3D printers coming of age…?

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3D printers coming of age…?

Home Forums 3D Printers and 3D Printing 3D printers coming of age…?

Viewing 25 posts - 26 through 50 (of 58 total)
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  • #134968
    Springbok
    Participant
      @springbok

      hi john
      looks very interesting will look deeper into this wonder how much consumables are
      bob

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      #134970
      Michael Gilligan
      Participant
        @michaelgilligan61133
        Posted by Springbok on 09/11/2013 06:34:45:

        … wonder how much consumables are …

        .

        Bob,

        Here is a range of consumables.

        MichaelG.

        #134979
        Springbok
        Participant
          @springbok

          MG
          Thank you very deeply, Think I have got my christmas pressy sorted out hopefully will be showing it at the Thornbury BSMEE next year working.on the club stand. if at 70ish I can get my head around the software
          Bob

          #134980
          Michael Gilligan
          Participant
            @michaelgilligan61133
            Posted by Springbok on 09/11/2013 09:48:23:

            Think I have got my christmas pressy sorted out hopefully will be showing it at the Thornbury BSMEE next year working.on the club stand. if at 70ish I can get my head around the software
            Bob

            .

            Good Man !!

            … Go for it.

            MichaelG.

            #134982
            jason udall
            Participant
              @jasonudall57142

              Cube are like Epson as far as “ink” are concerned

              Freerange filament is between ?15 and ?30 per kg..about 200 m..but think what a typical plastic component weighs…saw quoted 1kg =394 chess men 20 mm base

              #134983
              MM57
              Participant
                @mm57
                #134997
                Michael Gilligan
                Participant
                  @michaelgilligan61133
                  Posted by Martin Millener on 09/11/2013 10:21:04:

                  …worth reading

                  .

                  Mmmm … they certainly were.

                  That said, they do seem to be "Consumer" reviews:

                  Have there been any reviews by "Engineers" ?

                  MichaelG.

                  #134998
                  Michael Gilligan
                  Participant
                    @michaelgilligan61133
                    Posted by jason udall on 09/11/2013 10:05:23:
                    Cube are like Epson as far as "ink" are concerned

                    .

                    Good point, Jason

                    … But there is always some eager hacker ready to help.

                    This looks useful.

                    MichaelG.

                    #135003
                    John McNamara
                    Participant
                      @johnmcnamara74883

                      Hi All

                      I think the cost of commercial hobby 3D printers is outrageous 1500 to 2000 pounds? And now they are starting to pack the plastic extrusion in cartridges and chipping them. Just like the inkjet and laser printer mob. What a con. As Michael pointed out there may be a workaround but sooner or later they will start putting encrypted countdown chips in them. Some of the new ones On Xerox colour printers for example are not easy to work around.

                      I am a member of a hacker group. No not internet hackers, a maker group. At meetings typically there are half a dozen 3D printers brought along on the night. all different some Open source Mendals and the like others of the builders own design. Built at a much lower cost than 1.5 to 2K

                      There are hundreds of suppliers of components over on net **LINK**

                      If I was going to build one I would join a local special interest hacker group This link is for the UK **LINK** There are groups all around the world.

                      If there is no local group join a 3D Printer forum, 3D printers are not simple to run, a bit like a lathe, making quality parts requires skill in getting all the parameters right.

                      Regards
                      John

                      Edited By John McNamara on 09/11/2013 13:38:55

                      #135017
                      John Stevenson 1
                      Participant
                        @johnstevenson1

                        I think the reviews posted by Martin are very accurate.

                        #135018
                        Michael Gilligan
                        Participant
                          @michaelgilligan61133
                          Posted by John Stevenson on 09/11/2013 15:32:20:

                          I think the reviews posted by Martin are very accurate.

                          .

                          That's a pity

                          Perhaps Bob should put Santa on hold.

                          Might be worth following this blog for a while.

                          MichaelG.

                          #135029
                          John Stevenson 1
                          Participant
                            @johnstevenson1

                            Meant to add quite a bit more to that post but someone came and I wanted to get my post in as a marker.

