Fitting collets to a horizontal mill?

Advert

Fitting collets to a horizontal mill?

Home Forums Beginners questions Fitting collets to a horizontal mill?

Viewing 12 posts - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #8244
    choochoo_baloo
    Participant
      @choochoo_baloo
      Advert
      #250401
      choochoo_baloo
      Participant
        @choochoo_baloo

        I have just bought a horizontal milling machine – Flexispeed Mk 2 – and while waiting for it to be delivered my thoughts have turned to how to fit collets into the main spindle, after removing the arbor, to use drills, end mills etc

        The entry here http://www.lathes.co.uk/flexispeedmiller/index.html states that:

        "With a No. 2 Morse taper nose, the spindle ran in split, parallel, adjustable phosphor bronze bearing"

        Being completely new to mills I am hoping for a concise introduction to the options available for a collet system that is compatible with such a spindle.

        I have the 2MT Myford collets and locking ring set for my Myford ML7 – is there a way to utilise these in the mill or do I need a new system e.g. R8, ER 25…. (NB I don't understand what those two collet system names mean!!)

        Any help gratefully received.

        #250404
        MadMike
        Participant
          @madmike

          If you use ER25 collets then you will need to purchase and fit an ER25 collet chuck into which you can then fit the cutters. Alternatively you can simply get some MT2 (Morse Taper number 2) collets and fit them direct into the spindle and then simply fit the end mills/slot drill straight into it.

          #250406
          Roderick Jenkins
          Participant
            @roderickjenkins93242

            Hi,

            I think you are going to find that you will be severely restricted in the amount of room you will have in the Y direction. Your best bet for holding milling cutters will be finger collets (such as these) held in the 2 MT socket with a draw bar. You will probably only want 1/4 and 3/8" on this little machine. For drilling I would try a 1/4" chuck on a 2MT arbor – again it will be difficult to fit the drill and chuck in the space between the job and the spindle nose. This picture demonstrates how much room even a 1/4" chuck and jobber drill takes up:

            headroom

            R8 describes the taper, it's an alternative to Morse tapers in the machine spindle, so not relevant. An ER25 collet chuck would be a good choice with 2MT arbor but the chuck itself will take up much of the available space, hence the recommendation for finger collets which mostly sit within the spindle taper. An ER 16 collet set would take up less room than ER25 and would give you the option to hold drills as well, so might be worth consideration.

            HTH,

            Rod

            #250422
            not done it yet
            Participant
              @notdoneityet

              Presumably for vertical milling? Does it have a drawbar? If not it is only useful for drilling as any side thrust forces (particularly intermittent) would loosen the tooling, with potentially disastrous results.

              Only guesing, but he horizontal arbor appears to be held in place by the support centre and not by a dra

              wbar. S

              o unless the shaft(s) can be bored/arranged for a drawbar, it is only a horizontal mill with drilling head. Good piece of kit for small jobs, mind. I like old iron.

              Probably not so worn due to its restrictive use, I would think. Horizontal mills are not so popular as vertical ones because they will not carry out such a range of duties, but they are certainly better, by far, for those they were designed for – think here flatting a surface (for squaring up a block?), where each pass is always flat to the previ

              ous, provided the table and cutter are parallel (vertical mills need to be perfect in all three directions).

              #250448
              Bazyle
              Participant
                @bazyle

                It seems some people don't fully understand the word "horizontal".

                First decide what cutters you are going to use. If screw shank Clarkson you might find an M2 Posilock or clone collet chuck designed for them. If you are using plain shank (or those with a flat) you can start with a MT2 collet for the appropriate size. These have a a small risk of slipping so take care.

                Then you can get a blank MT2 arbor and bore for a cutter and holding screw. These are available ready made too.

                You only need to get one or two to start with so very cheap starting point while you find out a bit more. I wouldn't jump into ER collets until you have tried the whole machine a bit to find out how you find yourself using it. A collet chuck will extend the overhand and it is a bit small and weak for too much of that.

                #250734
                choochoo_baloo
                Participant
                  @choochoo_baloo
                  Posted by Roderick Jenkins on 12/08/2016 00:18:54:

                  our best bet for holding milling cutters will be finger collets (such as these) held in the 2 MT socket with a draw bar. You will probably only want 1/4 and 3/8" on this little machine.

