Anyone recommend any machines

[Shaun CoopeParticipant @shauncoope29567]

Hi all,

having waning a lathe and milling machine in the garage for a number of years but not having the space, I have now extended the garage to give me the opportunity.

could anyone recommend any machines for general hobby use, I have several motorcycles which would benefit from a few new parts so will be looking to machine parts for this purpose.

The machines would have to run on single phase.

workshop area is around 12 feet by 9 feet.

Thanks in advance.

[Shaun CoopeParticipant @shauncoope29567]

Lathe and milling machine

[Thor 🇳🇴Participant @thor]

Hi Shaun,

Welcome to the forum. Determine what is the largest size of workpiece you will be turning, a large lathe can be used to turn small items. I have a Chinese 290 lathe with a 38mm spindle bore, very useful.Buy from a reputable dealer so you can get spare parts etc.
This is a subject that has been discussed before, a few links:

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Thor

[Shaun CoopeParticipant @shauncoope29567]

Thanks for the reply Thor, very useful information.

I’m looking at Chester and Warco machine tools at the minute….I’d love a second hand Bridgeport mill, luckily I’ve got the room so may look down that route.

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

Welcome Shaun!

You will get lots of help and advice on here, BUT

You ask, "How long is a piece of string"?

The machines that you choose will be determined by a variety of factors.

The size of your budget (AND you need to include accessories such as Faceplate, 4 jaw chuck, Milling vice, cutters, etc both for machines, for tooling such as Drills, Taps and Dies, bench Grinder etc and for measuring equipment. ). No point in having a precision machine tool if you can't measure what you've made. Without measurements, how ill you know if it the required size

If you are a newbie, you should include buying books, as well, to gain knowledge before spending money.

The space that you can devote to the machines (and around them for loading and unloading, and maintenance. )

What you want to make on them.

The answers to these questions will narrow the search.

A small budget may mean that you are restricted to small , and used machines.

If this is the case, you need to learn about the machine, and take someone to examine it.

A shiny used machine may be superficially good, but more worn than a n "As used" machine that has been carefully used and maintained. An expensive highly painted boat anchor is useless compared to a good but slightly dirty machine.

I would suggest that you start by buying some books.

You are unlikely to become a star machinist in a few weeks. It took several years to produce a skilled turner.

Having studied the books, you may have a clearer idea of what you want.

A set of Zeus charts. Very useful, contains a lot of useful data. Still using mine, bought in 1958!

There are several books on lathes.

L H Sparey "The Amateurs Lathe" Useful but tends towards the Myford 7 Series in detail

Ian Bradley "The Amateurs Workshop" Deals with workshop work and includes a few details missed by Sparey.

Harold Hall, Dave Fenner, and Nil Wyatt hace all written books on lathework in general, and in some cases specifically for the mini lathe. Some of these are published in the Workshop Practice Series, others by Crowood Press.

Similarly, from the same sources there are books on Milling.

Read and consider, you will have gained some knowledge before you look to buy.

You need to decide what features seem essential in your machines.

Do not launch into making models straight away. You need to learn how to use the machines before embarking on what may be an expensive and long lasting project.

Better to make a mistake on a bit of steel with no particular purpose than an on expensive casting.

Making simple devices, will give experience, knowledge and confidence, and provide you with simple tools which will be useful for a long time to come..

HTH

Howard

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

With regard to UK suppliers, Arc Euro or Axminster, Amadeal, and SPG may also have machine which would do what you want.

After sales service is an important item to consider, in case there is a problem, or you need spares or extra accessories.

If there is a Model Engineering Club within a reasonable distance, join it. You will be among kindred spirits and will learn a lot from other members.

If you say where youare, others may be able to suggest clubs to visit.

Howard.

[Steve355Participant @steve355]

What age are your motorcycles? Are they metric or imperial? What threads do they use etc.? I’d have thought that would be the main consideration in the beginning. You’ll have a miserable time with an old imperial machine trying to make parts for a metric bike and vice versa.

Be aware that if you buy older machines you’ll spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them. Which is fun and interesting, but may not be the core mission.

Steve

[HopperParticipant @hopper]

Unless you buy an older machine in good condition, in which case it will give you many years of trouble free service.

[Anonymous]

Posted by Steve355 on 13/04/2022 12:16:05:

…buy older machines you’ll spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them…

That's odd; there seem to be a fair number of threads on the forum about fixing problems with newish machines?

Apart from the CNC mill all my machine tools are old and secondhand. To be sure I've had some issues. But they've been consumable items, like broken belts, or electrical, mostly to do with chattering contactors. I've had no mechanical issues, other than due to operator stupidity.

The CNC mill has had it's own issues, all electrical such as dry joints and poor quality connectors.

Andrew

[Nigel McBurney 1Participant @nigelmcburney1]

having restored some English motor cycles and lots of stationary engines,I would advise a Brigdgeport and a 6 or 6.5 inch centre height Colchester,good capacity is really essential,as Andrew states one rarely needs spares for old uk machines, and lI read of lots of queries on spares /repairs on relatively new modern machines,particularly electrical/electronic problems ,plastic gears etc. My l/rover Discovery Three sensors replaced in the last year,which cost nearly £1k .is another example of poor quality electronics.

