High rpm face mills

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High rpm face mills

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  • #769839
    colinb
    Participant
      @colinb

      Hoping for a bit of advice. I’m tooling up for a new-to-me Alexander Master Toolmaker (= Deckel FP1). I will have the luxury of the high speed vertical head, but won’t have the regular vertical head. In a vertical setup then, my slowest rpm is 1900.

      Where does this leave me in terms of viable/reasonable facemills and flycutters for surfacing parts? All the feeds/speeds calculators seem to indicate that, for example, a 100mm diameter indexable facemill with 45° lead angle needs to go much slower than this head can manage. Am I really limited to approx 50mm inserted cutters with 1mm DoC?

      I completely understand I could use the horizontal spindle to access the slower speeds, but I’d like to try to understand where the theoretical limits of this vertical setup lie.

       

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      #769845
      SillyOldDuffer
      Moderator
        @sillyoldduffer

        I think Colin will have to experiment.  Online calculators and books all recommend maximum economic industrial cutting rates, which are generally generally faster and deeper than a hobby workshop is capable of.   So our experience is more of dialling back than going much faster.   I guess experience of Colin’s too-fast problem will be thin on the ground!

        HSS is probably out, but carbide and the right material might work well enough.  In ordinary machining, free-cutting metals do well because less energy is needed to cut them and they resist tearing, resulting in a good finish.   When I ran a fly-cutter too fast on free cutting steel the finish went to pot, I think because the metal tore rather than cut.   With carbide a deeper cut often fixes tearing, provided the machine has the necessary power, torque and rigidity, which mine doesn’t.   A high-speed head might do better with a more difficult metal, one tough enough to resist tearing at high speed.  Dunno.

        High-speed heads are for spinning small diameter cutters doing delicate work.  Most desirable I reckon, but a specialist tool that will struggle with face cutting and any other general purpose milling for which slower speeds are needed.  (Usually much slower than 1900rpm!  My mill gets down to about 150rpm, and that’s too fast for some jobs.)

        Feels like a lot of pratting around.   Like taking a Formula 1 car to Tescos, could be done, but more trouble than it’s worth.  My gut feel is the best answer is to find a slower head for rough work, and get the high-speed one out only when needed.  Sorry!

        Dave

         

         

        #769849
        John Haine
        Participant
          @johnhaine32865

          I don’t know what motor drives your mill but a 3 phase type with a VFD with flux vector control would allow it to run with full torque at low speed, though a separate cooling fan on the motor may be needed.

          Or you could convert to CNC so the control will take the tedium out of long facing cuts using a smaller cutter!

          #769850
          JasonB
          Moderator
            @jasonb

            No need to experiment I have done it for you ramp it up rather than dial it back.

            63mm insert face mill with inserts intended for non-Ferroius will spin happily at 2000rpm on all the common model engineering metals. So if you come down to a 50mm head then you could run at 2500rpm for iron and steel and if you have more available then use it on non ferrious. Go for a 5 insert rather than a 4 insert then you can feed a bit faster for the same given chip load.

            See the copies of my MEW articles here and here.

            You can also wind it up with solid cutters too.

            An insert lathe tool in a flycutter will also run at similar speeds but you need to have it well blanced, downside is your feed rates will be slow a sit only cuts once per revolution

            I’ve run the 80mm at 5000rpm on the CNC so not sure where Dave gets his idea high speeds are only for small solid cutters, I’d be running them at a lot more if I did not max out at 5000rpm.

            All at 2000rpm with a 50mm dia head, feeds upto 400mm/min

            Photo 55

            #769864
            mark smith 20
            Participant
              @marksmith20

              Is the high speed head capable of handling  large diameter cutters,  i assume it probably is ok with a 63 mm facemill but not sure. Unfortunately my Alexander didnt come with the high speed head . Heres the manual page for it.Page 022

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