Adjustable Angle Plate or Tilting Vice

[BOB BLACKSHAW 1Participant @bobblackshaw1]

What is the best option a tilting vice,or a adjustable angle plate. The tilting vices at around £60 don’t look that good, but the same money will buy a 6 inch angle plate. I already have a spare small machine vice, but I don’t know what to go for. The adjustable angle plate are they any good at around £100, or do you have to dismantle them to get them right. Thanks for any replies Bob.

[BOB BLACKSHAW 1Participant @bobblackshaw1]

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

I think the adj angle plate is a bit more useful as you are not limited to the capacity of the vice so can mount angle plates and castings straight onto the plate. They can eat into your z-axis height so watch out if you have a small machine. The adj work table from ARC may be another option, worked OK out the box for me.

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

I've got, or have had, all varieties and would agree with Jason that the adjustable work table is most likely to be satisfactory for a wide range of work. Often slowest to set up and, out of the box, tilt angle is frequently limited to 45° or less. If I had one like that in Jasons picture as my one and only and had regularly used angles I'd seriously consider making a new support arm with plain drilled holes suitably positioned to get the angle instantly. Unless fitted for a gauge block stack, sine bar style, getting an angle dead nuts can be a pain. Pretty darn close with a protractor is easy tho'.

Bearing in mind that my mill is a Bridgeport and work is frequently 12" to the ft scale, so my rigidity requirements are perhaps somewhat more exacting than those of folk with smaller machines my personal assessment is :-

1) Inexpensive type angle vice with two pivoting side plates. OK as a drilling vice but may well be iffy as a milling vice unless only using very light cuts. Time was that the machining, manufacture and alignment standards were poor. Fair few articles written on how to measure and correct errors. One of the import products that cemented the early reputation of "kit of parts supplied assembled to save printing instructions". Consensus seems to be that once reworked you had a very decent device for a very modest outlay. I wouldn't know, mine hit the scrap bin so hard that it nearly bounced out! I'd hope that, in line with much of the other imported equipment, quality standards have risen since so that they can be used out of the box. However the precision needed to be really good is deceptive and I suspect the market won't accept a commensurate price.

2) Inexpensive angle vice with part circle pivot runners each side and locking screw one side to hold the setting. Drilling only. Which was what mine was got for. Seriously chancing your arm if you expect it to stay in place when milling. Mine came from Northern Tools (remember them) at a very attractive price and is quite accurate with negligible twist between vice jaws and pivot axis. Better than I expected actually. Still comes out for appropriate jobs.

3) Proper pivoting vice with part circle recesses in base and matching runners in under the vice body with two bolts to hold the setting. Mine is a 6" Abwood on a rotating base. Very heavy, crane onto table, and rock solid. Needs a screw jack underneath to adjust it. Lord knows what it cost new. Can't see that quality at import prices but the design is inherently solid. Be advisable to check the alignment of the vice jaws and pivot axes to quantify any variation with movement. Unlikely to be anything that can't be worked around or fettled out.

4) Adjustable angle plate. Mine is a British made one of the style having a more or less semi-circular base with the plate running round it. For my money the most solid type of angle adjustable work support likely to be a accurate at a modest price. Often advisable to bolt a handle on to the plate to help with adjustment.

5) Adjustable work table. Best ratio of carrying capacity to weight. Not something to be overlooked when lifting onto the machine. Simple design means its easily made to decent accuracy at modest price. Not as inherently stiff as no 4 but up for all rational cuts. Major disadvantage is that its not a complete solution out of the box. Need other devices, like Jasons angle plate, to do the actual holding. But you should have such things anyway and, even if you need to get them, they will find plenty of other uses. Although vices are convenient they can be dreadfully limiting. Mine is a double one that tilts in both directions with fittings for gauge block stacks. When you need it there is no substitute but jobs really needing it are best avoided unless well paying.

Clive.

[Anonymous]

Personally I wouldn't bother with tilting vices or tables with slide bar adjustment, or a bolt through the pivot point. Knowing my luck they'd "adjust" during a cut. Like Clive I prefer the type that revolves, and clamps, to part of a cylinder. They have plenty of bearing area between table and base and are unlikely to shift inadvertently. This is mine:

It's big, heavy and ugly but it works, and it was cheap on Ebay.

Andrew

[not done it yetParticipant @notdoneityet]

Not something you would risk buying from banggood, Clive? Or worth it after a rebuild out of the box?

[STK2008Participant @stk2008]

I used to use the same as Andrew at my old work place.
Used it to fix engine blocks on that had an odd ball v configuration be for reboreing them. Sturdy as hell these things are.

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

You can always stuff a few gauge blocks under the table if you think the slide bar may move

Edited By JasonB on 26/04/2018 20:42:17

[Anonymous]

Posted by JasonB on 26/04/2018 20:42:02:

You can always stuff a few gauge blocks under the table……..