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Posted by Steve355 on 13/04/2022 12:16:05:

What age are your motorcycles? Are they metric or imperial? What threads do they use etc.? I’d have thought that would be the main consideration in the beginning. You’ll have a miserable time with an old imperial machine trying to make parts for a metric bike and vice versa.

Be aware that if you buy older machines you’ll spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them. Which is fun and interesting, but may not be the core mission.

Steve

I just wonder whether you have actually bought an older machine? I wonder (I now know you did) whether you purchased carefully, being able to recognise the faults you were buying.🙂 A home-built machine may have been produced by a good machinist or one of much lesser capability.

Virtually all my machines are old. But they will work perfectly well whether using metric or imperial units.

You may need to spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them. Depends on what you buy, I suppose.

I consider size a far more important metric to consider – not which threads they will or will not cut. My lathe is imperial but will easily cut metric threads from 0.5mm to 5mm pitch. I expect that range will suffice for most motorcycle parts?

Converting from imperial measurements to metric (and vice versa) does not involve being miserable at all, IMO – if one is able to use a simple calculator! Additionally, DROs can simplify this for those that either cannot, or don’t want to, make the conversions off the machine.

I just looked at your first posting on the forum, less than 7 months ago. I can fully understand how/why you might have posted the above. But I don’t agree with it.

[Steve355Participant @steve355]

Posted by not done it yet on 13/04/2022 14:04:02:

Posted by Steve355 on 13/04/2022 12:16:05:

What age are your motorcycles? Are they metric or imperial? What threads do they use etc.? I’d have thought that would be the main consideration in the beginning. You’ll have a miserable time with an old imperial machine trying to make parts for a metric bike and vice versa.

Be aware that if you buy older machines you’ll spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them. Which is fun and interesting, but may not be the core mission.

Steve

I just wonder whether you have actually bought an older machine? I wonder (I now know you did) whether you purchased carefully, being able to recognise the faults you were buying.🙂 A home-built machine may have been produced by a good machinist or one of much lesser capability.

Virtually all my machines are old. But they will work perfectly well whether using metric or imperial units.

You may need to spend a lot of time fixing and maintaining them. Depends on what you buy, I suppose.

I consider size a far more important metric to consider – not which threads they will or will not cut. My lathe is imperial but will easily cut metric threads from 0.5mm to 5mm pitch. I expect that range will suffice for most motorcycle parts?

Converting from imperial measurements to metric (and vice versa) does not involve being miserable at all, IMO – if one is able to use a simple calculator! Additionally, DROs can simplify this for those that either cannot, or don’t want to, make the conversions off the machine.

I just looked at your first posting on the forum, less than 7 months ago. I can fully understand how/why you might have posted the above. But I don’t agree with it.

Fair enough, I’m probably wrong, and I’m new to this game. But it’s not just screw cutting, it’s drill bits, reamers, DTIs, micrometers, milling cutters, taps and dies, collets… the list goes on…. And across the last year or so I’ve had to accumulate them all, I went imperial, and if I wanted to suddenly go metric it would be a considerable expense.

IMHO if one was working on vintage motorcycles which were entirely imperial, and every single time a measurement was used in the shop it had to be converted, for me it would be a right pain. Or vice versa with metric.

I didn’t know what I was doing when I bought my first machines, but I was doing it for fun, so sorting them out was expected and has been a very enjoyable challenge, although I really didn’t anticipate how much time and effort (and cost) it would take.

It’s also true that buying modern doesn’t mean no problems, I bought a modern bandsaw recently and immediately regretted it due to the flimsy build quality. It hasn’t broken yet but it won’t be long. Should have bought vintage!

[Howard LewisParticipant @howardlewis46836]

No matter what machine you buy, you will need measuring equipment, and certainly for a 4 jaw chuck, to centre work more accurately than a 3 jaw, or to deliberately set work off centre.

If you buy a modern machine, it will have a lot of electronics, which MIGHT go wrong (less tolerant of abuse, cut price components etc )

An older machine may give you problems due to wear, abuse or missing accessories / gears, all of which may be a problem to correct.

The simpler the machine, the less there is to go wrong, but the greater need for operator skill.

A Training lathe is simple but lacking features of more complicated machines; needs more skill to get the best from it. But having less to go wrong, should be more reliable, but possibly less versatile

Being biased, for a versatile lathe, I could suggest a Warco BH600G, a Chester Craftsman, or an Engineers ToolRoom BL12 -24. They are all examples of the generic Taiwanese lathe which appears under a number of brand names.

They are basically the same machine, although not often found secondhand (Possibly says something about their abilities and appreciation ) With a Quick Change gearbox, and a 120 / 127T Idler, cutting Metric or Imperial threads is easier, if suitable Taps and Dies are unavailable.. They are larger than many model engineer lathes, which may make them less numerous on the secondhand market. With a big bore Headstock, they can swing 12" over the bed, 18" in the removable gap, and take 24" between centres, and have power cross feed which you may find an advantage.. Warco did offer a long bed version, the BH900.

They were belt driven and superceded by gear driven versions.

There is a wide range of machines out there, (Some differing only in colour scheme or ,package composition )

Ex industry machines will have been driven hard, to earn their keep. Having done less work and being less worn,ex school or college machines may have superficial damage from careless use.

Do a lot of research before buying. If possible, take someone knowledgeable with you to view a possible machine.

It may cost more to buy to buy from a reputable dealer, but if there is a problem, you do have some come back and possible support.

Howard

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