A Real Dake

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Dockstader did a simulation of a Dake.

I will try and find that and see if I can load it here.

I tried to salvage Dockstader's programs, but they were written in a rather obscure programming language, and are extremely convoluted.

You can still find Dockstader's exe (executable) files out there on the net.

I will look for them.

 

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Edited By PatJ on 28/12/2022 12:39:01

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Here are Dockstader's programs.

The Dake simulation is listed under file "10 I".

I will download the file and see if I can get it to run.

https://www.billp.org/Dockstader/ValveGear.html

 

 

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Edited By PatJ on 28/12/2022 12:40:43

[Bantam BillParticipant @bantambill]

Looks like a forerunner of the Wankel engine.

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Posted by Bantam Bill on 28/12/2022 12:44:20:

Looks like a forerunner of the Wankel engine.

Yes, I can see that.

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[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

I found the Dake.exe file, and was able to download and run it.

There is what looks like a little blue tree on the toolbar, which is "Turn on Steam Display and Sound".

There is an initial error message when you start the file, but just close that dialog box and run the program.

If you want me to email you the Dake.exe file, send an email to me at pjorgensenpe@bellsouth.net

I don't know how to load a video of it here.

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[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

The Dockstader Dake program also has a speed control slider, and you can see what is happening better if you slow the engine way down.

And note that Dockstader's default setting on the program has the steam entering the outer ring, and the exhaust in the inner circle.

If the engine is reversed, then the exhaust is in the outer circle, and the steam is in the center circle.

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[Ches Green UKParticipant @chesgreenuk]

Pat,

I got the line drawing video downloaded and running….off to have a play with the program settings.

Thanks,

Ches

Edit: The Pan Horiz, Vert and Zoom sliders can bring a larger image in to the centre of the page. Adjusting the Step Angle slider can slow the engine down so one can follow what is happening. I wish there was a Stop button….is there?

Edited By Ches Green UK on 28/12/2022 13:24:25

Edited By Ches Green UK on 28/12/2022 13:25:36

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

You can turn on the steam display and sound, and also use the speed slider to slow or stop the engine.

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

I got a text message from FedEx.

Dake suppose to arrive today.

Fingers crossed.

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[OldironParticipant @oldiron]

Thankyou for that PatJ. Very interesting. Downloaded and ran ok on Win10 Pro

regards

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Sort of makes one wonder how anyone ever conceived of this engine in the first place.

Roots appears to have been sort of a pioneer, if it is the same Roots person that produced the Roots blowers.

This was originally a Roots design, and 20 years later was slightly modified and re-patented by Dake.

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Edited By PatJ on 28/12/2022 15:09:28

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

I had to resort to various colored rubberbands to figure out the passages on the Dake.

The steam/exhaust travel down passages in the crankcase cover from the valve on top the engine.

The center piston has four passages in it, and they don't necessarily go the way you may expect them to go.

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Drawing of center piston.

 

Edited By PatJ on 28/12/2022 15:26:20

[Stewart HartParticipant @stewarthart90345]

This is the one I built a few years ago an article on its build was published in ME Dake Finished Engine – YouTube

And the inner workings Dake Engine 2nd Test – YouTube if any one would like a copy of the plans just drop me a PM

I'm back

Stew

[Robert Atkinson 2Participant @robertatkinson2]

Posted by PatJ on 28/12/2022 10:36:41:

I find this a fascinating engine, and for me to find one on ebay is sort of like finding the Hope diamond laying out in the front yard. I have never seen one of these engines for sale.

The totally enclosed design is a turn-off for some, who like to see the moving internal parts of an old engine.

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How about polycarbonate cover plate and run it on air?

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Posted by Robert Atkinson 2 on 28/12/2022 18:06:55:

Posted by PatJ on 28/12/2022 10:36:41:

I find this a fascinating engine, and for me to find one on ebay is sort of like finding the Hope diamond laying out in the front yard. I have never seen one of these engines for sale.

The totally enclosed design is a turn-off for some, who like to see the moving internal parts of an old engine.

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How about polycarbonate cover plate and run it on air?