                            Recently i have been doing a fair bit of research on these 3D printers. his has involved traveling a fair distance to visit people, mainly engineers who have got these things to see how easy they are to work plus quality.

                            After the first couple of trips it soon became obvious that quality is the deciding factor with these things and from what I have seen this boils down to software..

                            First the reprap type machines, it seems to me that being open sourced no one is in charge and everyone seems to be doing their own thing and they all use a variation of the same 2 or 3 softwares which haven't been updated in ages.

                            One of the most important things with 3D printing complex models is the support mesh that needs to be generated to support the actual model. This is worked out from the model itself and is down to the software to work out what is the best solution. this is where the open source software falls over. Not enough work has been put into his aspect.

                            Recently in MEW there was an article called Another look at Reprap in 204 / 205

                            Take a look at some of the printed parts in issue 205 and this is typical of the quality.

                            Now I had chance to look at one of the UP! Minis actually working and the difference was like night and day.

                            Easy to use, not limited to cartridges, plenty of thought gone in to the mesh problem and it can also self calibrate itself. Parts printed look like moulded parts, not all furry and steps or layers showing.

                            If I was buying one at this moment I'd go for the UP! mini and I'm not associated in any way with them or anyone who sells them.

                            One other thing I need to point out though after all the hype of owning one and what you can do with it.

                            You need a model to work with. Can't stress this enough.

                            OK if you want to print star wars characters or similar that someone has bothered drawing and making available but if you want to print a cylinder for say a pattern you need the drawing.

                            So of far more importance is being able to draw in 3D and save as an STL file.

                            If you can't handle this then really a 3D printer is a toy too far.

                            #135032
                            Michael Gilligan
                            Participant
                              @michaelgilligan61133

                              Nice summary, John

                              You spoke highly of the UP! Mini, previously.

                              … Sounds like it's still the model of choice.

                              MichaelG.

                              #135037
                              John Stevenson 1
                              Participant
                                @johnstevenson1

                                I know of two people personally that have these.

                                One is a guy in St Helens and i have been and seen this actually working.

                                The second person is Art Fenerty the writer of the Mach 3 program. He retired from Mach 3 a couple of years bak and currently is involved with Gearotic Motion / Thought which is a very good gear program.

                                He bought the printer to sort out 3D printing of gears like bevels. I'll get him to send me some pictures and post them here. Art is very impressed with this printer and even went as far as to say he'd not even bother to write his own software given the unique problems that 3D has.

                                Now if Art says this then I take notice as he's one of they guys in the white hat I really respect and have immense amounts of time for.

                                #135048
                                V8Eng
                                Participant
                                  @v8eng

                                  Not model engineering, but this shows that 3D printing is progressing quickly, IMHO.

                                  **LINK**

                                  A couple of other possibly relevant links.

                                  http://3dprintshow.com

                                  http://www.stratasys.com

                                   

                                  Edited By V8Eng on 09/11/2013 17:18:58

                                  #135051
                                  WALLACE
                                  Participant
                                    @wallace

                                    Steel tubing chassis though !

                                    W.

                                    #135055
                                    V8Eng
                                    Participant
                                      @v8eng

                                      At this rate of progress in 3D printing systems, it might pay not to blink in case you miss something.

                                      Edited By V8Eng on 09/11/2013 18:19:57

                                      #135103
                                      John McNamara
                                      Participant
                                        @johnmcnamara74883

                                        Note the UP Mini printer uses 1.7mm filament. compared to the standard 1.75mm. Yep they are at it again! trying to lock users in. Next they will be changing the shape of the filament; hmmm.

                                        Regards
                                        John

                                        #135104
                                        John Stevenson 1
                                        Participant
                                          @johnstevenson1

                                          The UP mini will work with 1.75 or 3mm filament, you just need to change a resistor on the extruder

                                          #135107
                                          John McNamara
                                          Participant
                                            @johnmcnamara74883

                                            Gee John

                                            Spare parts for the UP Mini are not cheap, $1100 USD for the main board. plus $400 for the driver board. A good little earner if the machine goes bung.

                                            **LINK**

                                            Compared to a quick search on the net for an open source kit Some sites list the entire electronics kit for a couple of hundred bucks.

