting a socket consider its position might matter and identify other needs such as ingress protection.   There might also be safety concerns: for example what happens if plugging in powers the motor up?   In Vic’s grinder, he could be leaning over the machine, perhaps holding it with one hand, whilst fumbling with round the back with the other.   Does the convenience justify the risk?  Discuss…

Dave

 

[VicParticipant @vic]

Dave,

Simply because it’s not inferior to me, it’s much better. I suggest you look at the picture again and perhaps examine an IEC plug and socket a bit more closely. I’ve now got a number of items with these sockets now and none of them have collected dust, why would they?  If you want to try it yourself come back in a few years time and prove me wrong, if you can.

I’ve got several pieces of equipment that can be turned on before being plugged in but I’ve never even thought to do that, so I’m wondering why you mention it? Have you had an accident doing that?

Another advantage is cable length. I started this post because I’ve just recently fitted an inline IEC socket to a fan I bought. It came with a 1 metre cable which meant I had to keep using an extension with it, very inconvenient. It currently has a 3 metre cable plugged into it. Unlike Jason that has all his electrical equipment plugged in and set up all the time, this is a seasonal piece of equipment and will being going back up into the loft at some point and is much easier to move and store without an attached cable.

[ega]

On ega Said:

Vic:

That’s a very neat little grinder. I like to “improve” things, too, and some years ago fitted my Tormek wet grinder with a detachable lead connected via a waterproof plug and socket:

All my *portable* corded power tools are equipped either with a short lead/connector or have a plug in cord as standard equipment. As an amateur with limited workshop space I am resigned to getting tools out of storage to use them and the boxes have the additional advantage of providing a home for accessories.

Agreed. I have limited bench space so stuff often has to go underneath or in cupboards or on shelves when not being used. Attached cables are an increased burden. The grinder pictured is really quite tiny and only just big enough for a socket to be fitted.

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Vic,

It seems that we will not change your opinion.

However the inlet pictured is clearly installed with the opening angled up. IEC inlets do not have shrouded pins. One piece of swarf in there can cause a short circuit. The very fact you have installed an inlet tells us it is likely to be stored without a lead installed and that is when contamination can enter.

You may do whatever you like in your private workshop. But when I see someone making a suggestion to others that has a clear safety implication I have a professional obligation to comment on it so others who may see it can make an informed decision about adopting it.

I’m not perfect, I do things in my private workshop that would not be considered acceptable in a workplace for instance. But I do not publicise them or suggest others copy me.

You have a machine shop, make up a wedge shaped block to make the inlet level or tilted down slightly.  This will also stop the cable being pushed up towards the unguarded wheels.

Robert.

[Maurice TaylorParticipant @mauricetaylor82093]

Hi Vic ,

I would cut the tool cable to 6in length and fit a male iec plug to it.Job done.

Everybody with perfect workshops,please  say if is no good,but explain why.

Maurice.

[egaParticipant @ega]

Robert:

Intrigued by your “professional obligation”.

Isn’t the rule “Thou shalt not kill but need’st not strive … to keep alive”?

I’ve left out the “officiously” as I continue to value your obviously well informed comments

[Robert Atkinson 2]

On Robert Atkinson 2 Said:

Vic,

It seems that we will not change your opinion.

However the inlet pictured is clearly installed with the opening angled up. IEC inlets do not have shrouded pins. One piece of swarf in there can cause a short circuit. The very fact you have installed an inlet tells us it is likely to be stored without a lead installed and that is when contamination can enter.

You may do whatever you like in your private workshop. But when I see someone making a suggestion to others that has a clear safety implication I have a professional obligation to comment on it so others who may see it can make an informed decision about adopting it.

I’m not perfect, I do things in my private workshop that would not be considered acceptable in a workplace for instance. But I do not publicise them or suggest others copy me.

You have a machine shop, make up a wedge shaped block to make the inlet level or tilted down slightly.  This will also stop the cable being pushed up towards the unguarded wheels.

Robert.

I don’t think it’s we, but rather you Robert. And no, you won’t change my mind. The outlet is nearer horizontal (as you appear to accept?) than vertical and the plug is a very tight fit in the socket. Not impossible, but very unlikely to get any debris of consequence in there. The grinder is a work in process, I already mentioned the grinder will be used with guards so no need for the additional puerile comments.

 

[Maurice Taylor]

On Maurice Taylor Said:

Hi Vic ,

I would cut the tool cable to 6in length and fit a male iec plug to it.Job done.

Everybody with perfect workshops,please  say if is no good,but explain why.

Maurice.

A reasonable suggestion Maurice, and I have done this as well in the past. Sadly, probably still not good enough for Robert I expect.

This is the smallest of my grinding solutions and will only be used for precision grinding. I don’t expect it will produce a lot of metal dust at any one time before it’s put away again. What is likely to be produced will be on the opposite side of the machine to the socket and hopefully extracted by my shop vac.

[Michael GilliganParticipant @michaelgilligan61133]

Look on the bright-side, Vic … at least no-one can reasonably complain about Kettle-Connectors in a Tea Room topic !

🙂

MichaelG.

[ega]

On ega Said:

Robert:

Intrigued by your “professional obligation”.

Isn’t the rule “Thou shalt not kill but need’st not strive … to keep alive”?

I’ve left out the “officiously” as I continue to value your obviously well informed comments

Hi,
I’m a Chartered Engineer (and Fellow of the Royal Aeronautical Society),

“Engineering professionals have a duty to obey all applicable laws and regulations and give due weight to facts, published standards and guidance and the wider public interest. They should: hold paramount the health and safety of others and draw attention to hazards. ensure their work is lawful and justified.” (my bold).
https://www.engc.org.uk/ethics

I’m not policing anything just allowing others to make an informed decision.

[Vic]

On Vic Said:

On Maurice Taylor Said:

Hi Vic ,

I would cut the tool cable to 6in length and fit a male iec plug to it.Job done.

Everybody with perfect workshops,please  say if is no good,but explain why.

Maurice.

A reasonable suggestion Maurice, and I have done this as well in the past. Sadly, probably still not good enough for Robert I expect.

This is the smallest of my grinding solutions and will only be used for precision grinding. I don’t expect it will produce a lot of metal dust at any one time before it’s put away again. What is likely to be produced will be on the opposite side of the machine to the socket and hopefully extracted by my shop vac.

Yor expections are wrong Vic. In my first reponse I said:

“I like IEC sockets and often retrofit them to corded devices. If there is no room you can use an inline male on a short flylead.”

That would be my preferred solution for this application.

Robert.

[Mark RandParticipant @markrand96270]

I’ll see your IEC60320 connectors and raise you Lewden  PD717223 connectors, similar to this, but the 10A version:-

 

That’s what I’ve just worked out I need for the coolant and hydraulic pumps on the surface grinder. It did have an older iteration for the pumps, but the plug was removed and the wiring was made fixed before I got it and that version is lo longer available. A blooming nuisance if you feel the need to move the tank out of the way to do some work around the back of the machine. Far too big for Vic’s project, but far smaller than the smallest 3 phase commando plug/socket combination. IP66, in case anyone’s worried about swarf/dust/coolant falling in. 😀

[egaParticipant @ega]

Robert:

Thank you – good to know.

[Michael Gilligan]

On Michael Gilligan Said:

Look on the bright-side, Vic … at least no-one can reasonably complain about Kettle-Connectors in a Tea Room topic !

🙂

MichaelG.

Yes quite right! You can take health and safety to extremes, as in Robert’s case.

[Author]

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