Well the crankcase cover contains the steam and exhaust passages, but as long as those were included in the polycarbonate, I guess it would work. It would get dirty very fast I think.

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[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

The Dake has arrived.

I have not opened the box yet.

LOL, it was shipped in a banana box.

Banana boxes are pretty substantial.

I will go down and open it.

No holes in the box, so that is a good sign.

The FedEx guy said "What the flock is in this box, and engine or transmission?".

I said "An engine".

He said "I knew it".

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[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

Here are the Dake pictures, and the banana box that it was shipped in.

Fortunately the engine was disassembled, and very tightly packed with the motherload of paper packing, and multiple layers of cardboard top and bottom.

And I think it was shipped by truck, and did not go through the local superhub, else the box would have been smashed and undoubtedly broken open.

The unit does indeed weight at least 100 lbs.

I am delighted to say that the interior surfaces are in superb condition, are very well oiled, with apparently very superficial wear.

There is the numeral "2" lightly punched on one side of the inner piston, and two dots punched on the other side. Any appreciable wear to the inner piston would have worn off these light punchings.

I have to assume this engine saw occasional use in a hoist application.

The interior surfaces appear to be ground and very flat.

I originally thought this was an older Dake model, but not I am thinking perhaps it is a newer Dake model, give how good of condition it is in.

There is literally no appreciable wear on the insides of the engine.

The engine came partially disassembled, but was very simple and quick to reassemble (took perhaps 5 minutes to reassemble).

This engine is very robustly built, and with its low rpm, and intermitant use, it would last a very long time.

It looks like standard sizes for Dakes were 00, 0, 1, 2, 3, 3.5, 4, 5, 6 and 7, with rated horsepower of 1/2, 3/4, 2, 3, 5, 7, 10, 15, 20 and 30 at 90 psi, speeds respectively 1000, 900, 800, 700, 600, 500, 400, 350, 300 and 250 rpm. Weights respectively were 75, 100, 140, 200, 275, 380, 600, 925, 1550, and 2200 lbs.

The shaft protrudes out about 11 inches, and is 1 3/16" diameter, so it looks like I have a size No.1, 2hp at 90 psi, 120 lbs in total weight.

[Ady1Participant @ady1]

Superb, lucky you.

What a great project

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

According to a Dake brochure I found, the ports on the inner piston vary depending on whether the engine is equipped with a reversing valve or not.

I have noticed in various engravings and photos of Dakes that I have seen that no two sets of port arrangements appear to be exactly the same.

Some surprises that I was not expecting:

1. My engine does not have the removable cover over the crankshaft counterweight.

There is an oblong hole on the inside of the crankcase, and the crankshaft goes in that hole with the crank horiziontal so that it fits through the hole.

2. There are two springs under each shoe that are on either side of the center piston. The springs are rather stiff, and would take up any wear between the shoes and the outer piston.

3. The ends of the inner piston are turned to give rounded edges, and the interior of the bronze shoes are also turned for a close sliding fit over the ends of the center piston. I have to suspect that the inner piston and shoes were precision ground together as a unit.

4. The crankshaft has a bit of counterbalance on it, but does not have a round disk that can be seen on some Dakes.

5. The passages in the inner piston are very generous in size, and you can easily put your index finger through them. They are not round in section, but square with rounded corners in section.

6. There is no sign of the 1/1000 th shims that were supposedly used between the crankcase and crankcase cover.

I have not doubt that this engine will run well, give that it has basically no detectable internal wear on the parts.

I am very pleased with this engine.

I am pretty shocked that it made the journey in a bananna box, but as it turns out, the bananna box was a good choice. I have newfound respect for bananna boxes at this point.

Given the limited wear inside the engine, it is possible that this is an engine built anywhere from 1920 to 1950.

The old engines I have from the 1800's generally show a lot of wear and a lot of deep pitting and corrosion on the outside and sometimes on the inside.

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Edited By PatJ on 29/12/2022 10:50:51

[PatJParticipant @patj87806]

I would guess that the ports in the inner piston on the reversible version of this engine would be symmetrical.

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