                                            **LINK**

                                            You certainly do have to pay a heavy premium for this machine. given that you can build one up for maybe half that.

                                            I do like the Up Mini frame design. steel and linear bearings, for us do it yourself types not that hard to do and not very expensive given they are so short. The up Mini has a table 140 x 140mm x 135 Z travel.

                                            We should remember that the term "Rep Rap" concept was to make self replicating machines, A noble concept, but not without its flaws. Plastic parts and high precision do not go easily together.

                                            There are a few members of the hacker group I mentioned previously that have built precision machines using linear bearings, the output from these machines is a lot better. than many commercial Rep Rap kit machines.

                                            I guess it is a matter of priorities,

                                            From a project point of view it would be interesting to tackle, maybe laser cut steel and off the shelf bearings.
                                            Has anyone done some Cad drawings of a design? Maybe it could be a collaborative design on this forum. I would be happy to share.

                                            Regards
                                            John

                                            Edited By John McNamara on 10/11/2013 01:52:43

                                            #135124
                                            Stovepipe
                                            Participant
                                              @stovepipe

                                              One wonders whether when these machines "come of age" all those machining skills will be largely rendered obsolete. Will we be giving our lathes away at garage sale prices, with the scrap dealers queuing up to collect them, or will the bottom have fallen out of the scrap metal market ?

                                              Dennis

                                              #135128
                                              Russell Eberhardt
                                              Participant
                                                @russelleberhardt48058
                                                From a project point of view it would be interesting to tackle, maybe laser cut steel and off the shelf bearings.

                                                Has anyone done some Cad drawings of a design? Maybe it could be a collaborative design on this forum. I would be happy to share.

                                                . . . or perhaps use a frame made from aluminium extrusions like this?

                                                I imagine that the biggest challenge for improving print quality/resolution lies in making a decent extruder. Most of the ones I've seen have a 0.5 mm dia nozzle. How are you going to get good resolution with that?

                                                Russell.

                                                #135133
                                                John Stevenson 1
                                                Participant
                                                  @johnstevenson1
                                                  Posted by John McNamara on 10/11/2013 01:44:06:

                                                  Gee John

                                                  Spare parts for the UP Mini are not cheap, $1100 USD for the main board. plus $400 for the driver board. A good little earner if the machine goes bung.

                                                  **LINK**

                                                  Compared to a quick search on the net for an open source kit Some sites list the entire electronics kit for a couple of hundred bucks.

                                                  **LINK**

                                                  You certainly do have to pay a heavy premium for this machine. given that you can build one up for maybe half that.

                                                  Problem is you are then back to the open source software which just doesn't cut it.

                                                  Secret on the UP printers is their software at the moment is far advanced of all the cheap options.

                                                  Didn't know about board prices but dare say there will be people willing to repair them.

                                                  #135134
                                                  John McNamara
                                                  Participant
                                                    @johnmcnamara74883

                                                    Hi Russel yes .5 or .3 is near the bottom limit is the rub, literally. The nozzle rubs itself along the work as it spreads a thin line of hot melted plastic, and every time it turns a corner the line tends to loose control with a tiny but visible glitch.

                                                    That is why we are not likely see great improvement with this mechanical spreading method, the result is always going to be grainy. (Often exacerbated by backlash in many of the machines I have seen working)  creating a strong case for linear slides and eliminating backslash errors.

                                                    there are other photo methods using UV cured resins etc. Often used by commercial machine builders, they have better resolution. Not easy to DIY build and the materials are difficult to get.

                                                    Inkjet of a solvent on a constantly respread powder layer is also used commercially. I have seen DIY experiments using this method

                                                    John the open source software mob will improve their work in time, competition is a wonderful printer driver!

                                                    Regards
                                                    John

                                                    Edited By John McNamara on 10/11/2013 11:36:51

                                                    #135137
                                                    Gordon W
                                                    Participant
                                                      @gordonw

                                                      Fascinating stuff to an old Ludite ! How about using VHV and magnets to control the deposits ,something like the old cathode ray tube. Would that work?

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