I've got more respect for my tools………….

Andrew

[MuzzerParticipant @muzzer]

Posted by not done it yet on 23/04/2018 19:12:12:

Not something you would risk buying from banggood, Clive? Or worth it after a rebuild out of the box?

You'd get absolutely slaughtered on shipping costs, even if it is a talentless / worthless lump of iron. This kind of heavy stuff needs to be bought more locally, even if it is actually made in China. ebay perhaps but not Banggood or Aliexpress.

Murray

[brickyParticipant @bricky]

I was given a small bench drill which was not of much use to me.I cut off the column after removing the base which left me with the small circular plate which is attached to the base of the column with three holes which I use to secure it to the mill table ,the adjustable tilting table of the drill now forms a useful tool on which I clamp stock to be milled.The spindle I will when time permits make into a topslide drill and grinding spindle and I have the motor.

Frank

[steamdaveParticipant @steamdave]

I made a simple tilting plate that can be held in the vice or located in the tee slots of the mill table. I don't use a tilting table very often and this seems to fit my requirements.

The Myford vice gives an idea of size

I use a machinist's jack and an electronic angle gauge to set the angle. Close enough for the girls we go out with.

Dave
The Emerald Isle

[BOB BLACKSHAW 1Participant @bobblackshaw1]

Thanks for these replies, just back from holiday so have just read these posts. Bricky idea of the redundant pillar drill is of interest as I have one under the bench in bits, I shall check it out tomorrow. Also Steamdaves plate looks good, seems simple to make, quite like this as well.

Bob.

[Clive FosterParticipant @clivefoster55965]

Posted by Muzzer on 26/04/2018 21:28:27

You'd get absolutely slaughtered on shipping costs, even if it is a talentless / worthless lump of iron. This kind of heavy stuff needs to be bought more locally, even if it is actually made in China. ebay perhaps but not Banggood or Aliexpress.

Murray

Indeed so!

At about £20.00 from the likes of Machine Mart **LINK** nothing to gain from trying direct import.

When judging the price performance ratio of this sort of very affordable equipment its a good idea to take a close look at how hard it would be to make a precise and accurate version on production line. In particular consider the number of accurate set-ups that will be needed and compare that with how easily a rough'n ready version can be made. With these vices its pretty obvious that you need too many accurate set-ups to produce a high quality one. Better off starting with a different design. But basic drilling machine standards and a "couple of quick licks" with milling cutters will suffice to produce a somewhat functional device. Any markedly superior design needs proper machining set-ups making it too costly for the bottom end of the market. So the manufacturer makes a better job of it and charges more.

My version of the Machine Mart one had every thread save the vice screw drunken, every pivot a bit out of line and excess slack in all joints. Any attempt to use it needed careful set-up specific to the device being worked on. Not something I was prepared to tolerate.

But when it comes to re-working about the only difficult bit is ensuring the fixed jaw is exactly parallel to the pivot and perpendicular to the face on which the moving jaw slides. Metal loaded filler may be needed behind the fixed jaw plate when sorting that. Not a bodge, more an unorthodox repair. Everything else can be sorted with simple machining set-ups given a bit of care, patience and thought.

Came in the "life is too short" category for me but for many folk a weekends worth of work to get performance effectively equal to something they could never realistically afford is an excellent bargain. Moi! I paid £80 for the big Abwood and nearly put my back out lifting it into the car!

Clive.

Edited By Clive Foster on 29/04/2018 18:42:15

Edited By Clive Foster on 29/04/2018 18:43:11

[JasonBModerator @jasonb]

For a small tilting vice like that you may as well just buy a 50mm precision one and hold it in your bigger machine vice.

The other option for an angled surface is just to bolt two angle plates back to back in a Z shape and you can position the upper one to whatever angle is needed.

Or just hold a single angle plate in the vice.

[BOB BLACKSHAW 1Participant @bobblackshaw1]

Looking at the replies I have come to the conclusion that I don't need to buy a tilting vice or an adjustable angle plate. A extra angle plate and precision vice will do for me, also leaving my machine vice as it is on the milling table will save me time resetting it up. A bit of lateral thinking for me is what is needed, again thanks.

Bob.

[Neil LickfoldParticipant @neillickfold44316]

Interesting. I was going to by the adjustable angle plate. But so far have not had a need for one. I do have an adjustable tiling vice, but that was before I bought a mill, and use it just on the drill press. That is where I still thing it is best suited. So tonight I had a job where i need the holes to be very parallel to the front face, but the side ways position was not so important. I used a vice in a vice, so that I could run the quill up the side of the fixed jaw with a work piece in the second vice and torqued up. When I was happy with the alignment then set to and did a test piece.I then measured the test piece and was very happy. My setup was not as easy to accurately set as a sine vice, but is reasonably compact. With mill drills, the lower the column the more rigid the set up. And ultimately a more happier modeller as well.

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