20 degrees vs 14.5 degrees pressure angle for gears

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20 degrees vs 14.5 degrees pressure angle for gears

Home Forums Traction engines 20 degrees vs 14.5 degrees pressure angle for gears

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  • #441210
    Stephen Meredith
    Participant
      @stephenmeredith48159

      Initially had trouble with the photo, finally found a way to post it the dimension I'm struggling with is the one marked in red, is this meant to be 1 – 7/8" not just 7/8" I know the drawing is to scale and it certainly bigger than 7/8" .

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      #485545
      Stephen Meredith
      Participant
        @stephenmeredith48159

        A question about your gears, did you use the cast blanks produced by Bridport for your 2nd motion gears?

        #485596
        Martin Rock-Evans
        Participant
          @martinrock-evans77799

          Stephen, yes, I used the full set of castings from Bridport for the drive gear chain.

          #488805
          Stephen Meredith
          Participant
            @stephenmeredith48159

            Hello again is there a reason the 2nd motion shaft fast gear has such a large boss. The drawing says 1-1/4" was wondering up the key caused problems and its been sized up from when my drawings were produced.

            Any help greatly appreciated

            20200802_111803_resized.jpg

            #492966
            Martin Rock-Evans
            Participant
              @martinrock-evans77799

              Stephen, I'm not sure if this will help now as it's been best part of a month, but when I made the gears, I pretty much just followed the drawings. There's plenty of space for the large boss (you can just about make it out in the photos below).

              The only thing I remember not being quite right on the drawings was that the dimension for the shoulder on the small gear didn't match up with the bore of the large gear, so I just ensured that they matched so that when the larger gear was bolted to the smaller one, it would fit on the shoulder and ensure that the gears are concentric.

              2020-08-27 14.46.04.jpg

              2020-08-27 14.47.24.jpg

              #493113
              Alan Wood 4
              Participant
                @alanwood4

                Fusion 360 has an inbuilt script that allows gears to be modelled for direct CNC or 3D print.

                See Kevin Kennedy's YouTube site on the link below. His site also has a lot of Fusion tutorial content.

                **LINK**

                #501173
                Stephen Meredith
                Participant
                  @stephenmeredith48159

                  Hello, just a final question in the gears with Keyways. Final pinion, slow gear etc.

                  What size would you use have you gone with the drawing say 3/16" x 5/32" but this doesn't sound like a square key?

                  Did you stick with imperial or swap to a metric size, and possibly square key cutting to half the key depth?

                  Any help I'm confused.. Stephen

                  #624795
                  Stephen Meredith
                  Participant
                    @stephenmeredith48159
                    Posted by Martin Rock-Evans on 29/09/2019 17:51:37:

                    Hi Stephen, I went for the specified 20 deg PA in the end. Steve Holder at sales@homeandworkshop.co.uk was able to supply the cutters I needed second hand at a reasonable price.

                    Here are some of the resulting gears:20190521_101833.jpg

                    2019-09-02 10.56.07.jpgHi Stephen, I went for the specified 20 deg PA in the end. Steve Holder at sales@homeandworkshop.co.uk was able to supply the cutters I needed second hand at a reasonable price. Here are some of the resulting gears:2019-07-14 19.31.31.jpg20190521_101833.jpg

                    Hello, hope you are well, can I ask the differential pinion gears, are these cast gears or have they been machined? I'm interested if they are also 10DP like the other gears as the drawings are not clear in the explanation. And also the 2 larger side gears bossed one and the no boss gear.

                    #624817
                    Les Riley
                    Participant
                      @lesriley75593

                      They look like cast gears.

                      If they were machined by the method in Ivan Law's book, they would be a different DP to similar scale spur gears.

                      There is a formula to work out which DP to use and which cutter number. It doesn't follow normal gear rules.

                      I have a spreadsheet that will do the maths and give the proper cutters and blank sizes.

                      Les

                      #624822
                      Martin Rock-Evans
                      Participant
                        @martinrock-evans77799

                        The bevel gears in the my traction engine from https://www.plastowtractionengines.co.uk/ are as-cast. I believe you can buy a fully machined set, but the cast gears work adequately well.

                        The main gear Pinion are machined cast iron blanks.

                        Edited By Martin Rock-Evans on 13/12/2022 16:00:48

                        #624828
                        Martin Rock-Evans
                        Participant
                          @martinrock-evans77799

                          These are the 3 gears that are part of the differential (OK, there are 2 pinions). They all have as-cast teath, and then the bosses/holes are machined as appropriate.20221213_162109.jpg20221213_162038.jpg20221213_162134.jpg

                          #624860
                          old mart
                          Participant
                            @oldmart

                            In motorcycle gearboxes and any other with trains of different size gears, the numbers of teeth in each pair add up to the same combined count. There is, however an allowance of one tooth which must be because the manufacturers can add or subtract a small ammount and still get good meshing at the same shaft centres.

                            #624894
                            Nigel McBurney 1
                            Participant
                              @nigelmcburney1

                              i would make a TE axle from en 8 and then machine all over to obtain a better degree of straightness ,roundness and finish, I buy my steel in 3metre lengths from well known commercial suppliers and defects in the material can still occurr.why cut corners when building a model.

                              #625395
                              Stephen Meredith
                              Participant
                                @stephenmeredith48159

                                Thankyou all for the replies and great photo's.

                                Can I ask, do you know what cutter should be used for the large diff main gear Pinion's? I have the book and will do the maths, but so I can check I'm on the right lines with the workings out, before I commit to buying another cutter in error.

                                Thanks in advance.

                                (I've got the full set of 10DF cutters now lol – nice to have, and hardly used sharp ones).

                                Stephen.

                                #625401
                                Anonymous
                                  Posted by Stephen Meredith on 19/12/2022 12:19:47:

                                  …what cutter should be used for the large diff main gear Pinion's

                                  Do you mean the bevel gear pinions?

                                  Andrew

                                  #625405
                                  Stephen Meredith
                                  Participant
                                    @stephenmeredith48159

                                    Hello, sorry yes the bevel gears. The 46 Teeth ones.

                                    #625418
                                    Anonymous

                                      It's not as simple as simply choosing the correct cutter. It is not possible to cut proper straight tooth bevel gears using involute cutters. However, there are two approximate methods.

                                      Straight tooth bevel gears are normally designed using the diametrical pitch on the outer edge. An approximation to the tooth form is created in three passes, one normal pass and a two passes offset slightly in either direction. The involute cutter will correctly form the curve on the outer end, but the curve at the inner end is incorrect. This can be corrected with a file, or by running in with a mating gear. For a straight tooth bevel gear the equivalent number of teeth, used to select the cutter number, is the actual number of teeth divided by the cosine of the pitch cone angle. This tends to make the teeth shape more rack like. The problem with this method is that the involute cutter needs to have the correct form for the selected DP, but needs to be narrower than standard so it will pass through the small end. Cutters of this type used to be available commercially, but are now obsolete and pretty much impossible to source.

                                      The alternative method, getting around the problem of a special cutter, is the parallel depth method. This still requires three passes of the cutter, but the gear is designed using the diametrical pitch at the inner edge of the gear. So a standard involute cutter can be used. The problem with this method, for an existing application, is that the diametrical pitch at the outer edge is unlikely to be a standard value. In which case the gears will not fit without a lot of faffing about with DP and tooth counts. Even then some changes to the design will be needed.

                                      Andrew

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