                  Below is an image of the Myford patent collets I referred to in my original post. As they are 2MT, to save some money for the time being, couldn't they be used on the mill using a drawbar (they're female threaded at the end) since the mandrel nose thread obviously won't be on the mill socket.

                  I've read elsewhere that these Myford collets have a tenancy to slip when used for milling, yet these pages – from Ian Bradley's well known "Myford Series 7 Manual" – so that these collets can be sued for milling cutters as well as round stock holding?

                  I agree that some a few finger collets, with their minimum overhang, is probably the best way to proceed. Most work would be done with the horizontal arbor anyway. I asked the question from the time when I need to precise drill etc, by erecting the work on a 90 deg angle plate to face the spindle.

                  collet

                  #250735
                  choochoo_baloo
                  Participant
                    @choochoo_baloo

                    Thanks all for the help so far.

                    #250738
                    Roderick Jenkins
                    Participant
                      @roderickjenkins93242

                      I'm a big fan of the Myford collets for workholding in the lathe and in the dividing head on the mill. My Sharp MkII mill, pictured in my post above, actually has a nose threaded for the Myford collets but I did have a 1/2" milling cutter come loose and destroy the collet (which was expensive) so I prefer using an ER25 collet chuck for both milling and drilling. However, if headroom becomes a real issue I will use the Myford collets for milling but I am very careful to make sure the closing collar is really tight.

                      The Sharp mill is convertible to horizontal mode and, as I think I've mentioned in a previous post, I did use it in this mode with an end mill in the horizontal spindle when making my hardness tester – it's a useful function.

                      Cheers,

                      Rod

                      p.s – the Myford collets are NOT threaded, they are retained by the groove at the outboard end, which fits in the screwed collar with the aid of a separate closing tube and ejector.

                      Edited By Roderick Jenkins on 14/08/2016 15:32:32

                      #250746
                      duncan webster 1
                      Participant
                        @duncanwebster1

                        If you're tempted to use split morse collets which are pulled in by the drawbar, don't overtighten them or you will have the devil of a job getting them out again. The Myford type are pulled out by the closing nut. If you've got a self ejecting drawbar you might be OK, but otherwise it's hammer on the end of the drawbar.

                        as other have said, you'll find that there isn't a lot of room to use a horizontal as a pseudo vertical

                        #250751
                        bricky
                        Participant
                          @bricky

                          I have a small horizontal mill and use 2mt drawbar collets and as others have sugested there is not room to use dills in the collets.

                          Frank

                          #251379
                          Howard Lewis
                          Participant
                            @howardlewis46836

                            Here is my four penn'orth, for what its worth.

                            If space is limited, in either Horizontal or Vertical mode, 2MT Finger Collets will maximise tool/workpiece space.

                            To release them, you will need to bash the end of the drawbar, once it has been slackened by about half a turn.(Unless you can make up some form of "pusher" for the drawabar, to spare the spindle bearings).

                            Finger collets for 2MT will go upto about 12mm, but are "one size" only, whether Imperial or Metric. Trying to use for other than the stated size will damage them. An ER collet chuck will take up space, but the collets will accept upto a 1mm variation in size, so can accomodate Metric or Imperial cutters, (or work in the lathe). ER20 goes up to 13mm, ER25 to 16mm, and ER32 (probably too big for your intended use) 20mm.

                            They may be expensive, but grip well, and run truer than a drill chuck.

                            Don't use helical endmills in a drill chuck. The Drill Chuck does not have as much grip as a collet (little more than line contact vs all round in a collet), and the helix will be trying to screw the cutter out of the drill chuck. You may get lucky, but one day, the cutter WILL move out, and mess up things!

                            H T H

                            Howard

                          Viewing 12 posts - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)
                          • Please log in to reply to this topic. Registering is free and easy using the links on the menu at the top of this page.

                          Advert

                          Latest Replies

                          Home Forums Beginners questions Topics

                          Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)
                          Viewing 25 topics - 1 through 25 (of 25 total)

                          View full reply list.

                          Advert

                          Newsletter Sign-up